Getting fed up paying loads of tax

[Gordon - Commercial Finance]

Or like that person wanting to buy a house from company funds, they want the money now and won't take advice on keeping tax bill down.

Oh yeah remember that guy! Wonder what happened there.

I thought corporation/dividends tax would work out over 40% on 200k profit though for example?

I would say more like 22%. Maybe 25%.
Can't speak for the 200k club but at less than 100k it can be about 15% depending on how you structure it.

 

[dan19900]

Oh yeah remember that guy! Wonder what happened there.



I would say more like 22%. Maybe 25%.
Can't speak for the 200k club but at less than 100k it can be about 15% depending on how you structure it.

Looks like over 40% to me for corp tax+dividends on 200k after a quick look at the online calculators. I don't see how you'd structure it to pay less than 25%.

 

[sirearl]

Yes people who have no intention of working and are playing the system. it.

LOL that would be about 70% of the working population,maybe a tad more.

 

[MikeJ]

I would suggest speaking your current accountant and other accountants who can give you specific advice on your business and personal tax situation which I am sure you will not want to divulge on a open public forum.

Why? We don't know who he is. What difference would it make?

 

[Mr D]

Oh yeah remember that guy! Wonder what happened there.



I would say more like 22%. Maybe 25%.
Can't speak for the 200k club but at less than 100k it can be about 15% depending on how you structure it.

For lower earners it can be well under 30% overall.
We have that large tax free allowance and VAT doesn't apply on all spending.
Lets see, 12% council tax, call it 5% VAT, perhaps 5% income tax, maybe 7% NI....

 

[Gordon - Commercial Finance]

For lower earners it can be well under 30% overall.

I've managed less than 20% before

 

[Mr D]

I've managed less than 20% before

As have I, but not consistently.
The weeks I was on £10 a week were very low tax. As in under a pound.

 

[Gordon - Commercial Finance]

The weeks I was on £10 a week were very low tax. As in under a pound.

Ouch.

 

[dan19900]

For lower earners it can be well under 30% overall.
We have that large tax free allowance and VAT doesn't apply on all spending.
Lets see, 12% council tax, call it 5% VAT, perhaps 5% income tax, maybe 7% NI....

Low earners probably won't be making a thread on a forum regarding setting up an offshore company though.

 

[Ian J]

Low earners probably won't be making a thread on a forum regarding setting up an offshore company though.

You'd be surprised. My neighbour was a plumber and I was chatting to him one day on the drive of his four bedroomed detached house whilst he was washing his 5 series BMW and he was complaining like mad about the £1,500 tax bill that he was going to have to pay

 

[MikeJ]

So he wasn't a low earner?

 

[Mr D]

Low earners probably won't be making a thread on a forum regarding setting up an offshore company though.

Envious people might.

Low earning is somewhat subjective. Does a solicitor on £50k consider themselves on low pay? Does a shop worker on £10k consider themselves on low pay?
Does someone subsidised by the government for their entire life consider themselves on low pay?

 

[Gordon - Commercial Finance]

his four bedroomed detached house whilst he was washing his 5 series BMW and he was complaining like mad about the £1,500 tax bill that he was going to have to pay

Well you just can't hide debt!

 

[Paul Norman]

Well if you're happy to pay more tax then you can pay some of mine if you like? I wouldn't exactly call paying 40%+ tax a bargain to be honest.

No. But I would consider helping you with reading and understanding what people are saying.

I am happy to pay tax so that society can support those who are vulnerable, and in need, and so that we can have an NHS, and fire brigades, and that kind of thing.

And 40 percent tax only kicks in when....oh, you know what? You wouldn't understand

 

[Mr D]

No. But I would consider helping you with reading and understanding what people are saying.

I am happy to pay tax so that society can support those who are vulnerable, and in need, and so that we can have an NHS, and fire brigades, and that kind of thing.

And 40 percent tax only kicks in when....oh, you know what? You wouldn't understand

And any one of us can have an illness, accident, suffer loss etc such that suddenly we become one of society's vulnerable. Nothing you can do to prevent it, if it happens would people want help as and when needed?

 

[Deleted member 59730]

I am happy to pay tax so that society can support those who are vulnerable, and in need, and so that we can have an NHS, and fire brigades, and that kind of thing.

Paying lots of tax is a sign of success.

 

[dan19900]

No. But I would consider helping you with reading and understanding what people are saying.

I am happy to pay tax so that society can support those who are vulnerable, and in need, and so that we can have an NHS, and fire brigades, and that kind of thing.

