Help starting my web design business from home

[BusinessDeli]

my grandmother could do what the OP is trying to sell.

But she's not, which is sort of the point...

OP - if you want in on the web design business, I formally would like to offer you a one month unpaid internship within my agency. Please feel free to PM me for details.

Take him up on this offer! Free training doesn't come along often

 

[Shaun_Pearce]

Well I think many have gone down the road of trying to help you out in their own ways. Some direct, some indirect and others losing the will to live.

The easiest thing for me to do would be to criticise your perspective. Instead I would like to show you a system that is helping a lot of my clients find new business. Based on your business model, would I be right in saying newly established businesses in certain industries would be useful?

If yes, drop me a number mate and I'll give you a bit of free access to my marketing tool. It'll give you an idea of how you can target new customers quickly. It's perfect for web companies.

@wearewattle, I'd love it if Farley93 actually took you up on this offer. I'm in full agreement with telemax on the basis of price is a poor salesmans best tool. Use the time to learn from the people on this forum. It's easier than battling with them mate I promise. Ask quality questions that could improve your chances of winning some new clients.

 

[Shaun_Pearce]

@wearewattle, still a little shocked at that actually haha, hat's off to you mate..

 

[DazRave]

But she's not, which is sort of the point...

I think his point was more about nobody want's a product that they know their grandma could do. If i'm paying for something to be done, i want to know i'm paying for a service that I can't do myself.

If money's so tight that i'm looking into £150 websites, then I find out that actually, it's so easy my grandmother could do it, then I'd rather save £150 and hire my Granny, i'm sure she won't charge me.

 

[Glenn Rodgers]

Below is the list of my suggestions:
1. Build your own website regarding web designing business.
2. Create your portfolio section into your website.
3. Join freelancer platforms like: Freelancer, odesk, elance make your original id and submit your portfolio and add your complete detail. Bid on latest projects cleverly.
4. Create your social profiles specially on linkedin, Facebook, Twitter, pinterest to build social circle.
5. Start doing SEO/SMO for your business website on your local market based keywords.

 

[BusinessDeli]

I think his point was more about nobody want's a product that they know their grandma could do. If i'm paying for something to be done, i want to know i'm paying for a service that I can't do myself.

If money's so tight that i'm looking into £150 websites, then I find out that actually, it's so easy my grandmother could do it, then I'd rather save £150 and hire my Granny, i'm sure she won't charge me.

I'm with you and yes, I got the reference but the point is that people don't do it themselves do they? Those people are potential customers regardless of gullibility or anything else. It's a small market but there are people that want a service such as this even with all the many pitfalls already mentioned by the pro's - the OP's choice to prove his theory.

 

[ryedale]

At the end of the day though, these potential customers have little money to spend and are likely to need support moving forward. If the OP has a plan for that, then that's fine. If it's all just about the money and then moving onto the next customer, then he's very quickly going to get a bad reputation

It's all very well saying they'll have it made clear to them that it's a limited package but as everyone on here has said repeatedly, they won't get or adhere to that and if you don't provide the back up support, you are likely to get bad reviews very quickly.

 

[DesignerNick]

At the end of the day though, these potential customers have little money to spend and are likely to need support moving forward. If the OP has a plan for that, then that's fine. If it's all just about the money and then moving onto the next customer, then he's very quickly going to get a bad reputation

It's all very well saying they'll have it made clear to them that it's a limited package but as everyone on here has said repeatedly, they won't get or adhere to that and if you don't provide the back up support, you are likely to get bad reviews very quickly.

How does he plan to support them moving forward?

He is going to need to learn html, css, php and even a bit of optimising pages for local seo and lead generation.

What about calls to action?

A lot of designers clean up off people who install a template and run as people will figure out that can't do exactly what they need and take their site to be properly finished.

 

[Farley93]

This thread demonstrates what real people with (in my case 18 years) experience have to contend with. The OP openly states he has no skills or knowledge, openly admits that he is not willing to educate himself and openly states he wants to take peoples money for something they can do themselves.

