Golf Club Subscription Refund due to Lockdown.

[Drinkwater2]

Hi All,

Can anyone give me a definitive answer as to whether members of a golf club (which is a limited company and all members hold 1 share) are entitled to a pro-rata refund of their subscription fees for the period that we were unable to play because of lockdown? This link to the CMA seems to say that I am?

https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...c-consumer-contracts-cancellation-and-refunds

If the T & C's say something along the lines of "we will do our best to make sure the facilities are available but if circumstances beyond our control prevent this so be it," does this get them off the hook?

Thanks in advance,

 

[fisicx]

Looks like it gets them off the hook.

 

[Newchodge]

It will depend entirely on the wording (all of it) of the contract.

 

[AlanJ1]

Can you not just see this as an investment in your golf club?
I know for a fact if I asked for a refund (I would probably get it), but I would be pretty hated for it.

 

[Financial-Modeller]

While they were maintaining greens and buildings through lockdown, did they make a profit @Drinkwater2 ?

 

[Frank the Insurance guy]

Even if you were entitled to it, I would caution against enforcing it. If you plan on continuing to play at the club, you will never have the opportunity to moan about the state of the course, greens or facilities if you are the one taking the money out of the club.

Comes down to need - do you need the cash more than the club?

 

[IanSuth]

I have had fully paid membership of 2 rugby clubs (1 i train and play at, 1 my daughter does but she has to have an adult sponsor member), I would not dream of asking for a refund despite no contact rugby since March 20 (and i renewed both last summer) as the pitches still need maintenance, the building heating and maintaining etc plus they are making no income from bar/food sales.
I want them both to still exist in September when next season starts (plus daughter has had online strength & conditioning throughout)

 

[Drinkwater2]

Hi All,

Thanks for your replies. There is a slightly bigger picture that I didn't explain in the first post. The Club is on a knife edge financially, in fact a lack of funds is seeing a steady decline in standards and presentation. The Club has 505 paying members and 131 "Senior Life Members" who pay nothing and will use the facility for free for as long as they want. The criteria for becoming an SLM was, you've reached the age of 65 and have been a member for 25 years plus. Back in 1994 the Club realised this was unsustainable and altered the concession to a "discount" for anyone who joined after March 1995. That discount is 20% (off £1200 annual subscription.) It is now a source of great ill-feeling amongst the paying members that the "old guard," who had the privilege of being members when the Club had an 8 year waiting list, now don't contribute at all. There is a large number of members who feel it needs a reset which would be achieved by making it bankrupt.... new owners, new rules.

I am fully paid up for this year and last, but wondered if the threat of a large scale refund to the paying members might be the tool we need to make the SLM's either dip in their pockets or see the Club under new ownership and forfeit their free golf.

If all was well I wouldn't dream of asking for a refund.

I guess I need to lay my hands on a copy of the T's & C's and check the wording?

Thanks.

 

[IanSuth]

Personally if i was on the Committee at the club I would be sending a letter to all those 131 SLM saying " i know you have had free membership for up to the last 25 years but other members have not and with the pandemic and enforced closure this has left us in a perilous financial situation - we would like to ask you to make a donation to the club to ensure you are able to continue your playing in the future" and see what the response is.

 

[Drinkwater2]

Hi Ian,

I believe a letter asking for donations/contributions has been sent out. Not sure what the uptake has been. I believe in an ordinary year the Club does get voluntary contributions from the SLM's of around £8000 from the 131 of them. Average £61 each vs £1200!

 

[eteb3]

I'd be thinking about winding up the existing club (75% majority needed probably, but check the articles at Companies House and any other rules). That way you end the SLMs' relationship with the club (because it ceases to exist) and there is no breach of contract that they can lean on.

Club 2 takes over the assets and everything else and everyone gets new memberships in the new club on new terms. Legally pricey I'm sure.

You've got the 75% majority in principle, but I'm guessing you can predict more SLMs than paying members will turn up for the vote.

Possibly finding some other benefit of reincorporation (eg, transfer to a Community Benefit Society model, which is more flexible in some ways and definitely better suited to a club) might sugar the pill. (Though nb it's not strictly necessary: the existing club could choose to re-register - but that would not extinguish the liabilities.)

 

[Drinkwater2]

Hi eteb3,

Forcing a windup is the way many members are thinking but you're quite correct, the SLM's will be out in force and you always get apathy from too many rank and file members. Apparently the SLM's could vote to change the mems and arts to abolish the status but they would be the only ones allowed to vote and it would need 90% of them in favour? Do you know if that percentage is correct?

The $64,000 question remains, are we entitled to a pro rata refund? Everything in this article seems to suggest we are entitled.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...c-consumer-contracts-cancellation-and-refunds

Thanks for you input.

 

[eteb3]

it would need 90% of them in favour? Do you know if that percentage is correct?

As on another thread, I don't recognise 90pc from anywhere: you'd expect 75pc to vary class rights, or 100pc if the term is fully entrenched. As it came from counsel perhaps there's case law that lies behind it? You also need to think about where the SLM membership is set out: is it in the company's own articles, or is it in rules of the club?

are we entitled to a pro rata refund?

On the face of it I would think so. You may even be able to repudiate your membership altogether, and en masse that would be pretty powerful. But it will all depend on the precise words of the contract. In clubs there is often the extra difficulty that long-established practice has varied the written contract, and there are usually other considerations than a straightforward contract for services. Others may know better but I'd be thinking about advice from a specialist club lawyer: Wrigley's in Leeds have expertise, or @prophet01 may recommend the people he's been dealing with.

the SLMs will be out in force

Could consider a written resolution, if not precluded by the articles? If it's online, might make life easier for the non-SLMs and a bit harder for them? Check the Companies Act but iirc since 2006 everything that once had to be done at a meeting can now be done in writing, and the arts can't oust that provision.

 

[Drinkwater2]

Thanks to those who contributed. A little more quiet digging has left me in no doubt the Club is in a highly vulnerable position. There are no T&C's, you simply agree to abide by the Mems and Arts upon becoming a member. There is nothing anywhere that covers them for "circumstances beyond our control." On the website it says "Benefits of becoming a member - play our wonderful course every day." Ummmm... what to do now?

 

[UKSBD]

You may find the "Members Club" is a completely different entity to whoever owns the land, the course the buildings, the facilities, etc.

You might well be able to force the "Members Club" in to insolvency, the main entity , then just creates a new club and probably has a list of all the people causing the trouble.