Online junk food ban = chocolate business over?

[Newchodge]

Your mentality is baffling to me. Imagine going into Willy Wonka's chocolate factory and everything is just brown, drab, and lifeless. This is the trajectory you seem to see no issue with. I'm afraid if this isn't something you instinctively know is a problem, I won't be able to explain it to you.

As your mentality baffles me. The aim is to reduce the amount of unhealthy foods eaten (by adults as well as children). If everything at Willy Wonka's chocolate factory is brown, drab and lifeless people will be less interested in the product. That is what you imply and I agree with you wholeheartedly. And that is the point. The result would be people eating less of it. Result!

 

[NickGrogan]

There's a biscuit factory, they sell broken biscuits in plain plastic bags, no fancy packaging.

They sell very well.

Packaging and advertising aren't the issue; people's attitudes are.

If you really think that these foods are bad and the root of all problems, why not campaign to ban them completely?

 

[Newchodge]

There's a biscuit factory, they sell broken biscuits in plain plastic bags, no fancy packaging.

They sell very well.

Packaging and advertising aren't the issue; people's attitudes are.

If you really think that these foods are bad and the root of all problems, why not campaign to ban them completely?

In the same way that I would not6 ban cigarette smoking (and, actually, would de-criminalise drug use). Choice. But marketing has an effect on people's choice. That is why I would ban marketing.

 

[NickGrogan]

Did I say there's no illegal content on Google?

If the government want to push this through and ENFORCE it, they will fine Google to a point that they will make changes to the ad policy. As said they have done this countless times in the past.

That's Google sorted - fine them into oblivion, but what about every other website?

Unlimited fines for everyone who has a website with ads on it?

 

[NickGrogan]

In the same way that I would not6 ban cigarette smoking (and, actually, would de-criminalise drug use). Choice. But marketing has an effect on people's choice. That is why I would ban marketing.

So, Crack is OK, but sugar is not?

Strange how there are no ads for cocaine, but it is still popular.

 

[Newchodge]

So, Crack is OK, but sugar is not?

Strange how there are no ads for cocaine, but it is still popular.

There is nothing wrong with sugar per se, it is the way that people consume it that is the issue. The same as cocaine. Which is your argument as well.

 

[NickGrogan]

There is nothing wrong with sugar per se, it is the way that people consume it that is the issue. The same as cocaine. Which is your argument as well.

There is a lot wrong with sugar, it serves no real purpose.

 

[AlanJ1]

That's Google sorted - fine them into oblivion, but what about every other website?

Unlimited fines for everyone who has a website with ads on it?

The same gets done for Facebook ads, Bing ads etc etc.

It's not the websites with ads getting the fines, it's the ad platforms themselves who then stop the ads being allowed to be displayed.

 

[fisicx]

There is a lot wrong with sugar, it serves no real purpose.

It makes the plantation owners very rich.

 

[Newchodge]

There is a lot wrong with sugar, it serves no real purpose.

There is a lot wrong with chocolate. It serves no real purpose. You really are using a stupid argument.

 

[Ziggy2024]

There is a lot wrong with sugar, it serves no real purpose.

As someone who suffers regularly because of low blood sugar I would strongly disagree that it serves no real purpose!

 

[NickGrogan]

The same gets done for Facebook ads, Bing ads etc etc.

It's not the websites with ads getting the fines, it's the ad platforms themselves who then stop the ads being allowed to be displayed.

Ok, so I can put ads on my sites and not get fined as it's not a platform?

 

[NickGrogan]

As someone who suffers regularly because of low blood sugar I would strongly disagree that it serves no real purpose!

recommended foods for low blood sugar are fruits - grapes, bananas that kind of thing. Not sugar. Pure sugar tends to produce too much of a spike.

 

[NickGrogan]

There is a lot wrong with chocolate. It serves no real purpose. You really are using a stupid argument.

Would there be less obese people if there was no chocolate and a big reduction on sugar consumption?

