Help - not happy with SEO company's work

[a8star]

I am not going to name the company I am involved with as I am only seeking some advice.

In June I moved my ecommerce website to a different platform. After the changeover our site lost alot of search engine rankings. Toward the end of August I was in a panic and sought external help from an SEO specialist.

I do have a fair knowledge of SEO but I have to focus time elsewhere in the business.
Everything the SEO guy said he would do sounded good.

He presented me a contract initially for 12 months. I said no, I will only sign for 6 months at £500 per month.

I made my first payment on 4/09/13.

My concerns are that he has not put in much work over the course of 3 months. He has given me 1 or 2 keyword reports via MOZ analytics.

On top of all this there has been very little contact with the guy. He doesn't ever say what he has done or when he plans to do it.

I know he has inserted or changed some meta descriptions and title tags on my category pages but I can't honestly say he has done any more than that.

At the end of October I asked what the plan was for November.

He said he will be doing link building and increasing the content on the site.

This week the thing which set me off was when I asked him to show me an example of the links he has built to the site. He was unable to show me any.

I also asked for a report on everything he has done to the site. I am still waiting for this.

Most of our communication has been via skype chat.

I had quite a heated phone conversation with him on Thursday after he still had not provided me with any evidence to support what he had done. I asked if in future he could show me a weekly report but he says he is unable to do this.

I am sure you can understand my frustration about this matter. I feel like I am throwing money away.

I have not had a single monthly report.

If I could walk away now I would. He has made me too suspicious and I feel he is not doing an adequate amount of work.

The only things he has done on this contract is Keyword Analysis, Competitor Analysis and A little bit of On Page Keyword Implementation. Nothing else.

In 3 months thats all he has done. I can't bare the thought of paying another £1500 for this level of productivity.

Here is a copy of the contract.

CONTRACT OF WORK BETWEEN " " SEO AND “ ”

List of work to be carried out by " " SEO.

Full Website Audit

Keyword Analysis and Targeting

On Page Keyword Implementation

Web Page Restructuring

Competitor Analysis

Site Map Creation

Site Map Verification

Directory Submissions

Link Building

Google Place Page Creation

On-site Copywriting

Facebook Management + Updates

Twitter Management + Updates

Linkedin creation & optimization

Google + creation

Social Bookmarking

Digg Profile Creation

Delicious Profile Creation

Stumbled Upon Profile Creation

Google Analytics set up/implementation

Google Analytics reports

Monthly site reviews



From here onwards in the outline of this contract, “ ” shall be referred to as “Client”.

Client agrees to make/accept all changes required to the main site to support the optimisation process. " " has agreed to supply content for the main site to support the optimisation process (where required).

By signing this contract, Client has understood that this is a long term process and its success should be judged at the end of the contract. Client has also understood that " " are unable to guarantee increases in rankings or traffic.

The contract is a contract for 6 calendar months, and will begin upon receipt of the first payment of £500.00

PAYMENT TERMS

The contract value of £3,000.00 is payable in amount of £500.00 monthly payable direct to " " on a Direct Debit Mandate on submission of a weekly invoice.


Any help or advice would be much appreciated. I really don't feel comfortable to continue.

 

[10032012]

A contractual dispute with a weak contract... I would favour my chances and terminate the Direct Debit. But before you do that...

1) Do you have control of the social media accounts?
2) Do you get a weekly invoice?

A monthly report... there is nothing stopping him opening up microsoft word and typing a few details in it to make a report... i.e. it doesn't have to be a print out from software etc. it can be bespoke. If he cannot be bothered to do that for such amount of money, seems he is ripping you off.

As for SEO. There are two main types... "On Page" and "Off Page". As an amateur SEO... the "On Page" is the most simple, the "Off Page" link building etc. is the most tricky. Some will just submit your link in forums, blog comments and social media profiles... that isn't link building, that is spamming!

 

[a8star]

A contractual dispute with a weak contract... I would favour my chances and terminate the Direct Debit. But before you do that...

1) Do you have control of the social media accounts?
2) Do you get a weekly invoice?

I can remove access from my social media accounts.