And 40 percent tax only kicks in when....oh, you know what? You wouldn't understand

I understand what people are saying, I just disagree with it. Tax system is terrible in my opinion, poor people obviously don't contribute much, rich people leave the country or have elaborate schemes so they don't have to contribute so it's just business owners earning around 50-300k per year and any high earner on PAYE who get rinsed.

 

[Newchodge]

I understand what people are saying, I just disagree with it. Tax system is terrible in my opinion, poor people obviously don't contribute much, rich people leave the country or have elaborate schemes so they don't have to contribute so it's just business owners earning around 50-300k per year and any high earner on PAYE who get rinsed.

Is that why you live in the Philippines?

 

[dan19900]

Is that why you live in the Philippines?

Not the main reason but I certainly pay a lot less tax now.

 

[SteveHa]

Then go to a country with no/negligible taxation and see how you like having to pay for every service that you use. No free healthcare, no police working for the good of the community, no armed forces for protection (don't forget your pitchfork), etc. etc.

 

[Mr D]

I understand what people are saying, I just disagree with it. Tax system is terrible in my opinion, poor people obviously don't contribute much, rich people leave the country or have elaborate schemes so they don't have to contribute so it's just business owners earning around 50-300k per year and any high earner on PAYE who get rinsed.

If rich people leave the country then there is no reason for them to carry on contributing to the country is there? They can contribute instead to whatever country they are living in.

Poor people don't necessarily contribute a lot individually in any one year. There are however a lot of them so collectively they pay a lot.

Elaborate schemes by rich people - you mean like owning a business that has say 20% or less tax rate? Or getting paid part wage and part dividend? Or putting money by into a pension scheme? Or using ISAs?

 

[dan19900]

If rich people leave the country then there is no reason for them to carry on contributing to the country is there? They can contribute instead to whatever country they are living in.

Poor people don't necessarily contribute a lot individually in any one year. There are however a lot of them so collectively they pay a lot.

Elaborate schemes by rich people - you mean like owning a business that has say 20% or less tax rate? Or getting paid part wage and part dividend? Or putting money by into a pension scheme? Or using ISAs?

I mean people like Philip Green etc.

No, like multiple offshore companies or getting a bank in your dogs name.
I'd love for you or your friend to show me how someone earning over 200k per year can pay less than 25% tax from salary/dividends like he claimed though.

 

[Mr D]

I mean people like Philip Green etc.

No, like multiple offshore companies or getting a bank in your dogs name.
I'd love for you or your friend to show me how someone earning over 200k per year can pay less than 25% tax from salary/dividends like he claimed though.

You mean the non owner of a business based outside the EU married to a woman who lives in a foreign land? That Philip Green?

 

[estwig]

I like paying tax and vat and subbies and builders and webhosts and marketing guys and google and voipfone and cad monkeys and everyone else.

If I'm earning, everyone is earning!

 

[Gordon - Commercial Finance]

I mean people like Philip Green etc.

No, like multiple offshore companies or getting a bank in your dogs name.

That's enough daily mail for today I think.

 

[dan19900]

That's enough daily mail for today I think.

Lol hardly, just searched 'Philip Green tax avoidance' and The Guardian is first

You mean the non owner of a business based outside the EU married to a woman who lives in a foreign land? That Philip Green?

Yeah, sending your wife to live in a tax haven and putting her down as director whilst you're CEO and charging your UK based retailer companies rent from offshore companies sounds fairly elaborate to me.

 

[Mr D]

Lol hardly, just searched 'Philip Green tax avoidance' and The Guardian is first

The Guardian are always annoyed that he doesn't have ownership of his wife's assets and that she lives in a country with different taxes than UK.

 

[dan19900]

The Guardian are always annoyed that he doesn't have ownership of his wife's assets and that she lives in a country with different taxes than UK.

Well it doesn't bother me, I do basically the same. I'm just saying the middle-high earners are the ones getting rinsed with 40-50% tax rates. The really rich pay little-nothing.

 

[Mr D]

Well it doesn't bother me, I do basically the same. I'm just saying the middle-high earners are the ones getting rinsed with 40-50% tax rates. The really rich pay little-nothing.

It bothers the Guardian. Just don't ask about their own tax affairs there.

The really rich pay little - nothing that merely adds up to what percentage of government income?
The top 1% pay over a quarter of the income tax. Perhaps a set rate should be used an everyone can pay their own fair share then.
What do the 1% get for paying so much income tax? Do they get 25 times faster rubbish removal? Able to drive 25 times faster on the M25? A 25 times better seat on the number 41 bus?

The top 10% pay 60 percent of the total income tax.