You are in favour of banning ads, to reduce demand, but don't want to reduce supply?

 

[AlanJ1]

Ok, so I can put ads on my sites and not get fined as it's not a platform?

You know exactly what you are doing with this post but I will bite and give you an answer.

If they ban it, then legally no you can't. But they most likely won't look at smaller companies and go after 99% of the market for ads with the larger ones.

 

[Paul FilmMaker]

I'm in video production and film for one of the UK's top brands which also happens to have a majority of its products in the HFSS range. We even filmed the press release for them a few years back when the last govt announced it was going to put in place HFSS restrictions... and then didn't.

There are a few things we've seen them do. Firstly, launch a slew of new products to comply with the new regulations.

Secondly, we're seeing smaller firms gear up to test the breadth of the law. So have alternative products advertised to drive consumers to their website and then show the real deal. Or show the results of the product, not the product itself because there doesn't seem to be a ban on this element.

I think you're in a great position because retailers will be hit even harder!

 

[japancool]

Lots of food and drink serve no purpose. Alcohol does immeasurable harm to both people and society.

Ban it.

The UK ranks 86th in the world for child obesity, but ask yourself why Germany, Sweden, France, Belgium, Japan, Austria etc. etc. are all better off than we are without having to resort to blanket bans, on the internet or otherwise?

Could it maybe be something to do with the fact that the UK has such high income inequality that a significant proportion of the country has to buy cheap, unhealthy foods because they can't afford anything else? Or is it to do with the fact that there is nowhere for children to do physical activities anymore, what with playing fields being sold off, youth centres being closed and public facilities being shut down? Or parents lacking both the time and education to actually cook for their children because they're both working to simply keep a roof over their heads?

Instead of trying to legislate away the symptoms, fix the goddamn problems that are the root cause.

I showed my Japanese friend a picture of a typical school lunch, and his first reaction was "WTF is that?".

Or go back to rationing. The country was a lot healthier during the war.

 

[NickGrogan]

Nah, that would mean making people responsible for their actions, can't have that, don't be silly.

Ban ads, but not really and legalise drugs well. That should sort everything out.

As long as governments and people are happy to lie to themselves and come up with excuses like its too expensive or I can't cook, nothing much is going to change.

 

[Austin VT]

Lots of food and drink serve no purpose. Alcohol does immeasurable harm to both people and society.

Ban it.

The UK ranks 86th in the world for child obesity, but ask yourself why Germany, Sweden, France, Belgium, Japan, Austria etc. etc. are all better off than we are without having to resort to blanket bans, on the internet or otherwise?

Could it maybe be something to do with the fact that the UK has such high income inequality that a significant proportion of the country has to buy cheap, unhealthy foods because they can't afford anything else? Or is it to do with the fact that there is nowhere for children to do physical activities anymore, what with playing fields being sold off, youth centres being closed and public facilities being shut down? Or parents lacking both the time and education to actually cook for their children because they're both working to simply keep a roof over their heads?

Instead of trying to legislate away the symptoms, fix the goddamn problems that are the root cause.

I showed my Japanese friend a picture of a typical school lunch, and his first reaction was "WTF is that?".

Or go back to rationing. The country was a lot healthier during the war.

Again with this nonsense that just absolves people of personal responsibility. Basic essentials such as lentils, chickpeas, oats and so forth are not more expensive than frozen pizzas and chips. If you're going to have kids, you need to make time available to spend 15 minutes whipping up a basic but relatively health meal for them.

When I was growing up kids still went outside to play. You don't need 'youth centres'.. who the hell goes to a youth centre? You just go outside and find stuff to do. Due to a behavioural shift, kids just sit around inside on their phones, computers, or consoles.

The problem with the UK is just this culture of whining and blaming others for your own failings.

