Holidays not taken due to covid

[HFE Signs]

Hello Friends,

I’m wondering what people are doing with regards to holidays that haven’t (or won’t be) used up by the end of the year due to COVID.

Staff that have been on furlough haven’t used many at all and those that have been working through also haven’t used many. Generally we don’t allow people to carry them over - if next year is a bumper year, it would be difficult if everyone has many more holidays. Cash is tight right now so paying them all wouldn’t be a good option either.

I’m thinking to allow a carry over 50% next year and 50% 2022

I’d like to hear what you guys are doing?

 

[Shaun Kelly]

I Know the company I used to work for paid all holidays accumulated through how long people were furloughed (furlough for 50% use 50% of holidays) for and paid there holidays at 80% using furlough scheme

 

[Newchodge]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...xed-to-support-key-industries-during-covid-19

These are the rules.

 

[antropy]

It depends how many days they have left? If they have say 5 days left then I would say they need to use those in the first part of 2021so there isn't a big backlog in terms of holiday with your staff. Alex

 

[ADW]

Was there also not a rule where you were able to ask employees to take holiday entitlement whilst on furlough?

 

[James_RawlinsInsurance]

My company is allowing 25% to be carried over.

 

[Newchodge]

Was there also not a rule where you were able to ask employees to take holiday entitlement whilst on furlough?

There is, and always has been (at least sinece the Working Time Regulations came into being) a rule that an employer may require an employee to take holiday on a specified date, as long as notice that equates to twice the amount of holiday to be taken is given before the first date of the holiday. That notice can be given during furlough. Holioday has to be paid at 100% of holiday pay entitlement. 80% of that payment can be claimed from the furlough scheme. And, speaking from experience, it is a bugger to calculate for payroll providers!

 

[Newchodge]

My company is allowing 25% to be carried over.

25% of what?

 

[antropy]

25% of what?

Of the holiday you are entitled to I would imagine? Alex

 

[BreezSteez]

My job allows a carry over. Companies may want to consider a covid clause such as this to help employees.

 

[Mr D]

Officially can carry over just 5 days at my work.

Some of the staff have 50 days accumulated, quite a lot have over 20 days carried forward to the next leave year.

Between covering those who are required to shield, those isolating for the required time every time, international travel and those off sick.... Can be hard for some people to get time off.

 

[BreezSteez]

Ok I see. We have another program whereby people can give away their sick time to those in need.

 

[Mr D]

Ok I see. We have another program whereby people can give away their sick time to those in need.

Give it away?
All my employers in the past did not have sick leave allocation. Mostly if you were sick you got sick pay. The generous ones paid full pay then half pay for periods of time.
Others simply let you get SSP from day 4, no pay for first 3 days of sickness. Losing 200 - 300 quid in first week of sickness caused people to be half dead before they rang in sick.

 

[Ian J]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...xed-to-support-key-industries-during-covid-19

These are the rules.

I think that the Government forgot to tell the ley worker industries of these rules.

My wife is a nurse in a large hospital and she was told that she couldn't carry over any holiday entitlement and that she had to take all seven weeks or lose them

 

[Talay]

I think it is clear that the sensible way is to have staff take holidays when on furlough and then top up their wages if not already paying the extra 20%.

Unless you can cope with huge holiday overhangs and cope without giving others overtime, then it is by far the most cost effective solution.

 

[Emre Eldar]

I talks to some people asking about this, it depends on the company. Some allows to carry forward the leave to next year only 5 days, some can carry all but not more than 30 days. I think as a business owner, you need to think all the advantages and disadvantages, the cost etc.

 

[Newchodge]

I talks to some people asking about this, it depends on the company. Some allows to carry forward the leave to next year only 5 days, some can carry all but not more than 30 days. I think as a business owner, you need to think all the advantages and disadvantages, the cost etc.

You also need to think about the law. Which states that any employee who has been unable to take their leave due to Covid 19 can carry all their oustanding leave forward to the next 2 years.

If you want employees to take leave during furlough you MUST give them notice of the specific dates on which they are to take leave, the notice being twice as long as the leave to be taken. So if you want them to take off 3 weeks starting 1 December, you have to have given 6 weeks' notice, so by 19 October. If you just state that they should take 3 weeks holiday during furlough it doe not count as legal notice and the employee (even if they were paid 100% for those 3 weeks) can claim it was not taken.

 

[antropy]

My wife is a nurse in a large hospital and she was told that she couldn't carry over any holiday entitlement and that she had to take all seven weeks or lose them

I have heard instances where companies tell employees to use the holiday up or they lose it so they book say 2 weeks off and they are only allowed to take 1 week as they need them in the office. Really bad I know and with Covid those instances are only going to happen more and more. Alex

 

[Newchodge]

I have heard instances where companies tell employees to use the holiday up or they lose it so they book say 2 weeks off and they are only allowed to take 1 week as they need them in the office. Really bad I know and with Covid those instances are only going to happen more and more. Alex

Really bad and illegal. An employer may not prevent an employee taking holiday if that prevention means the employee cannot take their leave within their leave year.

 

[antropy]

Really bad and illegal. An employer may not prevent an employee taking holiday if that prevention means the employee cannot take their leave within their leave year.

It does happen though, especially in highly pressurised roles such as working in the NHS. Alex

 

[Newchodge]

It does happen though, especially in highly pressurised roles such as working in the NHS. Alex

It only happens because the employees concur with their employer's illegality.

 

[Mr D]

It only happens because the employees concur with their employer's illegality.

And yet this year its pretty common.

Say shielding from March onwards - so not in work. Then new leave year starts 1st August - as does happen - when between March and end of July should a shielding worker be taking leave?
No benefit to the worker in taking leave - and may well have kept some by for warmer months!

Or - as has indeed happened - staff have been unable to take leave because of staff shortages and you know, covid. Thinking specifically in the NHS there but the other emergency services would have the same problem.

Say 10% of staff isolating / shielding, 10% off sick, and unprecedented demand. When should the employer have been requiring the staff to take time off?

How about police officers? Fire crew?

It may be all right to say the admin staff in a big company should take some time off. Rather different when still not enough staff to cover a shift.

 

[Jyothi Tulasi]

Most of the companies are not allowing any carry forward nor they are paying for it. The remaining leaves just have to be taken in the current year or just collapse.

 

[Newchodge]

Most of the companies are not allowing any carry forward nor they are paying for it. The remaining leaves just have to be taken in the current year or just collapse.

Which, as I have stated above, is illegal.

 

[saton]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...xed-to-support-key-industries-during-covid-19

These are the rules.

Thanks a lot for this, Newchodge

 

[Mr D]

Most of the companies are not allowing any carry forward nor they are paying for it. The remaining leaves just have to be taken in the current year or just collapse.

Its one way to reduce the workforce on hand at any given time.
Not all employers are lucky enough to be in fields that allow that.
The jobs that need doing interfere with allowing a lot of staff off at once, particularly too many key skilled staff.