EU IOSS Signup

[romeo b]

The OSS is for EU state to EU state sales (or NI to EU/ EU to NI sales, because NI Protocol).

Literally just went back and re-read it, yep it was the OSS bit I was reading, not IOSS.

What a load of faffing about this!

I've just told people on our website if they're EU then to expect VAT Bills from 1st July

 

[NWH]

Literally just went back and re-read it, yep it was the OSS bit I was reading, not IOSS.

What a load of faffing about this!

I've just told people on our website if they're EU then to expect VAT Bills from 1st July

I have done the same. I am a small trader selling internationally. My product is £20< so the VAT charge makes it all but unmarketable in EU. So what is the point of going for IOSS registration and paying for another service provider on top of the additional VAT charges I have to make.

What the EU are doing is immoral. I am not registered for VAT so I am paying VAT twice. Once on purchase from my supplier, then again when I sell to EU. The only comfort I get out of this is the fact that I am in the same boat as thousands of other small traders.

Dont forget to warn your EU customers they can expect VAT PLUS courier handling charges. That is the killer blow as it will likely be higher that any VAT charge.

 

[romeo b]

I have done the same. I am a small trader selling internationally. My product is £20< so the VAT charge makes it all but unmarketable in EU. So what is the point of going for IOSS registration and paying for another service provider on top of the additional VAT charges I have to make.

What the EU are doing is immoral. I am not registered for VAT so I am paying VAT twice. Once on purchase from my supplier, then again when I sell to EU. The only comfort I get out of this is the fact that I am in the same boat as thousands of other small traders.

Dont forget to warn your EU customers they can expect VAT PLUS courier handling charges. That is the killer blow as it will likely be higher that any VAT charge.

Let me know what you eventually do, keep us posted. Keen to see - been asking lots of businesses and people we work with, and a lot are either VAT reg'd, or have EU sellers selling their products too, so not everything applies to us. But certainly <£20 items and non-VAT reg'd means you are similar to us, so will follow closely!

Using third parties is just stupid and seems like a "for now" exercise, obviously HMRC will have to introduce something or else EU-overseas trade is going to drop off a cliff, certainly for people like us.

 

[JPMiddleton]

We had a developer working on a Taxamo integration just incase that was the only option, and it appears to be working well for customers - collecting the correct % at checkout and working nicely.

Unfortunately I have yet to find out what their IOSS number is to actually despatch the parcels!

The API integration is for OpenCart and I believe the dev' is going to make it available on the OC marketplace shortly.

I tested Amazon.co.uk and .fr with some of our products and neither appeared to collect the relevant tax (Ireland 23% and France 20%), so maybe they are having teething issues.

 

[Sco]

Dont forget to warn your EU customers they can expect VAT PLUS courier handling charges. That is the killer blow as it will likely be higher that any VAT charge.

Yes it's the handling/admin fee that kills. I'm VAT registered and have been sending my £20-60 orders to the EU with tracking, I'm able to remove the UK VAT from the price so customers only pay their local import VAT. But the handling fee on top is 6-8EUR in Germany or over 20EUR in Belgium and Denmark. It doesn't matter how much I warn them, once they've been bitten they don't come back.

I'm poised to throw most of my inventory onto eBay and use their IOSS for now (until Deloitte actually replies to my enquiries about their service). I wonder how eBay sellers are getting on?

 

[Rory1966]

Anyone managed to sign up for IOSS via HMRC? Today was meant to be the day they launched their own registration service but I cannot find anything online

 

[romeo b]

I'm poised to throw most of my inventory onto eBay and use their IOSS for now (until Deloitte actually replies to my enquiries about their service). I wonder how eBay sellers are getting on?

Ebay appears to just be inserting the "IOSS: IM2760000742" onto the address field itself. The Pre-Reg Tax Scheme field on the specific field on the CN22 Customs field is empty. So at a glance this would be no scheme. How this is monitored I do not know. Maybe each item is scanned and the address field searched for the IOSS number. Surely the customs digital information should have the IOSS number in the actual Pre Reg Tax Scheme field though? I'm reluctant to manually add it in there as they have said we don't need to do anything (for Royal Mail Click + Drop)

The mind boggles.

Anyone managed to sign up for IOSS via HMRC? Today was meant to be the day they launched their own registration service but I cannot find anything online

It has not launched. See further up, it's the OSS one they aimed to have ready (EU to EU trade), not the IOSS. Basically, we are in limbo.