 

[NickGrogan]

Basic essentials such as lentils, chickpeas, oats

Not coming to your house for dinner

 

[fisicx]

Again with this nonsense that just absolves people of personal responsibility. Basic essentials such as lentils, chickpeas, oats and so forth are not more expensive than frozen pizzas and chips. If you're going to have kids, you need to make time available to spend 15 minutes whipping up a basic but relatively health meal for them.

Except it doesn't happen. Not when Iceland was selling spag bol for £1. Or when McDonalds promote a 99p burger.

A school started doing healthy meals. The parents complained because their rugrats couldn't get pizza and chips for lunch. And I read of one school where a burger van parked outside the gates and did a roaring trade.

My niece doesn't cook. It's all ready meals for her 3 sprogs.

 

[Mark T Jones]

This thread has definitely morphed from business to Time Out - from actions around a proposed ban to a theoretical debate about responsibilities and ideal worlds.

 

[Ziggy2024]

recommended foods for low blood sugar are fruits - grapes, bananas that kind of thing. Not sugar. Pure sugar tends to produce too much of a spike.

No, when you are about to collapse you need sugar in it's purest form. A glass of water with sugar in it was always my go to if you couldn't get lucozade. You said it serves no purpose, without it I wouldn't be here so I'd strongly disagree!

Just to reiterate that this is my personal experience. Please don't tell me "recommendations", see the reality of the situation for me and many others.

 

[NickGrogan]

This thread has definitely morphed from business to Time Out - from actions around a proposed ban to a theoretical debate about responsibilities and ideal worlds.

happens to all threads eventually.

 

[NickGrogan]

No, when you are about to collapse you need sugar in it's purest form. A glass of water with sugar in it was always my go to if you couldn't get lucozade. You said it serves no purpose, without it I wouldn't be here so I'd strongly disagree!

Just to reiterate that this is my personal experience. Please don't tell me "recommendations", see the reality of the situation for me and many others.

Okay, it has limited medical uses for certain people, in the same way that Morphine does. However, that doesn't mean people should eat and drink lots of it.

 

[NickGrogan]

Except it doesn't happen. Not when Iceland was selling spag bol for £1. Or when McDonalds promote a 99p burger.

A school started doing healthy meals. The parents complained because their rugrats couldn't get pizza and chips for lunch. And I read of one school where a burger van parked outside the gates and did a roaring trade.

My niece doesn't cook. It's all ready meals for her 3 sprogs.

All of these are cultural issues and should be addressed as such.

 

[Newchodge]

All of these are cultural issues and should be addressed as such.

How, exactly?

 

[japancool]

How, exactly?

How are they cultural issues, or how to address them as such?

 

[Newchodge]

How are they cultural issues, or how to address them as such?

How to address them a such.

 

[japancool]

No, when you are about to collapse you need sugar in it's purest form. A glass of water with sugar in it was always my go to if you couldn't get lucozade. You said it serves no purpose, without it I wouldn't be here so I'd strongly disagree!

Just to reiterate that this is my personal experience. Please don't tell me "recommendations", see the reality of the situation for me and many others.

Indeed. Fruit pastilles are what I use. 3-4 of them are enough to recover my blood sugar by about 2 points (which should tell you how much sugar is in them).

So that non-diabetics understand, you need simple carbs to get your sugar up quickly to a safe level, and *then* you can have your complex carbs to maintain it. By the time your symptoms start, you might have literally minutes to get your sugar up, you can't wait for your body to digest and absorb the sugar in fruit. And it's different for all of us. What works for one person might not work for someone else, so please don't tell us "it works for my nan, so you should try it".

 

[japancool]

How to address them a such.

Well, that's a more complex question.

Where I come from, most people know how to cook. They learnt it off their mums or dads, and a parent - yes, most often the mums - would cook. It takes time to cook properly. Put raw ingredients in front of many families here, and most wouldn't know what to do with them to make a nutritious and TASTY and balanced meal. It takes time to cook properly, and most people don't have time.