No I don't get a weekly invoice. It is £500 per month invoiced Monthly. Why do you ask?

 

[10032012]

PAYMENT TERMS

The contract value of £3,000.00 is payable in amount of £500.00 monthly payable direct to " " on a Direct Debit Mandate on submission of a weekly invoice.

I read that as you agree to pay £3000 for 6 months work, in instalments of £500 monthly by direct debit to " .... " on him sending you an invoice every week.

In my eyes, you can pro rata the amount by terminating the contract. There is no clause (unless you didn't include it all) preventing you doing so or setting a cost of doing so. He is in violation of the contract by not doing what it says.

 

[a8star]

I read that as you agree to pay £3000 for 6 months work, in instalments of £500 monthly by direct debit to " .... " on him sending you an invoice every week.

In my eyes, you can pro rata the amount by terminating the contract. There is no clause (unless you didn't include it all) preventing you doing so or setting a cost of doing so. He is in violation of the contract by not doing what it says.

I can't believe I did not see that. So technically he should be sending me a weekly invoice. So I should be able to pay for one week to terminate because he has breached contract?

 

[a8star]

The contract was emailed in the form of a word document. I signed it and returned it too him. Surely he could amend it so it reads monthly?

 

[10032012]

The contract was emailed in the form of a word document. I signed it and returned it too him. Surely he could amend it so it reads monthly?

As long as you have the email, you will be fine. Furthermore, the contract is worthless without your signature... so he would have to be committing fraud spoofing your signature to be able to change the terms.

 

[jo_max]

This is not the answer you would like to hear but: Close all access to them, stop working with them, stop paying them. The sooner you do is less damage to your website and the more money you ca use wisely.

I feel for you. We have had the same situation when started our ecommerce business a few years back. £500 SEO offers will only get you banned or help nothing at all. My advise register with MOZ pro track, analyse, etc, learn as much as you can and try it yourself. There are plenty other good sources such as searhengineland, distilled, etc. for updates, whats going on, advise etc. (again don't believe what everyone says). Otherwise you are looking for £5k + a month for a proper SEO. The reason is it will be high as it's not SEO anymore, it's digital marketing. It's all about making sure you fiollow google guidelines when creating your store and creative marketing.

Than again you might read guest blogging, infographics etc. Please please do not fall into this trap too. Content marketing is good if only your content is awesome and will be read, shared and talked about it. A guest blog post that no one will see or read will harm your website again.

I've followed above and now we own one of the leading store in UK.

I hope this helps.

 

[10032012]

I can't believe I did not see that. So technically he should be sending me a weekly invoice. So I should be able to pay for one week to terminate because he has breached contract?

No, I would suggest terminating the Direct Debit payment and sending him notice (i.e. a letter saying you are terminating the contract for fundamental breach of contract).

This breach appears to have been from day one, so you could argue you shouldn't have paid anything at all, but I wouldn't worry about claiming money back especially that he provided some description of a service in receipt of such monies.

You should check with a solicitor if you are worried about it.

 

[a8star]

As long as you have the email, you will be fine. Furthermore, the contract is worthless without your signature... so he would have to be committing fraud spoofing your signature to be able to change the terms.

So what should I say?

I wish to terminate the contract because I am not happy with your services and you are in breach of the contract by not providing weekly invoices?

 

[jo_max]

So what should I say?

I wish to terminate the contract because I am not happy with your services and you are in breach of the contract by not providing weekly invoices?

I'm sure there is a clause somewhere in the contract to protect themselves. I don't think this is the way to approach.

My best advise there is another community forum full off solicitors and advisers. Go there register and they will help you, I'm 100% sure. If you pm me I can give you the address.

 

[a8star]

No, I would suggest terminating the Direct Debit payment and sending him notice (i.e. a letter saying you are terminating the contract for fundamental breach of contract).

This breach appears to have been from day one, so you could argue you shouldn't have paid anything at all, but I wouldn't worry about claiming money back especially that he provided some description of a service in receipt of such monies.

You should check with a solicitor if you are worried about it.

Ok thank you so much! I am not worried. It seems quite clear to me now.

I did speak of having a break with his services over the phone but immediately he jumped to defend himself by saying "it's a contract, you can't terminate it".

