Do not mess with a Judge

S

Steve Sellers

So what do all you liberal folk think of this?

http://www.thisishullandeastriding....tory-18167442-detail/story.html#axzz2Km2oEX00

I presume 16 months is too harsh, and it is just the judge on a powertrip!

Soft judges = soft sentences = violent crimes on our streets.

We need to start protecting the human rights of the victim, the public and not the criminal.

Lets bring it back for minor anti social behaviour and crime. Zero tolerance on minor crime will help stem the tide of little thugs and more serious criminals.

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cjd

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    So what do all you liberal folk think of this?

    Oh, hello. The word 'liberal' appears in the opening remarks. This is normally followed by extreme right-wing ravings. Let's see.

    I presume 16 months is too harsh, and it is just the judge on a powertrip!

    UK judges hear the entire case and have recourse to all the evidence, not just a single report in a local newspaper, so I'm happy to go along with him.

    Soft judges = soft sentences = violent crimes on our streets.

    [sigh] Judges do not make things up randomly. They operate to a set of published guidelines which define the range of punishments for each type of crime. GBH has its own guideline and the range of punishment will be increased or decreased by the specific events at the time, the character of the defendant and the harm he did.

    If it's felt by either side that the sentence is wrong, it gets appealed and changed. It's a system that works.

    We need to start protecting the human rights of the victim, the public and not the criminal.

    We can, and do, protect the human rights of both victim and criminal.

    Lets bring it back for minor anti social behaviour and crime. Zero tolerance on minor crime will help stem the tide of little thugs and more serious criminals.

    Yeh, right.
    The one thing we do actually know is that no matter how harsh the punishment is, crime still happens. What you are asking for is revenge, not a solution to crime.

    People commit crimes for a range of reasons and the vast majority of those reasons are not affected by a fear of future punishment for them. They're caused by drugs, anger, mental illness, fear and all manner of social conditioning.

    It's a rare crime that's committed in a planned and considered way and when they are committed in that way, they generally don't get caught.
    (But if they are caught, they get a far higher sentence in return for their pre-meditation.)
     
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    Steve Sellers

    Oh, hello. The word 'liberal' appears in the opening remarks. This is normally followed by extreme right-wing ravings. Let's see.

    Not right wing, just experience of living on the ground and working within the criminal justice system. I don't live in no gated community. ;)


    UK judges hear the entire case and have recourse to all the evidence, not just a single report in a local newspaper, so I'm happy to go along with him.

    If they are not looking at their nails or falling alseep - it happens I could name specific judges but I wont for obvious reasons.

    [sigh] Judges do not make things up randomly. They operate to a set of published guidelines which define the range of punishments for each type of crime. GBH has its own guideline and the range of punishment will be increased or decreased by the specific events at the time, the character of the defendant and the harm he did.

    It sure does. And the guideline for this case is 4-6 years. So a soft judge it is. Judges are ignoring the guidelines because our prisons are full. Dont believe that judges go by the guidelines all the time for one second, it's not how it works in practice.

    If it's felt by either side that the sentence is wrong, it gets appealed and changed. It's a system that works.

    Only if an appeal is won. Wish it were that simple.

    We can, and do, protect the human rights of both victim and criminal.

    Who is we? It's about balance. Look at the cost spent per year on a prisoner vs cost per year for an elderly person needing care. Makes me sick, when we treat criminals better than our old folk.

    Yeh, right.
    The one thing we do actually know is that no matter how harsh the punishment is, crime still happens. What you are asking for is revenge, not a solution to crime.

    No. You are partly right. But whilst somebody is in prison they cant actually commit crimes on the outside(not physically anyway). Prison does work - short term. Longer terms sentences make it work longer term.

    People commit crimes for a range of reasons and the vast majority of those reasons are not affected by a fear of future punishment for them. They're caused by drugs, anger, mental illness, fear and all manner of social conditioning.