 

[Graham Wharton]

I'm reluctant to manually add it in there as they have said we don't need to do anything (for Royal Mail Click + Drop)

I thought it was going to be automatic too, but not sure. In the meantine you can add the IOSS number in your trading name section in C&D. If you have multiple integrations in C&D, create a trading name for each intergration and set the right IOSS number for only the eBay trading name. Once you do this, they will appear in the pre reg box on the CN22.

 

[Graham Wharton]

You can also put the Norway and Australia numbers in there too.

 

[japancool]

So what happens if you put in someone else's number?

 

[Graham Wharton]

Presumably when whoever works it out, someone will be in touch with you based on your return address?

 

[Graham Wharton]

This is what I use for my eBay C&D Trading Name

 

[romeo b]

This is what I use for my eBay C&D Trading Name

Thanks, I knew where it was, it's just eBay said RM would do it all - and RM said no need to do anything. I could add it there no problem, and split my "all orders" into two trading names, so ebay/own website, like you say. But my concern was we haven't been told to do it <shrug>

Guess it's not going to stop my stuff being rejected at customs, is it? So maybe I should just add it anyway.

The Australia one (which sometimes comes through on orders saying "ABN CODE PAID 64652016681" isn't on *all* eBay orders though for Australia. I don't know if this is going to be an "always there" thing from now on, or people have the option to *not* pay the VAT somehow. Hence eBay only providing it with the address. Do you know about that?

 

[Graham Wharton]

Yeah, it's a bit of a nightmare. I guess after a week of use, the answers to these questions may be clearer.

 

[Graham Wharton]

The bit I'm also unclear of, is how do we send out a commercial invoice for something that has been bought through eBay with IOSS. Surely we can't be expected to produce a VAT invoice with eBays VAT number on it. or do we send out a zero rated commercial invoice ex the eBay VAT, with a note saying the VAT was collected separately.

 

[romeo b]

The bit I'm also unclear of, is how do we send out a commercial invoice for something that has been bought through eBay with IOSS. Surely we can't be expected to produce a VAT invoice with eBays VAT number on it. or do we send out a zero rated commercial invoice ex the eBay VAT, with a note saying the VAT was collected separately.

That was my next question actually.. we send <£20 items through eBay, so they are regular C5 envelope (card backed). I'm not going to for now, but are we expected to put commercial invoices on everything in plastic pouches? Is there a threshold before that is a requirement? It is an enormous paper waste and I pretty much won't be doing it unless forced into it. And then we'll have a problem as it'll knock the dimensions from Letter into Large Letter

 

[JPMiddleton]

Can anyone confirm where to find Amazon's IOSS number? We've had some EU orders ready to go and from the links inside the order alerting us to it being an IOSS order, I cannot find the number anywhere.

 

[fallschirmjaeger]

Can anyone confirm where to find Amazon's IOSS number? We've had some EU orders ready to go and from the links inside the order alerting us to it being an IOSS order, I cannot find the number anywhere.

This is what amazon say:
Amazon’s Import One Stop Shop (IOSS) number will be made visible to you within your order details pages in Seller Central as of 01/07/2021."

 

[JPMiddleton]

EDIT - found it!

 

[Morning]

I'm now waiting to hear if IOSS logos are supposed to appear on pay-as-you-go Click & Drop labels, or if they just appear on the OBA C&D labels. My PAYG label didn't have the logo, despite being created from an Etsy integration, so I've no idea if the IOSS number has been included in the electronic data... I'm expecting a call back shortly once the C&D support have had a chat with their developers.

 

[romeo b]

Does it have a scannable QR code? If so, maybe just save it and run it through a QR decoder online, see if any information is stored in it

 

[romeo b]

Should stuff from before 1st July be getting VAT owed on it? Of everything we’ve dispatched this year we’ve had one item apparently subject to tax. But today had a return of a £39 item, with €18 tax owed (unclaimed item, customer said they didn’t attempt delivery nor leave a card). It landed in Italy 15th June and was returned to our office today.

 

[ADC]

Anyone knows what happens with business customers? On Amazon the IOSS number doesn't seem to appear on the order page when it's a business customer.

It makes it difficult on your website? How are you supposed to determine who is a business customer and who isn't?