 

[a8star]

I'm sure there is a clause somewhere in the contract to protect themselves. I don't think this is the way to approach.

My best advise there is another community forum full off solicitors and advisers. Go there register and they will help you, I'm 100% sure. If you pm me I can give you the address.

I posted the full contract. Did you read it?

He first gave me the contract with another clients name on it. This is how shoddy it was.

 

[jo_max]

By the way it's a free to join public forum. No payments asked Probably everone know that forum here but not sure if I can submit the link.

I don't want people getting the wrong idea

 

[10032012]

Your main reason must steer away from not being happy.

These are the worst things about contracts. You hear it all the time how some cowboy builder took someone's life savings and only did a third of it to a bad standard... potential health trap... if they just took the money without work, its theft... now they did some work, its technicalities of the quality of their work and breach of contract for not finishing and to a poor standard below the standard expected of a competent builder.​

I would just state something along the lines of "I am writing to you to serve notice of terminating the contract between us as a result of a fundamental breach of contract committed by yourself.

The contract clearly states payment would be taken by Direct Debit on receipt of weekly invoices which I haven't received.

I consider the original contract as unenforceable - and as a result I have reserved the right to terminate the Direct Debit instruction. "

You would have to send the letter (I recommend "signed for") and ignore his responses. He will obviously claim the contract text was different and/or that he sent weekly invoices... that is his word against yours. He should eventually get the hint and move on. He is obviously amateur.

Of course I recommend getting a solicitor before taking any action, the above snippet was something I did in a matter of seconds. In future, I recommend meeting someone face-2-face even if it was solely a one-off consultation for someone operating online... obviously not at your house!

 

[jo_max]

I posted the full contract. Did you read it?

He first gave me the contract with another clients name on it. This is how shoddy it was.

That looks like a copy paste contract

If it was me I would do what I said.

1) Remove all access
2) stop paying
3) Ignore

But that's me

Another idea hire a PPH member (a solicitor) for a small amount of fee. Get advise from them if you are not that sure.

 

[threenine]

Personally, I wouldn't waste any more time on this guy! I'd cancel the Direct Debit, Call him to tell him why, then back it all up with an email, and send him a letter.

I would state, every time that it is down to the lack of results and zero output. I would invite him at every opportunity to prove me wrong, and supply evidence of services rendered. Measurable results, and output.

I wouldn't worry about the "contract" it's going to cost him more money to enforce it. You are well within your right the renege on a contract due to insufficient results.

Going forward, I would be a lot tougher on getting suppliers to provide evidence on there output. Before entering into a contract, I would set SMART objectives for the supplier to adhere too, and stipulate at which points payments are generated. Not just pay every month because a "contract" stipulates it.

 

[a8star]

Personally, I wouldn't waste any more time on this guy! I'd cancel the Direct Debit, Call him to tell him why, then back it all up with an email, and send him a letter.

I would state, every time that it is down to the lack of results and zero output. I would invite him at every opportunity to prove me wrong, and supply evidence of services rendered. Measurable results, and output.

I wouldn't worry about the "contract" it's going to cost him more money to enforce it. You are well within your right the renege on a contract due to insufficient results.

Going forward, I would be a lot tougher on getting suppliers to provide evidence on there output. Before entering into a contract, I would set SMART objectives for the supplier to adhere too, and stipulate at which points payments are generated. Not just pay every month because a "contract" stipulates it.

The payments are manual. I pay upon receipt of invoice via bank transfer.

'Lack of results' He would argue there were improved rankings for certain keywords which there was. I am not denying this. The contract says results are to be measured at the end of the contract not now.

What I am concerned about is the productivity and him not being clear cut with what he has actually done. Him being unable to show sufficient evidence for anything really made me suspicious. Sure he has filled out some meta descriptions and title tags but if that is all then I really feel I could have done that myself.

So do you really think I am in a position to end the contract? Some other guys on this thread said I shouldn't mention that I am not happy.

 

[10032012]

Alternatively you can pay him the balance of the contract and call it quits.

Can you PM me a link to the website (SEO guy) in confidence?