    No they are not. But I am not advocating stiff punishments as a deterrent, but retribution. What is wrong with wanting a criminal justice system that exacts revenge by the way? Thats the whole point, and that why all courts were set up. The state takes revenge so the individual doesn't get all vigilante.

    It's a rare crime that's committed in a planned and considered way and when they are committed in that way, they generally don't get caught.
    (But if they are caught, they get a far higher sentence in return for their pre-meditation.)

    No because shoplifters go out everyday and do it on the spare of the moment. Burglars go out with crow bars for another purpose and "lose themselves in the moment".

    I'm not right wing, I just know these lil scallies need robust justice.

    Let me tell you a story. For a short period, I had to attend youth court in a northern crown court every friday. We had one client who for months claimed that he was innocent of inflicting a s18 assault on a homeless man. On the day of the trial I was sat down in the cells with him and the barrister. The barrister explained that if he pleaded guilty that day, he would get 5 years, as opposed to more like 7. He advised him to make the plea. The kid, despite the seriousness of what he had done(very nearly killed an old homeless man), smiled and laughed and said to me "yeah I did it". Why did you do it I asked? "For a laugh".

    As far as I am concerned people like that should be taken out the back of the court and the police should get medieval on their asses.

    It's nice that you are quite caring in your ways, it shows a certain humility. But it's perfect world stuff and in the jungle the lion eats first.
     
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    cjd

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    It sure does. And the guideline for this case is 4-6 years. So a soft judge it is.

    I don't know where you get this from. The statutory maximum for GBH is 5 years and there is no set minimum - it can be less than six months (but very, very unlikely).

    In practice the judge will hear precedents for similar circumstances from CPS and Defence and then come to a conclusion based on the particulars of the actual case.


    Who is we? It's about balance. Look at the cost spent per year on a prisoner vs cost per year for an elderly person needing care. Makes me sick, when we treat criminals better than our old folk.

    This is an off-topic rant.

    No. You are partly right. But whilst somebody is in prison they cant actually commit crimes on the outside(not physically anyway). Prison does work - short term. Longer terms sentences make it work longer term.

    They can commit plenty of crimes inside, learn how to be better criminals and leave as drug addicts too. Putting people in prison solves nothing at all - that's perfectly well evidenced. We just don't know what else we can do with them.

    No they are not. But I am not advocating stiff punishments as a deterrent, but retribution. What is wrong with wanting a criminal justice system that exacts revenge by the way? Thats the whole point, and that why all courts were set up. The state takes revenge so the individual doesn't get all vigilante.

    Well, I suppose you're being honest at least.

    Revenge and punishment have separate meanings. The justice system punishes in the hope that it will dissuade the individual and others not to reoffend - it does not seek revenge for its own sake.

    Let me tell you a story. For a short period, I had to attend youth court in a northern crown court every friday. We had one client who for months claimed that he was innocent of inflicting a s18 assault on a homeless man. On the day of the trial I was sat down in the cells with him and the barrister. The barrister explained that if he pleaded guilty that day, he would get 5 years, as opposed to more like 7. He advised him to make the plea. The kid, despite the seriousness of what he had done(very nearly killed an old homeless man), smiled and laughed and said to me "yeah I did it". Why did you do it I asked? "For a laugh".

    Some people are old fashioned evil. We haven't yet cured the human condition. He'll get the 5 years and be out in 2.5 - or more likely, he'll beat someone up in jail and get re-sentenced.

    As far as I am concerned people like that should be taken out the back of the court and the police should get medieval on their asses.

    Yes, a lot of people think that way and that's why we set up a system of justice that removes you from the equation.

    It's nice that you are quite caring in your ways, it shows a certain humility. But it's perfect world stuff and in the jungle the lion eats first.

    I assume you mean 'humanity' - which I'll happily accept. Humility isn't something I'm normally accused of having much of ;-)
     
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    Podge

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    "As far as I am concerned people like that should be taken out the back of the court and the police should get medieval on their asses."

    And who would benefit by this action, apart from yourself?