A Wordpress theme is not a website people. This service is effectively conning people, my grandmother could do what the OP is trying to sell.

OP - if you want in on the web design business, I formally would like to offer you a one month unpaid internship within my agency. Please feel free to PM me for details.

Seriously, how can you call that conning? I'll be offering a better service than you. I'll be delivering it in 1/4 or 1/3 of the time, I'll be charging them far less than half what you do and I'll be making sites as good, if not better. If anything you're conning them by charging these small struggling business ridiculous amounts for something they can do themselves for literally £50. Have a think about that! We're both charging them more for something than they can do for themselves, if they had the knowledge. The same reason you don't fix your car yourself when it breaks down and do you think you're being conned by taking it to a mechanic because he's charging more than it costs?

Also, people can't do it themselves because they don't know how to and most don't even know about Wordpress. I struggled for 6 years on sites like Wix.com, Piczo.com, Weebly.com and other such sites and when I found Wordpress and themes I realised how easy it was. Hundreds of thousands of business and individuals are in the same position I was, and most, without businesses like mine, would never learn about it.

 

[Farley93]

These are words that should ring loud and clear in the OP's ears.

I mentioned plenty of times that I am 20 and that this wouldn't be the only thing I do. I make £14,000 per year from my twitter network, so this would be an extra £10-12k per year. It also allows me to go out as usual and doesn't restrict me. I am young so I have no bills to pay or risks like you do when you get to mid-20s and above. Might as well make the most of it doing something I really enjoy and making £24,000 a year, more than anyone my age that I know.

 

[ryedale]

It's very wrong to say you'll be offering a better service than wearewattle who has 18 years experience when you don't even know how to code. You take your car to a mechanic because you would expect him to know about cars. Equally you go to a web designer because you expect them to know best about web design and how to make your site a success.

The most important thing you can do in business is listen and learn from experience. Doesn't mean you have to do everything the way it's already been done but if numerous people are all telling you the same thing.. it might be a good idea to listen

So what about your support policy

Let's say

I've bought a site from you, something's gone wrong and now the page is messed up, displaying some sort of PHP error message whatever that is?

I'm going to meet a new client in a few hours and it's really important they can go through my site to see my services - can you sort it asap please.

 

[DazRave]

The same reason you don't fix your car yourself when it breaks down and do you think you're being conned by taking it to a mechanic because he's charging more than it costs?

I service and fix my own car, to the best of my ability. I look into how difficult it is and if i have the correct tools. If the job is ever to tricky, i TAKE IT TO AN EXPERT who i know will be able to fix it.

What I don't do, is give my car to Joe Bloggs down the road, who isn't a mechanic. Who then duct tapes the part needed to my car, which works for awhile but then falls off half a year later, causing more damage than the original broken part in the first place.

Do you see the point yet?

 

[Ben_Doyle]

I'll be charging them far less than half what you do and I'll be making sites as good, if not better. If anything you're conning them by charging these small struggling business ridiculous amounts for something they can do themselves for literally £50. Have a think about that!

Calm down!

I agree with you, I wouldn't call it conning either. Charging someone for a service they can't do themselves is completely legitimate - as long as it is of quality and provides value.

The sites you provided did look very nice to be fair but I think the above comment is a bit silly.

Also, those are blogs. Not company websites - there is a difference!

And who said wearewattle is overcharging small businesses?

Just because you charge someone a lot of money doesn't mean you're conning people. As I said in my previous post in this thread, my last website job I charged £15k + VAT.

Did I con the client?

No!

They were thrilled with the end end result AND it's £15k they're not getting taxed on.

Some companies will be happy to spend tens of thousands of pounds on a website (as well as cars and other things) because their accountants have told them they need to reduce or defer their tax liabilities - You're not conning them, you're providing value (provided you keep your promises).

Remember this, with price comes credibility.

Ask any other (real) web designer/developer here. Some people will laugh you out of the building for quoting such a small price and, as I have already said, the ones that don't will cause you problems.

I promise you that.

You'l learn this soon enough though I'm sure.