 

[a8star]

Alternatively you can pay him the balance of the contract and call it quits.

Can you PM me a link to the website (SEO guy) in confidence?

Now why would I wan't to do that? I couldn't bare to pay the remainder and let him get away with doing nothing. I found the guy on People Per Hour. I will PM you.

 

[threenine]

I would totally tell him I am unhappy. I would never walk away from any business deal without confronting the issues at hand. It is purely not good business practice. If you are unhappy with any business service you are totally within in your rights to complain, and with hold payment. You are only honourably obliged to allow the other party a chance to remedy the situation.

Every business relies on feedback, it is feedback that enables a business to prosper, it is the most valuable asset for a business. I am sure this SEO guy would appreciate some feedback, if he doesn't then he is obviously not interested in growing a business.

If we take a holistic view of the relationship, he has probably failed in managing his customers expectations. a) He has not provided sufficient measurable objectives that his work can be measured against. B) He is not managing the client relationship very well. C) Regardless of what anybody says, each and every business service is measurable. How else can you determine what to charge for it?

 

[Mainland]

Save your money. Half of these companies make changes that you could learn in half an hour from a book on Amazon. Write quality and engaging content and the traffic will follow. Once you have the basics you are as qualified as most of these "SEO" companies. Never use tricks of the trade to get to the top. They may give you short term gain but in the long term will do nothing for your business. If your website is the number one in its field you don't need to pay anyone to get you higher on Google. "If you build it they will come!"

 

[MASSEY]

I would just pull out of it if you have seen no increase in profits. If they can't even supply you with links they have built you may very well be paying money for nothing, which is common with SEO.

 

[antropy]

He's never provided you an example of any work he's done when asked except some minor on-site optimization and you're concerned about ending the contract?!

Cancel that direct debit right now! Seriously!

 

[fisicx]

Stop the payments now.

Looking at the contract there is virtually nothing they are doing that will help your ranking. Google even tells you this in their documentation. As suggested, if they are not providing the service then they are in breach of contract which will be your get out.

 

[a8star]

He has put my website into MOZ analytics. He let it run for a month and sent me 1 or 2 reports on competitors and keywords. Written a few meta descriptions and title tags. I asked for a report on this (all content he has added to the site) and he has not ben able to produce it in over a week.

I keep thinking to myself , why would you do work and not keep record of it for easy access. At least for back up purposes.

So I should
- Consult my solicitor first or should I only use solicitor if SEO guy attempts to recover the monies owed?
- Revoke any access to my sites and social media accounts.
- Say I am ending the contract because I am not happy with the work done. Do this via a letter in writing or via email?

I just need confirmation of the correct order in which to proceed.

Many thanks for your input guys!

 

[fisicx]

Revoke Access, stop payments, write to them by recorded delivery and email.

MOZ analytics is pointless - a complete waste of time. Meta descriptions won't help your ranking (they have other purposes but ranking isn't one of them).

They aren't keeping records because they aren't doing any work.

 

[jo_max]

MOZ analytics is pointless

Can you explain why MOZ analytics and other tools are pointless for a newbie? I would like to know that

I've been using last 4 years (other tools too) and have seen great benefit of them. As long as you know what you are doing.

 

[fisicx]

MOZ Analytics doesn't help you get more business. It's no good to for analysing the effects your campaigns. It doesn't tell you which keywords get the best conversions.

You will get far better data from your site analytics. For example, it will show you who visited your site from facebook, what they did and if they converted.

 

[threenine]

He has put my website into MOZ analytics. He let it run for a month and sent me 1 or 2 reports on competitors and keywords. Written a few meta descriptions and title tags. I asked for a report on this (all content he has added to the site) and he has not ben able to produce it in over a week.

I keep thinking to myself , why would you do work and not keep record of it for easy access. At least for back up purposes.

So I should
- Consult my solicitor first or should I only use solicitor if SEO guy attempts to recover the monies owed?
- Revoke any access to my sites and social media accounts.
- Say I am ending the contract because I am not happy with the work done. Do this via a letter in writing or via email?

I just need confirmation of the correct order in which to proceed.

Many thanks for your input guys!