    It's very easy to take the moral high ground. Certainly easier than trying to understand the circumstances that brought the individual to the position they are in.

    Not everybody grows up in a loving home with mummy and daddy there to guide them.
     
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    Steve Sellers

    Ok I will make this quick, because the lake awaits me!

    I don't know where you get this from. The statutory maximum for GBH is 5 years and there is no set minimum - it can be less than six months (but very, very unlikely).

    I said s18. Thats the more serious offences. Offence Against the Person Act 1861 All to often the CPS will only pursue the s20 version (or worse s47)

    In practice the judge will hear precedents for similar circumstances from CPS and Defence and then come to a conclusion based on the particulars of the actual case.

    Yes they will but you cant deny judges often skip the guidelines. Its also a proven fact that black people and women get stiffer sentences for the same offence - which proves the guidelines mean littte.

    This is an off-topic rant.

    Absolutely, sometimes its good to get it off your chest.

    They can commit plenty of crimes inside, learn how to be better criminals and leave as drug addicts too. Putting people in prison solves nothing at all - that's perfectly well evidenced. We just don't know what else we can do with them.

    Agreed.


    Revenge and punishment have separate meanings. The justice system punishes in the hope that it will dissuade the individual and others not to reoffend - it does not seek revenge for its own sake.

    Thats not historically correct. There are different ideas about what the prison system is for. But rehab only became an "idea" after John Howard did his great trek throughout the prison system.

    Some people are old fashioned evil. We haven't yet cured the human condition. He'll get the 5 years and be out in 2.5 - or more likely, he'll beat someone up in jail and get re-sentenced.

    Agreed. Scum, sub-human scum.

    Yes, a lot of people think that way and that's why we set up a system of justice that removes you from the equation.

    I was being silly. I don't actually believe that. I strongly believe in justice for all and no torture etc.

    I assume you mean 'humanity' - which I'll happily accept. Humility isn't something I'm normally accused of having much of ;-)

    Both. :)

    Not everybody grows up in a loving home with mummy and daddy there to guide them.

    Yes I know. There is no excuses for it though. I don't go crying on about my background. Those are just obstacles in life. Life is a challenge and some people just look for excuses.
     
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    cjd

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    I said s18. Thats the more serious offences. Offence Against the Person Act 1861 All to often the CPS will only pursue the s20 version (or worse s47)

    All we have to go on is what is said in the newspaper report which described as GBH. It was drunken pub fight, involving a person of previous good character. No weapons were used, although the man had some some fighting skill. There was serious harm but no premeditation or prolonged beating.

    We're not in 5 year territory here but we're not in a Community Order either. He'll get longer for pleading not guilty.

    Guidelines aren't tramlines, the judge can use his judgement and vary from them if s/he thinks it's in the interests of justice to do so. If s/he does, s/he has to make the reasons clear in court and they can be appealed by either party.

    Thats not historically correct. There are different ideas about what the prison system is for. But rehab only became an "idea" after John Howard did his great trek throughout the prison system.

    I really wouldn't know about that - historically we used to pluck people's eyes out and cut off hands. We've sort of moved on and it's clear that we do distinguish between punishment and revenge.
     
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    People commit crimes for a range of reasons and the vast majority of those reasons are not affected by a fear of future punishment for them. They're caused by drugs, anger, mental illness, fear and all manner of social conditioning.
    Now you're getting all ideological! :) Good and evil do exist in this world, and not all crimes can be explained in terms of chemical or biological processes.

    And I would disagree with your premise about the reasons for crime. For sure, some crimes are 'spur of the moment', especially crimes of passion, for which future punishment may not come into the equation at all. On the other hand, I suggest it does come into the equation for premeditated crimes. Take the city of Kennesaw close to us. It's a city ordinance that homeowners must own a gun - and the city has one of the lowest break-in rates in the country. Clearly, potential burglars are dissuaded by a fear of being shot. How else would you explain this statistic?
     