Good luck!

Ben

 

[fisicx]

... so this would be an extra £10-12k per year.

It won't make you anywhere near that sort of money. There will be a in initial flurry or interest then it will die away - this is normal for any business. If you make more than £5K/year I will be very surprised.

Going back to the point about the themes. When you buy a theme it is registered to an account. You will need to set up an account for each person whose site you are building. You can't get a new copy each time you want to build a site. Just managing this will be a complete pain.

And you say you have no costs but you will need Public Libility Insurance and you will need to register your address as a business.

 

[Farley93]

I'm going to give it a go either way, as it'll be interesting to see the results and I'm not investing anything other than maybe £100 and some time. I haven't asked many questions so far but here are some I've got since reading everyone's posts:

Is there a recommended period of time after delivering their site that I should offer free support (eg 1 month)? Or is this not expected?

If I start to charge for support, how long after delivering their site should I wait and how much is fair to charge?

Would I have to set any restrictions to stop them literally asking 20 questions per day, or is this not how it usually works? I wouldn't want the support to take up all of my time that I couldn't make any more websites.

In terms of marketing, I've got my twitter network which should gain me a decent amount of followers but I know that'll dramatically slow down at a certain point. How else do you recommend marketing the business? I've never had a business-to-business type website so I don't know how they think and what they respond well to.

Any help with the above questions would be much appreciated.

 

[DazRave]

So you'll need to find 100 clients a year to hit your £10k estimate, all willing to pay £150 just for you to install a £50 template for them.

This is EXACTLY what 'wordpress web developers' do on People Per Hour... but at least they have solid, trackable reputations and also offer support afterwards.

If you find 10 clients, i'll be impressed and certainly call that a win. It's certainly worth doing for yourself as an added income. Just stop taking it as a personal attack when we all say that you have over estimated how much you will make as well as how much time it will take you.

NO ONE want's to see you fail here, that's why we are telling you that you might be setting yourself up to fail before you actually do it!

But like you said, low overheads, it's worth a shot hey? Try if for a month and if you can't find at least 8 customers then you're not quite reaching your targets.

EDIT: Ok, so you're thinking about offering support now too. Good plan! Have you looked at People Per Hour at all? I'm wondering if checking out the competition would be helpful in terms of what to offer.

 

[fisicx]

If I start to charge for support, how long after delivering their site should I wait and how much is fair to charge? - The day after launch, at least £25/hour

Would I have to set any restrictions to stop them literally asking 20 questions per day, or is this not how it usually works? I wouldn't want the support to take up all of my time that I couldn't make any more websites. - Doesn't work that way. Because they don't know what they are doing you will spend hours and hours on the phone teaching them how to do things with wordpress. Yesterday a client needed walking through adding an image to a post. It took nearly an hour.

In terms of marketing, I've got my twitter network which should gain me a decent amount of followers but I know that'll dramatically slow down at a certain point. How else do you recommend marketing the business? I've never had a business-to-business type website so I don't know how they think and what they respond well to. - Pay for advertising. Pay for cold calling. Get out the house and go see people. Put an advert on your car. You are going to spend more time marketing that you do building websites. This is why you aren't charging enough - you need to cover all those non-productive hours. On average I spend 10 hours a week actually coding, the rest of the time is spent, marketing, chasing people and providing support.

 

[ryedale]

The key question really is can you provide the support rather than how much of it

How are you going to get round the technical questions? If you have to fork out £3 to your helper every time someone asks a question, you'll actually be losing money in no time

 

[wearewattle]

We're both charging them more for something than they can do for themselves, if they had the knowledge. The same reason you don't fix your car yourself when it breaks down and do you think you're being conned by taking it to a mechanic because he's charging more than it costs?

And this is why you should come and sit in my office for a month. We are not offering the same thing, you think we are, but we are not.

What I offer is the ability for a business to connect with their customer base, to find new business opportunities and leads, to integrate online and offline processes, to integrate line of business systems and improve productivity. I help businesses leverage technology to make a measurable tangible difference. I offer 18 years of digital, marketing and business experience and work towards delivering tangible, measurable results.

