Hi [FirstName] or Not?

[earner]

Hi

This came to my attention in the last couple of days when I got in contact with somebody down under and, unbelievably, he actually stopped emailing me based PURELY on the fact I'd started my email to him as "Hi" and not "Hi [FirstName]".

So I've been thinking about it. And it just feels "false" to me to put somebody's name in there. I know I don't usually when I write emails either.

Now, I know if you read all the marketing stuff they tell you that you need to address people by name "get personal" ... to get a better response. But does that really work well in the UK?

Look through your emails from friends/colleagues ... do they use your name as an opener? OK the "mailing list" ones do, but what about your real friends/colleagues/contacts?

Look through your Sent Box. Are you putting people's names?

I'm annoyed/intrigued now. I am of the personal opinion that we (in Britain) don't say Hi [FirstName] to our friends/colleagues in emails ... so, am I wrong?

Regards
[FirstName]

 

[adam]

mmmm

Depends on the relationship.

Some emails I have sent and received might just start with "can't do Thursday, Wednesday is good"

Other start Dear (name) and some are just hi.

 

[Matt1959]

my instant reaction to this, leaving aside what should and shouldn't be done, is just to use Hi could be construed as a bit rude. I prefer to use Hi (first name) myself as this is more polite and if I don't know the customer I'm quite happy to use Mr or Mrs. I think many people quite like the more formal intro. and its not until you know the customer better that you can use just Hi. That would be my feeling anyway

 

[earner]

I'd have preferred it if from the start we'd adopted a "letter writing" approach to emails, then it would be easier to know what to do.

I'd be happier with a really formal:

Dear Mr/Mrs [LastName]

blah blah blah

Yours sincerely

[Firstname] [Lastname}

But the whole email thing degenerated

 

[fastfences]

Hi
If that person has ceased emailing simply becasue of the form of address, I reckon you should question his worth as a friend/contact or whatever.

Sure, it is better received to be addressed by name, but there are occassions where we're flying blind. I know when I receive something without my name I may be suspicious of the content, but surely it's the content that's more important than the form of address?

If I receive a letter addressed to 'The Occupier' it's very informal. If I receive a letter to 'The Occupier' but, inside is a letter saying there is evidence of a gold mine under my property, it's still informal, but then I wouldn't care if I were Mr, Mrs or whatever! It's the content that counts.

cheers, Nigel

 

[earner]

That's the way I see things Nigel.

But I think these days too many people are too quick to shout "spam" and "scam" without looking beyond that.

I think the chap I was in contact with was just a knob to be honest as I was actually asking him a proper business enquiry.

AND he had a crap name! *not bitter, breathe deeply*



So now I have to find out his biggest competitor and put my business with them.

 

[DuaneJackson]

What a twat - no loss there. I'm curious though, how do you know that's why he stopped contact with you.

I do understand the dilema. I prefer "Hi [firstname]" - but if I don't know the first name then "Hi Mr [Lastname]" seems a weird mix of the formal and informal.

I don't think there is anything wrong with "hi" on its own.

A year ago I started doing business with an old school "Right Honorable Lord" (he's an investor in KashFlow). I had no idea how to address him in person - that was quickly sorted with him saying "Please call me [Firstname]".

But then came the emails. He never ever ever uses 'Hi' or 'Dear'. All his emails start with "[Firstname],". I have to make a concious effort to do the same every week when I email him

 

[fastfences]

Excellent info, Mr Jackson.
N

 

[PI Guy]

This came to my attention in the last couple of days when I got in contact with somebody down under and, unbelievably, he actually stopped emailing me based PURELY on the fact I'd started my email to him as "Hi" and not "Hi [FirstName]"./quote]

he sounds like an idiot! I only put the first name to those who address me in the same format, otherwise its usually HI or Hiya

 

[DuaneJackson]

Nigel,

Thank you.

Duane.

 

[earner]

Oh well, this particular twat (vernacular required) was actually thick too. I'd been trying to get in touch with him but his details weren't on his website so I clicked on his (kindly provided link) in his website to get in contact with him.

Upon doing this my email popped up and his website had kindly populated the "Subject:" field. I thought this handy, but HATED his subject, but didn't change it as I felt he'd chosen it and there was no need. So I launched into the email with my usual "Hi"

His email back to me was to tell me two things: (1) he nearly deleted my email as spam because my email had a "very likely spam headline" and (2) "I almost deleted your email because it said Hi with no name"

So I replied to him (still using Hi as he is not my master and sounds a control freak) and explained it was his heading.

Then he just replied the once "Well... I still didn't see my name"

At which point I decided this guy would be too hard to do business with, was probably working in the dark (up his a*** is probably a very dark place) and he wasn't worth the effort as I wasn't even trying to sell anything to him ever.