Where exactly is this little - nothing shown?

https://www.ft.com/content/afd88af6-3645-11e7-99bd-13beb0903fa3

 

[Gordon - Commercial Finance]

The gov gets about 44 billion a year in income tax revenues from the 0%, 20%, 40% system.
They would get the same if everyone just paid 21.5% on everything. That sounds fair to me. In fact they would probably get more as 40% people wouldn't need to the and avoid.

 

[Gordon - Commercial Finance]

'Philip Green tax avoidance'

Nothing wrong with a bit of tax avoidance. In fact, your pension is a tax avoidance scheme....

Its tax evasion that is illegal.

 

[billmccallum1957]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_rates

The OP can take a look at what other countries rates are and move there.

 

[Energise Accounting]

Overall i think the UK tax system is pretty fair. And the UK is one of the best countries in the world to live in.

If you think you are paying to much tax now you better hope Jeremy Corbyn dose not get elected or you will be paying a lot more.

As already mentioned the amount of money paid out in benefits is not a huge it is just a popular vote winner.

 

[Mr D]

Nothing wrong with a bit of tax avoidance. In fact, your pension is a tax avoidance scheme....

Its tax evasion that is illegal.

The Guardian journalists and comment people tend to see tax avoidance and tax evasion as the same thing.
And woe betide if a company pays less than the Guardian knows they should pay. Forget legality, they want moral taxes.

 

[Mr D]

Overall i think the UK tax system is pretty fair. And the UK is one of the best countries in the world to live in.

If you think you are paying to much tax now you better hope Jeremy Corbyn dose not get elected or you will be paying a lot more.

As already mentioned the amount of money paid out in benefits is not a huge it is just a popular vote winner.

We'd lose the corporate tax subsidy for a start.

Be interesting to see Corbyn try seizing a company to nationalise it when its owned by another state.

 

[dan19900]

It bothers the Guardian. Just don't ask about their own tax affairs there.

The really rich pay little - nothing that merely adds up to what percentage of government income?
The top 1% pay over a quarter of the income tax. Perhaps a set rate should be used an everyone can pay their own fair share then.
What do the 1% get for paying so much income tax? Do they get 25 times faster rubbish removal? Able to drive 25 times faster on the M25? A 25 times better seat on the number 41 bus?

The top 10% pay 60 percent of the total income tax.

Where exactly is this little - nothing shown?

https://www.ft.com/content/afd88af6-3645-11e7-99bd-13beb0903fa3

I don't really understand your point, I said paying 40-50% tax is too high, so you're agreeing with me?

The really rich aren't included in your 1% figures as they have residency elsewhere and just spend 6 months or less living in the UK (like I do lol). Obviously any high earners on PAYE don't have much choice as I already said.

 

[Gordon - Commercial Finance]

The Guardian journalists and comment people tend to see tax avoidance and tax evasion as the same thing.
And woe betide if a company pays less than the Guardian knows they should pay. Forget legality, they want moral taxes.

The papers love a story about companies not paying tax. Remember Starbucks nearly got hung because they were seen to have not paid very much UK corp tax? No mention of the millions they have paid in income tax, employers NI, all the VAT they collect...

Saw a great news broadcast once where a tax expert was called in to comment on David Cameron having had "offshore investments" in some tax haven country. The tax expert put the news anchors firmly in their place saying "your headline should read: man makes moderate investment and pays all his tax". It was amazing. Worth finding on YouTube.

 

[Mr D]

I don't really understand your point, I said paying 40-50% tax is too high, so you're agreeing with me?

The really rich aren't included in your 1% figures as they have residency elsewhere and just spend 6 months or less living in the UK (like I do lol). Obviously any high earners on PAYE don't have much choice as I already said.

So the really rich that you claim don't live here - hey they don't need to pay here either.
The really rich who do live here they do pay here. They are included in the 1%.

 

[Mr D]

The papers love a story about companies not paying tax. Remember Starbucks nearly got hung because they were seen to have not paid very much UK corp tax? No mention of the millions they have paid in income tax, employers NI, all the VAT they collect...

Saw a great news broadcast once where a tax expert was called in to comment on David Cameron having had "offshore investments" in some tax haven country. The tax expert put the news anchors firmly in their place saying "your headline should read: man makes moderate investment and pays all his tax". It was amazing. Worth finding on YouTube.

I remember when they had a go about David Cameron's father setting up investment overseas.
Like anyone controls their own father.

I don't get involved in my father's finances and he wouldn't want me butting into his business. He has no reason to discuss the matter with me or take my advice.
Anyone else have a father like that?

Anyone else like that themselves and would resent their kids sticking noses into your own financial matters?

 

[Gordon - Commercial Finance]

investment overseas

Overseas investment is like a dirty word! Probably most people who have an employee pension plan have overseas investments...