What you offer is a £50 Wordpress template and you think it is a "web design business". Perhaps brand it is a Wordpress template installation service?

 

[ethical PR]

Seriously, how can you call that conning? I'll be offering a better service than you. I'll be delivering it in 1/4 or 1/3 of the time, I'll be charging them far less than half what you do and I'll be making sites as good, if not better. If anything you're conning them by charging these small struggling business ridiculous amounts for something they can do themselves for literally £50. Have a think about that! We're both charging them more for something than they can do for themselves, if they had the knowledge. The same reason you don't fix your car yourself when it breaks down and do you think you're being conned by taking it to a mechanic because he's charging more than it costs?

Hmm I was going to offer you some ideas around how you could market your business concept until I read this. Accusing someone of conning their customers because they are charging a realistic price based on their skill, experience, track record and knowledge and claiming you offer a better service, when you don't have any track record in the sector, sounds like playground talk to me.

 

[Farley93]

@ethical PR I think you'll find I said that in response to him saying I conned people by charging them for something they can do themselves. Explain the difference?

 

[ryedale]

As someone else said I think the idea of branding your service as a template installation and configuration service would be a fairer and more accurate description of the business and would be less likely to mislead people. You might even get more business that way

 

[Farley93]

@wearewattle I really do genuinely appreciate your offer but for me the thrill is using the templates because I know I can't come up with better stuff because I'm not that creative. I do like creating sites but I wouldn't say web design is my thing. I'm also starting an apprenticeship with a small startup in my local area in the next 4-6 weeks so I wouldn't have the time but I do appreciate the offer and that you're trying to help me with the idea.

 

[Farley93]

As someone else said I think the idea of branding your service as a template installation and configuration service would be a fairer and more accurate description of the business and would be less likely to mislead people. You might even get more business that way

Do you think that will have an impact on the amount of customers I get? I understand that I may not (I'll have to check first) be able to call myself a 'Web Design' company, but I feel template installation is selling it a little short. It IS installing templates, but it's also altering template settings and customisation options, installing plugins, offering support and helping with social media too.

 

[ryedale]

WordPress set up service maybe?

I just feel that the customer may have less expectation of the service then rather than calling it web design which will mislead some people no matter what you explain to them

 

[Shaun_Pearce]

There are no friends in business buddy. You'll learn that the hard way like the rest of us probably. I've followed this thread for a bit too long now I think so I'll end on this.

If you've successfully found people willing to pay for it just remember to cherish it. Don't let the money be the only thing you get out of this experience. In years to come you'll value this experience. Just try your best to avoid disappointing a customer best you can and i'm sure things will be okay.

Social Media will continue to give you business however. When you're in a position to start looking at maybe picking the phone up to generate some new business, I'll offer further advice.

In my industry mate I get access directly to brand new established businesses who will be looking for an online presence. Who knows you might want to take on the couple of thousand new businesses in your area for a mail shot or a cold calling campaign? When that happens, let me know. I'll show you a few neat tricks these experienced fellas could even use

 

[RedOnion]

Also, people can't do it themselves because they don't know how to and most don't even know about Wordpress.

But they can find out, can't they, and learn? This time last year I knew nothing of building web sites and had never heard of Wordpress. I started my company in January, needed a website, but with hardly any money set about sorting it out myself.

I realise that my site still needs a lot of work, but I have the basics there, and for the first few months it has served its purpose. If I had more time, then I could learn more about Wordpress, but too busy working for my company, earning money.To improve it to what I want I realise that I am going to have to pay another person/company, in the next few months, to create the site that I want.

From what little I have learnt, I would not only be looking for someone who could improve (which won't be difficult) my website, but to also add any little "tweaks" that I may want. And although I have a good idea now exactly of what I want, I wouldn't be surprised if, when I see it, I would still want changes. Being offered a web site as quickly as you are offering them would not be practical for me - where is the time to think and decide what is really needed/wanted. Bearing in mind that I still have to run my company, I couldn't promise that I could come back to you with everything you need as quick as you require it.