 

[Bilzo]

Hi

Well yes, this guy just sounds like a pain and you probably don't need to be wasting time with him...

Interesting post though, it's not something I'd given an awful lot of thought to except that if it's a first contact or a new client I would always address Hi [firstname] and only start using just Hi after building a rapport.

If I'm emailing a client and there is more than one contact I'm dealing with at the company I'll usually use Hi guys, and if I only have a surname then yes I would actually use Hi Mr [lastname] whether right or wrong, I don't feel that getting too formal in an email is appropriate.

A quick scan of my recent mails confirms that most of my contacts email me with Hi Bill, but that could just be echoing my style of emailing?

Interesting to see what the general consensus is here but I'd be surprised if many people would "nearly delete your email because it didn't start with my name"

Bill

 

[earner]

Hi all

After posting this, it's now changed the way I start doing things. I am now trying to put peoples names in, but it's bloody hard.

It feels awkward and often I forget. But I am getting there.

And as for that arse: he doesn't deserve a 2nd thought. He is now categorised in my database as "knob"

Strangely enough, I had a call at 9am this morning from somebody because I'd sent them an email the same day about the same thing... I couldn't place the name/man at all.... but he not only didn't mind, but was over-excited that we were speaking and that I had time to speak to him.... even though this 2nd guy is 100x bigger than Mr Knobby.

So - I guess the successful people in business are those who don't pre-judge. Those who accept that people are different. Those who actually READ the words and don't think everything is spam.

 

[franglo]

No matter how much someone is potentially worth in £, if that person irks you to the point where you feel the need to write messages about him on the internet just to vent, chances are, he's going to destroy your productivity. After dealing with that person, you're going to carry around the feeling of being irritated for the rest of the day, and that could have a knock-on effect on the jobs for other clients. So... I would cut him loose.

I normally start my emails with "Hi [name]" for informal messages. If I'm writing to a friend or member of the family in rapid succession, I will probably start with "Hi [name]" in the first email and then not bother with the next ones as it's more of a conversation by that point.

In terms of business... I do usually use "Hi [name]" a lot of the time, unless it's a case of making first contact and I have absolutely no connection with the other person. For example, I wouldn't write to the bank manager and say "Hi Bob!"

I don't understand why this person thought "Hi [name]" would cut down on spam... All sales reps will already know his first name. They do their digging very carefully.

 

[GNU]

That guy sounds a complete prat, he has a point about spam etc, but still a complete prat....

As for your original question, I did not used to use names, however I learned it is considered rude not to in some countries I send regular mails to.

Now I always add the name, theres nothing false about it, its just a change of habbit.

 

[Chris Uren]

If I have a name then I always use it.

Seems the right and business like thing to do

Chris

 

[Raph]

This is a very interesting toppic - apart from the fact that the guy who caused the discussion shouldn't be really worth a comment (if he thought it's spam why did he reply at all? and if he didn't, why didn't he just reply in a professional way rather than patronising a potential customer?)
...damn, I did it

Anyway, I like the toppic as being from Germany where we still use two very different ways of saying "you" (there's the formal "Sie" -you-, usually combined with addressing the person only with his/her surname and the much less formal "Du" -you-, which goes with the first name) I found it actually quite difficult in the beginning to get used to address people only (well, or at least most of the time) by there first names.

However for business mails I still like the "snail mail" approach - for first contact "Dear Mr/Mrs..." and depending on the response still "Dear [first name]" or "Hi [first name].

What's interesting to me is my inner reaction of reading mails starting with only my first name - I always imagine the person typing the message making a brake, taking a deep breath and shaking their head before starting the mail (which I suspect to be a complaint at this stage already ) - although it's considered as being a perfectly normal way of addressing someone here. It's just funny how little things can affect you...

 

[franglo]

Interesting point, Raph, thanks for bringing it up. I usually have no problems with the European formal/informal you, but there are some situations where I'm just not sure which would be better to use. When I'm chatting away, I'm always listening out consciously for a vous/tu, Lei/tu or Sie/du to help me figure out what I should be saying next. The English language has its fair share of linguistic issues, but the fact that we only have one way of saying you is probably it's biggest selling point, in my opinion.

I remember reading many years ago about people using Herr/Frau Surname with du or Firstname with Sie, in an attempt to shake the social confusion about when formality was required. I don't think the idea lasted very long, but I can definitely understand why it came about.

There are a lot of times when I use the formal you, where I would just not use that in English, if we differentiated between the two. I think in general, some European languages are just... well, more polite, than English. "Yours faithfully" in French translates to a very long sentence that literally means something along the lines of, "I ask respectfully that you accept my most distinguished sentiments, Sir". It's just a more old-fashioned language.