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    ...historically we used to pluck people's eyes out and cut off hands. We've sort of moved on and it's clear that we do distinguish between punishment and revenge.
    In a world of total lawlessness, "an eye for an eye" does bring order to society. Call it an 'invisible fence' along the lines of the one that keeps our dogs in the back yard. The pain of crossing the line is very painful, but they soon understand to stay within bounds. Now society is different and ready for objective justice instead of pure revenge, and society develops further. As you point out, though, many see the legal system as surrogate revenge. Some go so far as to try to "love their enemies", although human nature often rebels against that. While this may be effective at the personal level, society still needs an objective system of justice.

    Has the pendulum swung too far too quickly? It's good that we don't pluck out eyes, but is it good that so many streets are off limits? It's good that self-defence and context are taken into account, but is it good that so many return to crime once their punishment is over? And should we be making decisions based on how full are our prisons?

    Of course, the world's not perfect and never will be. Judges will get it wrong sometimes, and some judges should never have been appointed. That's life, although it's reassuring when systems are in place to address such problems. I have to say, though, that I'm glad I'm not the one responsible for deciding the dividing line between the rights of society as a whole and the rights of the individual (victim and criminal alike). It must be a tough job with occasional no-win situations.
     
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    cjd

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    Now you're getting all ideological! :) Good and evil do exist in this world, and not all crimes can be explained in terms of chemical or biological processes.

    I wasn't aware that we can explain any crime in terms of chemical or biological processes can we? I'm pretty sure, as well, that good and evil don't exist in their own right - it's just people exhibiting behaviour that we approve or disapprove of.

    And I would disagree with your premise about the reasons for crime.
    For sure, some crimes are 'spur of the moment', especially crimes of passion, for which future punishment may not come into the equation at all. On the other hand, I suggest it does come into the equation for premeditated crimes.

    The underlying reasons for the majority of crime are fairly well known - poverty, poor parenting, social inequality, poor housing, drugs, alcohol, mental illness and so on.

    Some of the crimes that are committed are pre-meditated, the majority aren't - the majority are opportunist or simple human tragedies of punch ups, drug abuse, shoplifting, drink driving. The amount of crime that is organised and professional is quite low actually.

    Take the city of Kennesaw close to us. It's a city ordinance that homeowners must own a gun - and the city has one of the lowest break-in rates in the country. Clearly, potential burglars are dissuaded by a fear of being shot. How else would you explain this statistic?

    I wouldn't attempt to explain it without knowing more. But i see that yo say that it has 'one of the lowest' rather than 'the lowest' implying that other cities have lower but no obligatory gun ownership?

    It may also have completely different demographics than the average - higher incomes, lower unemployment, better housing etc etc.

    It may just be a fluke.

    I'm willing to have a small bet though, that they also have a high incident of accidental shootings, suicide and maybe even murder than average.
     
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    Steve Sellers

    All we have to go on is what is said in the newspaper report which described as GBH. It was drunken pub fight, involving a person of previous good character. No weapons were used, although the man had some some fighting skill. There was serious harm but no premeditation or prolonged beating.

    True. But those are mitigating factors. He is trained in Judo, his fists are classed as dangerous weapons - the case law supports this.

    We're not in 5 year territory here but we're not in a Community Order either. He'll get longer for pleading not guilty.

    For ruining a mans life? It most certainly is in my opinion. It's funny because I was talking about this thread with a neighbour when I went out earlier. He is a former police officer and now a screw. He agrees that the courts are giving light sentences as the prisons are full. Hull prison has had 2 wings closed! Not sure how you can argue causing brain damage, and life long disability is not worth of a 5 year sentence. It is really rather worrying if you are a mag - I just thank the Lord you are limited in sentencing powers (although not that you would use them so not sure why I say that). As I say before, I wonder how your liberal values would stand if you lived in the "ghetto", or one of these thugs did such a thing to a member of your family. The Courts should be there to protect the weakest in society - the poorest. But most poor people don't resort to crime, so all those arguments fall by the way side.