It seems like you will expect all your clients to conform to your restrictions, but I can't see that happening. You do need to be flexible - which you probably need to be in most businesses.

I do wish you well in your new business, and certainly hope that you succeed. As a small business, which has nothing to do with designing websites, just thought I would give a view point from a potential clients point of view.

 

[ethical PR]

@ethical PR I think you'll find I said that in response to him saying I conned people by charging them for something they can do themselves. Explain the difference?

THIS

This thread demonstrates what real people with (in my case 18 years) experience have to contend with. The OP openly states he has no skills or knowledge, openly admits that he is not willing to educate himself and openly states he wants to take peoples money for something they can do themselves.
A Wordpress theme is not a website people. This service is effectively conning people, my grandmother could do what the OP is trying to sell.
OP - if you want in on the web design business, I formally would like to offer you a one month unpaid internship within my agency. Please feel free to PM me for details.

 

[MartynKeigher]

I have put my advice in already and more advice from me would just be echo'ing what others have also suggested, but i'm still keeping my eye on this thread as its a goldmine of hints/tips for others who wish to start something similar from home.

I have been not been doing web-design for as long as most people here (it sounds like), but I started doing what you were doing and the back-end support killed me the most. All those little tweaks that they wanted really consumed my time. I didn't have an initial desire to learn code, but it made me learn CSS/HTML really quick, and once I finally embraced the change of skill-set I needed to succeed, I enjoyed it even more!

Final point I want to make really quick...

@Farley93, IF you are able/willing to... I would totally take @wearewattle up on his offer!! You don't get offers like that everyday! It would be a fantastic learning curve for you, and anyone!

KUDOS to you @wearewattle for offering that!

 

[DesignerNick]

@wearewattle I really do genuinely appreciate your offer but for me the thrill is using the templates because I know I can't come up with better stuff because I'm not that creative. I do like creating sites but I wouldn't say web design is my thing.

What happens if somebody wants an adjustment? What happens if they want some of the CSS changing or a custom plugin to do something different?

What happens when they come to you and ask how they add a picture, how they create posts?

You say yourself web design is not your think but want to run a "web design company".

You would be better offering it as a service on PPH, there are people on Fiver simply installing Wordpress for people.

You say that the local bakery, the local garage or somebody won't care if it is a theme or not. They will care when it doesn't actually get them any business or make them any money as they will see it as a waste of money because they haven't had a return. It is all well and good offering them an all singing, all dancing responsive theme with fancy animations but if it doesn't generate them any business it is a pointless exercise isn't it?

Like I said before though, when people like yourself charge people for services, it does create work for other web designers afterwards and they then get clients who stay with them because of being burnt in the past and now finding somebody who can do what they say.

It is all well and good coming on here giving it loads to everybody about how you know best etc but if you are starting something knew you should always listen to all advice. Telling people they have crap websites etc when you don't really know nothing about them or their business isn't a smart move. I know of people with crap websites that make over £100k a year profit, not just a theme either.

 

[DazRave]

@ethical PR

Fancy making a valid point any time soon?

Absolutely no point in that comment at all.

I think it's time this thread was locked, personally.

 

[ryedale]

I think that's probably a good idea

 

[MartynKeigher]

Ya. It's defo run its course. The OP got plenty of advice & constructive criticism. Definitely enough food for thought, to set him on his way for now.

Was a lively discussion and a good reference for someone else in the future.

**I've given all the advice i can give on this.

 

[sands67]

Wow that was a hell of a post.

I cannot believe how much good advice was given on here. If the OP chooses to ignore it I think we should refer people to it when someone (inevitably) asks about setting up a wordpress website business.

 

[Nuno]

Hey Farley; sorry if I missed it as I was carried away with the 'theme bender as a business meme', (lots of people do it, lots. It's a way to start a business and learn how to do more).
What's with the 1020 Films avatar, which is from an American website which seems to make very short films about two Californian men?