Health and Safety?

[fastprint.co.uk]

What do company's do who have 20 - 30 people working for them in regards to health and safety.

We have had a quote off peninsula but they want to put us into a 5 year deal at £160+ VAT a month.

For that we get help

• Putting a staff handbook in
• Doing a site review and helping us put things right (traffic light type document)
• When we introduce new machines I believe (they said they would) help us put new policy in for them
• Yearly site visit
• Some type of online database but not sure we really need this
• lastly insurance

The issue is that to me this is £10k and should I just get someone local, what do other company's do?

 

[Caledonian TV]

In relation to 20-30 people, and given that you're running an industrial setting, £160 a month seems very cheap to me! - Can you clarify; you're saying this includes insurance? Exactly what kind of insurance?

 

[KAC]

Have you thought about getting a proposal from @Employment Law Clinic or @Newchodge ?

Probably have better feedback than Peninsula, mostly from people not happy about the long term nature of the agreement

 

[fastprint.co.uk]

But cheap for what, in my working out we are talking about one document created, 2 - 3 days on site, when we add a new machine a few hours help (which is rare). Yearly 1-2 day visit and online management system which to be honest is not really needed.

 

[Newchodge]

Is this purely health and safety support or does it include employment law support as well? £160 per month for 5 years (and Peninsula do not accept early cancellation) is £11,520.00, which seems like a lot just for health and safety initial assessments, a written policy and an annual site visit. What kind of insurance do you get?

 

[Caledonian TV]

What kind of insurance do you get?

That's the key question...

 

[fastprint.co.uk]

Yes just heath and safety it includes insurance

Insurance policy, to protect against legal expenses in the event of
enforcement action by the Health & Safety authorities. We will provide a solicitor to
attend interviews under caution or to defend any safety prosecutions or enforcement
action.

Covers legal expenses, up to £200,000 per insured event and a maximum of £2 million in any one policy year, for incidents that may occur following you becoming a client. The cover includes legal support in responding, defending and appealing against formal health and safety notices, interviews under caution and representation in court, should the need arise. As with any insurance cover, the policy conditions must be followed.

 

[Newchodge]

Yes just heath and safety it includes insurance

Insurance policy, to protect against legal expenses in the event of
enforcement action by the Health & Safety authorities. We will provide a solicitor to
attend interviews under caution or to defend any safety prosecutions or enforcement
action.

A legal expenses policy covering more than that should not be very expensive. You are entitled to a free solicitor to attend interviews under caution under the Legal Aid act. If you follow your H & S advisors advice (and I doubt if the insurance would cover you if you did not) what risk would there be of a H & S prosecution? And if there were usch a risk, should you be using them as advisors?

Can I advise you to be very careful about what you say to Peninsula salesmen as we have had many stories on here of businesses finding they were bound to a 5 year agreement without really meaning to have accepted it.

 

[Noah]

Do some investigation into Peninsula - be sure you know who they are and what you are committing to. If you are sure that this sort of package is what you want, perhaps consider an alternative such as Citation. For a cheaper, lower level of service, perhaps a membership organisation like the Federation of Small Business, or the Forum for Private Business?

 

[fastprint.co.uk]

I just think I need help in someone coming out and putting a booklet and processes in place (such as helping us do the risk assessments).

 

[The Byre]

Peninsula are described in many places as being pure rip-off artists that provide no real assistance or cover. I have no experience of them, nor do I wish to get involved with them, so I could not possibly comment on that assessment!

A simple H&S inspection can be yours for under £100 - call the council and they will recommend whomsoever they use themselves. That person will give you a list of things that you may need to fix.

99% is just common sense - fire extinguishers, clearly market exit routes, H&S laws and rules posted where all can see them, smoke detectors that are inspected annually, first aid kit and officer, central switch-off point for all electricity (e.g. an RCD) that is easily accessible, PAT inspection officer, light switches for main lights within that room, no obvious dangers, stuff like that.