    I really wouldn't know about that - historically we used to pluck people's eyes out and cut off hands. We've sort of moved on and it's clear that we do distinguish between punishment and revenge.

    We? This again is about perception. What you think the justice system should be about is not necessarily what society wants. What the mob wants the mob gets. The justice system is run by the upper classes. Those who dont really need the protection of the police and courts as they dont live in such poor areas. Are the courts run for the ego of the judges, or for the majority?

    And I would disagree with your premise about the reasons for crime. For sure, some crimes are 'spur of the moment', especially crimes of passion, for which future punishment may not come into the equation at all. On the other hand, I suggest it does come into the equation for premeditated crimes. Take the city of Kennesaw close to us. It's a city ordinance that homeowners must own a gun - and the city has one of the lowest break-in rates in the country. Clearly, potential burglars are dissuaded by a fear of being shot. How else would you explain this statistic?

    Bang on.



    I wasn't aware that we can explain any crime in terms of chemical or biological processes can we? I'm pretty sure, as well, that good and evil don't exist in their own right - it's just people exhibiting behaviour that we approve or disapprove of.

    I agree. We all make our own choices.


    The underlying reasons for the majority of crime are fairly well known - poverty, poor parenting, social inequality, poor housing, drugs, alcohol, mental illness and so on.

    Total nonsense. Thats a total upper class view. How many sexual offences take place at the top of society and the perpetrators get away with it. That statement is pure stereotyping of poor people.

    Some of the crimes that are committed are pre-meditated, the majority aren't - the majority are opportunist or simple human tragedies of punch ups, drug abuse, shoplifting, drink driving. The amount of crime that is organised and professional is quite low actually.

    LOL most shoplifting isn't opportunist. It's done "professionally". When a smack head gets up they have only one aim for the day - to score. Thats not accidental. They go out with the intent to steal.

    Organised and professional - if you mean "mafia" then yes. But most is organised and planned. In my area I know for a fact that 3 people are responsible for hundreds upon hundreds of burglaries. They are total professionals.

    I'm willing to have a small bet though, that they also have a high incident of accidental shootings, suicide and maybe even murder than average.

    The US model is flawed. But I think that has to do with the American culture and persona. Gun ownership works very well in Switzerland and I believe Sweden have similar rules.
     
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    cjd

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    True. But those are mitigating factors. He is trained in Judo, his fists are classed as dangerous weapons - the case law supports this.

    Which would be one reason that it was charged as GBH and not simple assault. But there's not much point trying to guess from a half column page 5 article in a local newspaper is there?

    For ruining a mans life? It most certainly is in my opinion. It's funny because I was talking about this thread with a neighbour when I went out earlier. He is a former police officer and now a screw. He agrees that the courts are giving light sentences as the prisons are full. Hull prison has had 2 wings closed! Not sure how you can argue causing brain damage, and life long disability is not worth of a 5 year sentence. It is really rather worrying if you are a mag - I just thank the Lord you are limited in sentencing powers (although not that you would use them so not sure why I say that). As I say before, I wonder how your liberal values would stand if you lived in the "ghetto", or one of these thugs did such a thing to a member of your family. The Courts should be there to protect the weakest in society - the poorest. But most poor people don't resort to crime, so all those arguments fall by the way side.

    In your opinion what would be the appropriate sentence? 10 years?, 20? life? Execution? The problem is that if it was your husband, wife or child - there is no sentence big or violent enough. That's why justice is taken care of objectively by those not involved and NOT by the mob.

    The law is there to protect the public from the worst inclinations of the public. So luckily neither you, your neighbour, the screw or I get to be asked what we personally think the correct sentence should be.

    We? This again is about perception. What you think the justice system should be about is not necessarily what society wants. What the mob wants the mob gets. The justice system is run by the upper classes. Those who dont really need the protection of the police and courts as they dont live in such poor areas. Are the courts run for the ego of the judges, or for the majority?