 

[romeo b]

This is what I use for my eBay C&D Trading Name

Hi Graham, just coming back to this specific post - I have this IOSS no within my eBay treading name section, but eBay orders aren't coming through with them associated and using this number when I print a customs label off. The Pre Reg Tax Scheme field on the CN22 is blank still, despite the information matching yours.

Any ideas? Have you experienced this?

I disconnected the integration and reconnected it, etc.. no change.

Some orders also show the IOSS within the Click & Drop address field, but others don't - yet they all (on eBay itself) show the VAT paid bit under the customers address in the order information.

 

[Morning]

I don't think the intention is for the IOSS number to be in the Pre Reg Tax Scheme box *on the label*. The number needs to be kept secure, at least for IOSS numbers not associated with online marketplaces, so it wouldn't do to have it printed on a label.

I phoned Click & Drop again about the lack of IOSS logo on my label (they never called back yesterday), and this time I was told to phone next week as the lack of IOSS logo on PAYG C&D logos is still being investigated. Ho hum...

Edited for clarity.

 

[romeo b]

I don't think the intention is for the IOSS number to be in the Pre Reg Tax Scheme field. The number needs to be kept secure, at least for IOSS numbers not associated with online marketplaces, so it wouldn't do to have it printed on a label.

I phoned Click & Drop again about the lack of IOSS logo on my label (they never called back yesterday), and this time I was told to phone next week as the lack of IOSS logo on PAYG C&D logos is still being investigated. Ho hum...

What is the point of the field then? I have set test ones up for my own WooCommerce store and it doesn't inherit from there either.

So the field just prints blank irrespective.

Also some eBay orders show the IOSS, some don't (stupidly within the address), yet they all say tax paid.

However I did notice an order on eBay from Spain today with no mention of tax collected and no IOSS number provided.

So to look at the actual order in your hand in an envelope, it will show no IOSS within the address, and nothing within the "Pre Reg Tax Scheme" field on the CN22 - plus, I decoded a QR code online and can't see anything in there - can see the address in plain text but no IOSS no.

RE the field, it literally says "Pre-registration tax schemes & IOSS" as the description for the text box. Surely that's the EU eBay IOSS no to enter there, like Graham's photos above?

PS how do you mean "IOSS logo"? As in a symbol to indicate it's paid as a quick glance option for customs handling?

PS image of RM information attached, which says what I was thinking.

This suggests (to me) that it should carry the information through and populate it on the CN22 in that field? Regardless of how you use it.

 

[Morning]

I think the Pre Reg field on the label is used for Norway VIES numbers, and maybe Australia and NZ GST. I mean the IOSS number doesn't appear on the label, not that you shouldn't enter the IOSS number in the field where RM told you to enter it.

According to Royal Mail, if a label was created with an IOSS number in the data, there should be a wee black IOSS logo between two lines below the addresses. They said they'd seen it appear correctly on OBA C&D labels, but it didn't appear on my PAYG C&D label. It won't be for customs handling (the number is in the electronic data), just to indicate to - I guess - the person who bought the label that it counts as an IOSS label.

 

[Morning]

Edit to reply to an edit: Yes, you put the IOSS number in the appropriate place in C&D, as they tell you to do, but the number shouldn't appear on the label. IOSS numbers need to be kept secure for businesses that have their own, unique numbers. Otherwise, the number could be misused by others.

 

[romeo b]

I'm a bit lost tbh!

I have not seen a logo you describe on any of my items even when testing them now and never heard of such logo. Not sure where they would fit this anyway, there's not much free space as it is.

I generated a label with the eBay IOSS no within the "trading names > pre tax reg scheme" field, and then did the same again without the number there. Neither time the number was passed into the QR data (i used an online decoder) and all that changed was the consignment number by a couple of digits.

When I insert a "Test" pre-reg-tax-no onto my Website (not eBay) trading name, this isn't applied visually anywhere nor carried into the QR code itself.

I've emailed RM to ask. This is so frustrating it's beyond belief.

EDIT after your edit: but eBay are inserting the IOSS no. randomly into the address itself on orders (which in itself is annoying it actually interferes with the state/city/street name sometimes)? It's there sometimes, not in others. They've also publicly told it people so why hide it? They must have a way to monitor it being used for the right order.

 

[Morning]

We should probably be glad that a QR decoder doesn't show IOSS numbers, since they need to be secure.