 

[helper]

That seems expensive and wasteful. Most of the stuff is ready and easily available u can get it off the hse website for free. As you are rightly saying it's a couple of days work for them but may take you 2-3 weeks to put a good plan toghther. You would probably be better off doing it your self that way your staff can be involved with the procedure and processes key thing with health and safety and I suppose majority of the regulations in this country is u need almost everything documented and signed off. Etc etc and good record keeping. I doubt that company will do that for you it's all very good of them telling you they will set up things etc. And give you a insurance policy and solicitors really you would rather never hope to have to use them.
I assume you already have alot of stuff in place as it's quote a large company too me it is anyway so it's probably just needs re-looking at etc. And adding and improving things. Do they include first aid training awareness fire safety risks training in the above price if not then it's not really a full health and safety package for that cost its should kind of include all these things.

The most important and probably the thing that would make it alot easier for you is that online and app based part you don't think is needed in my opinion .

 

[KAC]

Peninsula is a salesman driven business. There is little doubt that they have professional staff as well but the person you initially see is a salesman who will put the fear of God in you.

 

[fisicx]

I just think I need help in someone coming out and putting a booklet and processes in place (such as helping us do the risk assessments).

Getting the assessment done is cheap as chips. I used to do them for factories and could do a complete review in under a day. You don't even need a booklet. If you mitigate the risks, do some training and put up posters you will be well covered.

If you feel confident you can do the assessments yourself. Everything you need to know is on the HSE website: http://www.hse.gov.uk/risk/index.htm

The actual risk assessment is the easy bit. What they expect you to do is reduce the hazard as far as practically possible. For example, making sure trip hazards are minimised by the use of walkways and good housekeeping.

Avoid Peninsular. They will tell you things like needing mandatory PAT and offer the service for £££ when there is no legal requirement to test any portable appliance (http://www.hse.gov.uk/myth/july.htm).

 

[Deleted member 59730]

I just think I need help in someone coming out and putting a booklet and processes in place (such as helping us do the risk assessments).

What I did was send a member of staff on a week's course. She did the whole thing in a day. As she stayed with me for over 20 years it was pretty good value.

The only time we were ever inspected was when we had a schoolkid on work experience. The H&S inspector praised us for being one of the few fully compliant businesses he had seen.

 

[Caledonian TV]

Yes just heath and safety it includes insurance

...OK so this is basically 'tick boxing' your way through the exercise.

With 20-30 employees I would have imagined you'd have already long-since addressed OHSAS compliance and perhaps were looking to outsource the management of this. - In which case I'd be looking for a 18001 set and appropriate ongoing support. - From what you've said, the cover doesn't amount to much and nor does the support!!

I just think I need help in someone coming out and putting a booklet and processes in place (such as helping us do the risk assessments).

There should be rather more depth to it if you want to get beyond the bare bones

http://www.lrqa.co.uk/images/8924-.pdf

The above is probably overkill, but certainly provides ample points for reflection. If you're employing outside consultants, then really that's the sort of direction and standards they should be taking your working practices towards; but, as fisicx has pointed out, what the law actually requires is some considerable distance from this.

We support a maximum crew size of 10 (it varies depending what's on) and are mainly working in the field. - Very often, being able to demonstrate that we can meet or exceed the 18001 standards is pivotal to whether we can get the work at all. - Many of our clients have a need to maintain OHSAS 18001 and ISO9001 certification; so we need to be able to 'plug right in' to that sort of system... But, if all you want is to stay within the law; start with the HSE guidelines. If you feel you need insurance, see an insurance broker! And find out what a policy covering those risks actually demands of you! - You might even find that you have cover already!

 

[MikeJ]

Yes just heath and safety it includes insurance

Insurance policy, to protect against legal expenses in the event of
enforcement action by the Health & Safety authorities. We will provide a solicitor to
attend interviews under caution or to defend any safety prosecutions or enforcement
action.

Covers legal expenses, up to £200,000 per insured event and a maximum of £2 million in any one policy year, for incidents that may occur following you becoming a client. The cover includes legal support in responding, defending and appealing against formal health and safety notices, interviews under caution and representation in court, should the need arise. As with any insurance cover, the policy conditions must be followed.

So that's just some cover against an H&SE action. Just to put that in to perspective, we had an incident about 4 years ago which involved a guy being off work for two weeks. We reported that to the H&SE and told then what we were doing about it, and they never got in contact. You're going to have to do something pretty major to need that insurance.