I could cite examples of how it works in Japan, which is also an island nation that imports its food and has less than half the level of obesity that we do here, but I won't, since they already have a cultural predilection for healthier, high quality foods. Instead, how does it work in Germany and France? Why do their children have considerably lower rates of obesity than we do, despite having no ban on advertising sweets? (I don't actually know the answer to that)

And I'll bet their children don't subsist on a diet of lentils and oats.

Short answer to the question though - I don't know, but it involves changing the food culture of the country, and the best place to start is in school. Do they still teach Home Ec in schools these days?

Btw, anyone know what happened to all that cheaper food we were supposed to get after Brexit?

 

[NickGrogan]

Well, that's a more complex question.

Where I come from, most people know how to cook. They learnt it off their mums or dads, and a parent - yes, most often the mums - would cook. It takes time to cook properly. Put raw ingredients in front of many families here, and most wouldn't know what to do with them to make a nutritious and TASTY and balanced meal. It takes time to cook properly, and most people don't have time.

People have time, they just prefer to spend in on other things.

What are the viewing figures for Eastenders, Coronation Street, Strictly X factor or whatever people watch today?
How many people watched the Olympics, whatever the latest football thing was, etc?
How many hours do people spend on YouTube, Facebook, TikTok, and UKBF?

 

[NickGrogan]

How to address them a such.

Behavioural Economics

Change the perception of what is acceptable and what is not.

It worked for seatbelts, drunk driving and, to a lesser extent, smoking.

It's also one of the things that has made A&E a rolling disaster zone

 

[MarketingQuote]

It may be worth sitting back and seeing what the big boys like Mars do, since they face the same challenge with much more to loose.

 

[Newchodge]

Behavioural Economics

Change the perception of what is acceptable and what is not.

It worked for seatbelts, drunk driving and, to a lesser extent, smoking.

It's also one of the things that has made A&E a rolling disaster zone

Doesn't restricting advertising fall under that heading?

 

[japancool]

People have time, they just prefer to spend in on other things.

What are the viewing figures for Eastenders, Coronation Street, Strictly X factor or whatever people watch today?
How many people watched the Olympics, whatever the latest football thing was, etc?
How many hours do people spend on YouTube, Facebook, TikTok, and UKBF?

It's not just having the time, but knowing what to do as well. Hell, some people in this country don't know how to cook rice (even if they were inclined to do so, I dunno, maybe they don't like fancy foreign food). It's literally one step more difficult than boiling water. Rice+water+saucepan = done, none of this nonsense about colanders and straining.

Or as Uncle Roger would say, "Where your rice cooker?".

Give someone an egg, some would have difficulty boiling it, never mind making an omelette.

 

[Newchodge]

It's not just having the time, but knowing what to do as well. Hell, some people in this country don't know how to cook rice (even if they were inclined to do so, I dunno, maybe they don't like fancy foreign food). It's literally one step more difficult than boiling water. Rice+water+saucepan = done, none of this nonsense about colanders and straining.

Or as Uncle Roger would say, "Where your rice cooker?".

Give someone an egg, some would have difficulty boiling it, never mind making an omelette.

It is not just time and ability. You also need equipment. If you come from a household where very little was cooked, you may not have the pots and pans, knives, rice cookers, etc.

 

[NickGrogan]

Doesn't restricting advertising fall under that heading?

The bluntest tool in the box, but yes.

 

[NickGrogan]

It is not just time and ability. You also need equipment. If you come from a household where very little was cooked, you may not have the pots and pans, knives, rice cookers, etc.

one pan, one knife, one wooden spoon. Its not a lot.

 

[NickGrogan]

It's not just having the time, but knowing what to do as well. Hell, some people in this country don't know how to cook rice (even if they were inclined to do so, I dunno, maybe they don't like fancy foreign food). It's literally one step more difficult than boiling water. Rice+water+saucepan = done, none of this nonsense about colanders and straining.

Or as Uncle Roger would say, "Where your rice cooker?".

Give someone an egg, some would have difficulty boiling it, never mind making an omelette.

Emotional Damage