I don't know why Ebay are doing what they're doing. IOSS numbers don't need to be in address fields on labels, they need to be in the electronic data. Maybe that's a hangover from how Norway VIES is handled.

Ebay can publicly state their IOSS numbers because they likely have a deal with RM to confirm which uses of the number are legit and which aren't. There's a note about it in the explanatory notes from the EU - marketplaces need to coordinate with the postal services to prevent misuse of their widely-known IOSS numbers, at least until a better system is worked out.

But if a non-marketplace IOSS number appeared on a label, that number would then be open to misuse.

Regarding the IOSS logo on labels, that info comes from here: https://help.parcel.royalmail.com/h...26577-Import-One-Stop-Shop-IOSS-in-Click-Drop As I said, they've confirmed to me it is appearing on some labels, and they're investigating why it's not appearing on others.

 

[ADC]

IOSS number is definitely showing on our click & drop labels. We use csv import from our system though we don't have a connection direct to eBay or Amazon.

Just to be clear though, we were told by our account manager that you can't use the old MP5 (International Signed) and MTA (Tracked & Signed) service codes with IOSS. You have to use MP9 (International Signed) and MTE (Tracked & Signed).

 

[romeo b]

I have tried generating labels with many services - MP7//MP9/MTE and none show the IOSS for eBay on the CN22 field, or within the address.

As said, decoding the physical QR data doesn't show anything that would indicate the IOSS is being passed unless it is greatly encrypted within a small string - everything else is plain text.

I was told I can also use the regular "standard" priority international airmail (OSA) services and it's fine to use with eBay and their "tax paid" system. But like I said, nothing showing on my labels anywhere.

That field on the CN22 must be for the IOSS number and they can monitor fraud through the shipping reference against the IOSS number surely, isn't that the whole point of going down a digital route?

I looked at your link:

Ebay integration: "We will automatically supply the IOSS in electronic customs, you do not need to do anything*"

For using your OWN IOSS - "Important Note: IOSS numbers are not printed on CN22 or CN23 customs documentation. Your label will carry the IOSS logo for eligible orders sent under the scheme, and the appropriate IOSS number will be transmitted in electronic customs."

However as said, when I test this for my own website sales by adding a bogus IOSS no into the trading names bit, I get no logo on the CN22's. Maybe this is verified somehow?

So are we guessing my eBay stuff is fine to send as it is then? Sounds like this logo you mention is for people sorting their own IOSS?

I need to clarify what is going on.. yet again..

 

[NWH]

Today, I am pointing EU customers to our eBay site as we do not have an IOSS registration number for our own site. When selling on eBay, do we need to now enable and use the eBay Global Shipping Service to activate EU VAT charges via eBay? Or can we leave, as we used to, and deal with EU order via eBay integrated with Drop & Click?

 

[romeo b]

Today, I am pointing EU customers to our eBay site as we do not have an IOSS registration number for our own site. When selling on eBay, do we need to now enable and use the eBay Global Shipping Service to activate EU VAT charges via eBay? Or can we leave, as we used to, and deal with EU order via eBay integrated with Drop & Click?

eBay automatically adds it onto the sale and shows it, but you don't need to use GSP. We don't and it shows just fine - although I am still trying to figure out why it's not showing on CN22 or looking like it's being passed - tbc..

 

[NWH]

eBay automatically adds it onto the sale and shows it, but you don't need to use GSP. We don't and it shows just fine - although I am still trying to figure out why it's not showing on CN22 or looking like it's being passed - tbc..

Thanks so much for that. I was heading for closure having to contemplate using GSP as well!

 

[Morning]

As said, decoding the physical QR data doesn't show anything that would indicate the IOSS is being passed unless it is greatly encrypted within a small string - everything else is plain text.

QR decoding is beyond me. Also, is the information in the QR code the same are the information in the bar code? Maybe it's the barcode that includes the IOSS number? But as I said, if Joe Bloggs could decode IOSS numbers from postal labels, that would be a *bad thing*.

That field on the CN22 must be for the IOSS number and they can monitor fraud through the shipping reference against the IOSS number surely, isn't that the whole point of going down a digital route?

Are you talking about the 'Pre Reg Tax Scheme' box on physical label? If you are, then no, the IOSS number shouldn't appear there. If that was your own unique IOSS number, would you want it displayed on every CN22 label you created? Because you need to keep that number safe, else some fraudster uses it.