    Be careful what you wish for. I doubt you'd like the justice of the mob. Remember that everyone in this country gets a trial if they say 'not guilty' to any charge. They then get to be judged by twelve ordinary members of the public - absolutely NOT the upperclass. The judge is the umpire not the jury.

    After the jury decides guilty or not, the judge sentences based on guidelines that try to ensure that nothing random happens.

    The beauty and genius of our system is that our law is independent of everything. That's you, me, the mob and government. It's one of our very best inventions. It works rather brilliantly.

    Total nonsense. Thats a total upper class view. How many sexual offences take place at the top of society and the perpetrators get away with it. That statement is pure stereotyping of poor people.

    You're off topic ranting again.

    LOL most shoplifting isn't opportunist. It's done "professionally". When a smack head gets up they have only one aim for the day - to score. Thats not accidental. They go out with the intent to steal.

    They steal to feed their habit. The cause is the habit.

    Organised and professional - if you mean "mafia" then yes. But most is organised and planned. In my area I know for a fact that 3 people are responsible for hundreds upon hundreds of burglaries. They are total professionals.

    Sure, those people exist and they're responsible for a lot of crime. How many are older than 25?
     
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    Steve Sellers

    Which would be one reason that it was charged as GBH and not simple assault. But there's not much point trying to guess from a half column page 5 article in a local newspaper is there?

    True, but we do know the injuries - that is enough to categorize the level of assault. Other facts are merely aggravating or mitigating features. They should not affect the charge, but merely the sentence.

    In your opinion what would be the appropriate sentence? 10 years?, 20? life?

    Just the CPS improving and charging under the correct section - not going for the easy guilty verdict. Some of the prosecutors I have seen are awful. I once saw a barrister in the crown attempt to charge my client (or my firms) with 4 different types of assault for the same incident. The whole court laughed at him.

    Execution? The problem is that if it was your husband, wife or child - there is no sentence big or violent enough. That's why justice is taken care of objectively by those not involved and NOT by the mob.

    Bang on. Excuse my earlier comments about the birch, they were not meant to be taken literally.


    The law is there to protect the public from the worst inclinations of the public. So luckily neither you, your neighbour, the screw or I get to be asked what we personally think the correct sentence should be.

    Well somebody has to ask! If the law is based on morality where does the basis for those morals come from? 20 years ago rape within marriage was legal.....are you still sure the law protects?

    Be careful what you wish for. I doubt you'd like the justice of the mob. Remember that everyone in this country gets a trial if they say 'not guilty' to any charge. They then get to be judged by twelve ordinary members of the public - absolutely NOT the upperclass. The judge is the umpire not the jury.

    Thats simply not true. All offences are tried by jury are they? No, of course they are not. And as I said. If you are black or female it is a proven fact that you will get a tougher sentence. It's also a fallacy that trial by jury is fair. Sit on a jury and you will see that. If he "looks like a pedo", he's getting convicted of being a pedo.

    After the jury decides guilty or not, the judge sentences based on guidelines that try to ensure that nothing random happens.

    See above, most trials aren't by jury. Try to ensure yes, thats why William set up the courts all those years ago - for consistency of judgments.

    The beauty and genius of our system is that our law is independent of everything. That's you, me, the mob and government. It's one of our very best inventions. It works rather brilliantly.

    Ideals mate. I was once like you. It's very noble, but I have seen how the system lets the victims down, the public down and even the offenders down. The notion of a fair trial is pure spin. This country is already in a state of the more money and the more contacts you have, the more of a fair trial you get.

    More money = better lawyers = better chances. Many legal aid solicitors are just pants, they are on poor money and lack the skill to deal with many offences. Many CPS barristers are just a awful (as alluded to above). There is a dual system in the courts - those funded by the LSC on £55 p/h and those privately funded at £250 p/h. You get what you pay for. I know I would rather have Michael Mansfield defending me than Barry Mansfield the clerk from the local solicitors.

    You're off topic ranting again.