There is no need to engage a solicitor! That is just going to be further expense!

Steps to Action
Revoke any access to sites and social media accounts.

Say I am ending the contract because service delivery is not meeting expectations. Do this via a letter in writing and via email?

 

[Allegro]

Sorry to hear of your travails- the PPH bit sounded alarm bells when I read it.
As has been said, it would do little good to name the company/individual on here- would it be possible to PM me with their ID?

 

[10032012]

Leave META alone!!! This is pre-Google era. Why rank a webpage based on keywords provided by the webmaster?! Obviously open to abuse. Even back then sticking your prefer keywords in meta keywords or within meta description didn't even guarantee you results.

Some SEO might argue but Google ignores META and grabs a snippet from your page... if its unable to do so or if you use "nosnippet" it will use the meta description (if one exists). Its just a waste of transfer.

Google is more bothered about the text of your links to categorise a page, which is how some pages can rank well for keywords not even remotely mentioned on them! (i.e. Googlebomb etc.)

 

[zigojacko]

Joining the party late here but as others have already said, instantly from the contract/proposal I can see that this is another clueless bedroom wannabe with no real depth of knowledge of what should go into a campaign that will improve the performance of a website in search.

You'll see no major work nor any benefits from this after 6 months so terminate with immediate effect if you can.

 

[da8iwr]

Even though I agree with this company is taking the Mick, the main thing they have failed with is keeping you informed (proving they have done the work, which is stupid of them).
SEO is a long term thing, and you shouldn't really be getting much of a response yet, it would take much longer. But if he isn't sending you info on what he is doing, then I would sack him off for sure, I probably would have a long time before now.The contract is a mess, if it wasn't addressed to you, your name wasn't on the top, then it is void, if he isn't doing what he says on the contract, then it is void, but, it could take a lot to prove he isn't, and your personal opinion on him should be kept to a minimum, including if you don't "trust him" as that is just an opinion until proven.If it goes to a court room, you need the black and whites, and the above issues are enough to stop him winning... if you tried to say the work isn't to a high enough standard and want a refund, it will go to Arbitration, as it is not that he hasn't done the work, its that it is not to your satisfaction. So it will need a third party to first of all understand what the work is, what was done, and what percentage of the payment is due either from you to him or him to you.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1996/23/section/1This process costs thousands of pounds, and he will never go through with it for a remaining £1500.

Regarding Meta Tags that are mentioned earlier, the Keyword Tag is not used at all, as Google announce here in their video

But the Description tag is used a lot, as mentioned here

You can listen to the bedroom specialists all night, but in real life, just listen to what the horse is saying from its mouth, you get 30 mins for free with a solicitor, make an appointment and speak to one, they will tell you straight away if you have a case as they don't want to waste much time if you haven't.
For lots of info on SEO, this video by Matt Cutts (the head of SEO and web spam at Google) at a Wordpress conference is brilliant, it dismisses many of the wives tales!

 

[tumbledown]

Going back to your first post, the reason your new site received less traffic than the old one may be down to something as simple as changed urls.

If the designer of the new site lost some old pages, created new ones or changed some urls, it could be that a page was lost that had a good link to it that brought lots of traffic.

It's definitely worth checking the old urls against the new ones and creating redirects if necessary.

 

[erictwendell]

hey guys is you can try a freelancer to do the same work.

 

[erictwendell]

Is it possible to get these sort of work through the free freelancer??

 

[fisicx]

hey guys is you can try a freelancer to do the same work.

And why would this be any better? Most freelancers provice just as poor a service as anyone else.

 

[erictwendell]

And why would this be any better? Most freelancers provice just as poor a service as anyone else.

I don't believe this man. Ask hem to report weekly and pay them weekly..So if suppose you don't like their quality of work you can cancel the project..
At least it will let you examine the new worker in affordable way..you can say

 

[fisicx]

That's just bonkers. SEO can take months to have any effects, what use will a weekkly report be? In any case, the first few weeks will be keyword research and competitor analysis. Then there is all the on-site optimisation and finally all the off-site work. Anyone who is prepared to work on a weekly contract is going to be a bottom feeder link builder and to be avoided at all costs.