I looked at your link:

Ebay integration: "We will automatically supply the IOSS in electronic customs, you do not need to do anything*"

For using your OWN IOSS - "Important Note: IOSS numbers are not printed on CN22 or CN23 customs documentation. Your label will carry the IOSS logo for eligible orders sent under the scheme, and the appropriate IOSS number will be transmitted in electronic customs."

However as said, when I test this for my own website sales by adding a bogus IOSS no into the trading names bit, I get no logo on the CN22's. Maybe this is verified somehow?

So are we guessing my eBay stuff is fine to send as it is then? Sounds like this logo you mention is for people sorting their own IOSS?

Good spot, maybe it does refer to IOSS numbers *not* sent direct from marketplaces, though that certainly isn't clear on the page. But the logo would go on the postal label if it's going to appear anywhere, not the CN22.

Regarding verification of IOSS numbers, postal services don't have any part in that - it's done by customs. So who knows why your label didn't have a logo. It might be that the C&D IOSS logo thing is just broken at the moment.

 

[romeo b]

QR decoding is beyond me. Also, is the information in the QR code the same are the information in the bar code? Maybe it's the barcode that includes the IOSS number? But as I said, if Joe Bloggs could decode IOSS numbers from postal labels, that would be a *bad thing*.



Are you talking about the 'Pre Reg Tax Scheme' box on physical label? If you are, then no, the IOSS number shouldn't appear there. If that was your own unique IOSS number, would you want it displayed on every CN22 label you created? Because you need to keep that number safe, else some fraudster uses it.



Good spot, maybe it does refer to IOSS numbers *not* sent direct from marketplaces, though that certainly isn't clear on the page. But the logo would go on the postal label if it's going to appear anywhere, not the CN22.

Regarding verification of IOSS numbers, postal services don't have any part in that - it's done by customs. So who knows why your label didn't have a logo. It might be that the C&D IOSS logo thing is just broken at the moment.

The problem is whatever anyone says, someone else comes along and says something is different for them.. eg: the 2 people here who say they've got the IOSS no. printing on the CN22 information, so why not me when doing it directly from C+D (eBay integration)?

I'm just trying to iron out potential problems now. Also with my order from earlier from Spain where there is no mention of tax paid, so what happens there? eBay either collect VAT or they don't - so why haven't they done it on this Spain order from today? Makes zero sense. It means I'm no better off with this particular order than using my website as it is (delivery duty unpaid/tax not accounted for). If I send this order, it will get held up presumably.

IOSS number is definitely showing on our click & drop labels. We use csv import from our system though we don't have a connection direct to eBay or Amazon.

Just to be clear though, we were told by our account manager that you can't use the old MP5 (International Signed) and MTA (Tracked & Signed) service codes with IOSS. You have to use MP9 (International Signed) and MTE (Tracked & Signed).

Can I just check - Is this for your own IOSS number, or eBay? Trying to work out if this is you selling via eBay and it showing the IOSS no on the physical customs label.

 

[ADC]

QR decoding is beyond me. Also, is the information in the QR code the same are the information in the bar code? Maybe it's the barcode that includes the IOSS number? But as I said, if Joe Bloggs could decode IOSS numbers from postal labels, that would be a *bad thing*.



Are you talking about the 'Pre Reg Tax Scheme' box on physical label? If you are, then no, the IOSS number shouldn't appear there. If that was your own unique IOSS number, would you want it displayed on every CN22 label you created? Because you need to keep that number safe, else some fraudster uses it.



Good spot, maybe it does refer to IOSS numbers *not* sent direct from marketplaces, though that certainly isn't clear on the page. But the logo would go on the postal label if it's going to appear anywhere, not the CN22.

Regarding verification of IOSS numbers, postal services don't have any part in that - it's done by customs. So who knows why your label didn't have a logo. It might be that the C&D IOSS logo thing is just broken at the moment.

There would be no point having a space on the CN22 for the IOSS number if it wasn't supposed to appear there.......

 

[Morning]

I'm talking about what *should* be happening, based on having read the explanatory notes issued by the EU. It may be the Ebay, Royal Mail etc. are doing something completely different!

 

[Morning]

There would be no point having a space on the CN22 for the IOSS number if it wasn't supposed to appear there.......

So you don't see a problem if unique IOSS numbers are on CN22 labels? It doesn't matter for marketplace IOSS numbers, but it sure does for other IOSS numbers!