    No. You are stating your opinions and ideals of the law and stating this as fact. I am merely doing the same as you but being more upfront that those are my opinions. You are also commenting on the causes of crime and for the most part it seems to be a "class problem". You are propagating a myth. Crime is just as rife in upper society, its just not as reported and not dealt with - and often takes a different form.

    Drug abuse for example - I think I saw more drug abuse at law college than I did growing up in an area rife with heroin and crack addicts - rich kids snorting coke. Except they aren't the ones on street corners involved in ASB, or doing thefts etc - they get bankrolled to fund their habits.


    They steal to feed their habit. The cause is the habit.

    The symptom is the habit. The cause is criminal tendency, delinquency and weakness.

    Sure, those people exist and they're responsible for a lot of crime. How many are older than 25?

    I know exactly how old they are, the police told me. They are at school. But there are others in the older age group who are responsible for similar numbers (they know who has done every burglary by the m.o.)
     
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    cjd

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    We have the system that we have and it deals as best it can with the weaknesses of people and society.

    It's a perfect as our society is - that is, it's flawed to fcuk and back.

    But it's the best there is. Show me a better.
     
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    Which would be one reason that it was charged as GBH and not simple assault. But there's not much point trying to guess from a half column page 5 article in a local newspaper is there?



    In your opinion what would be the appropriate sentence? 10 years?, 20? life? Execution?

    How about the guy paying for the loss of future earnings due to his actions.

    Seems fair to me.

    My problem is that it would seem that crimes against property are treated with longer sentences than those against the person.

    for example:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...en-special-needs-threw-snowballs-vehicle.html

    and:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-children-threw-snowball-car-allowed-job.html

    against:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...e-jailed-eating-restaurants-refusing-pay.html
     
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    The underlying reasons for the majority of crime are fairly well known - poverty, poor parenting, social inequality, poor housing, drugs, alcohol, mental illness and so on.

    We had one client who for months claimed that he was innocent of inflicting a s18 assault on a homeless man...The kid, despite the seriousness of what he had done(very nearly killed an old homeless man), smiled and laughed and said to me "yeah I did it". Why did you do it I asked? "For a laugh".

    Into which category would you fit this particular crime?
     
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    cjd

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    cjd

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  • Nov 23, 2005
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    How about the guy paying for the loss of future earnings due to his actions.

    In all assaults, the court will be asked to award compensation to the victim. He can also sue in a civil action for loss of future earnings.

    I'm afraid I'm not going to read the rantings of the Daily Wail - it's against my religion.
     
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    Steve Sellers

    We have the system that we have and it deals as best it can with the weaknesses of people and society.

    It's a perfect as our society is - that is, it's flawed to fcuk and back.

    But it's the best there is. Show me a better.

    You're bang on there. It is the best we have. But I would tweak the system in the following ways:

    1. More black(and other ethnic minorities) & female & young people in the judiciary;
    2. More localised control of the court budget;
    3. Appointment of local police commissioners (already done);
    4. Chief Judges & prosecutors voted in - budget spend limited on election campaign and no party political nominees.

    Just a few ideas, I have thought about this a bit and I am afraid I am no political thinker. I will give it some thought and put it in my manifesto when I run for PM. :D

    In all assaults, the court will be asked to award compensation to the victim. He can also sue in a civil action for loss of future earnings.

    Compensation the courts awards is so low compared to county court awards for personal injury claims. CIB are also very low in comparison, and if the person has no money(as often these scallies are declaring no income) there is no point suing them.

    I'm afraid I'm not going to read the rantings of the Daily Wail - it's against my religion.

    Something I agree with you strongly. I may come across as fairly right wing on this thread, but it is one of the few areas that I have very conservative views.
     
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    cjd

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  • Nov 23, 2005
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    Steve Sellers

    I dont know, are you?

    “As you grow older, you'll see white men cheat black men every day of your life, but let me tell you something and don't you forget it - whenever a white man does that to a black man, no matter who he is, how rich he is, or how fine a family he comes from, he is trash.”
     
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