Can we sue the architect?

[LuckyNo8]

Hi all,

We are doing a new build of 3 houses, and have been told by the sound testing people that the wall divisions have been specified incorrectly, and hence we will now have to do alot of remedial work to get them to pass the relevant tests.

These have been done to the specification of the architect, so we feel that they should meet the remedial cost of the work in terms of labour, as well as the cost of wasted materials.

Has anyone come across anything like this before? Not trying to make extra here (hence only looking for extra labour + wasted materials), but don't see what's the point of taking professional advice if this happens.

Thanks!

 

[OldWelshGuy]

If you have built to the Architects spec on materials etc, and it has failed then yes. his PI insurance should cover it.

 

[Spearmint]

Sound insulation is covered by part E of the building regulations. I suggest that you have a chat with your local building control officer from your local council to establish whether the completed works comply with the current regulations. You also need to try and establish whether the applicant (presumably the architect) gave notice of the intended works or submitted full plans for approval prior to commencing the works. Depending on the answer, it will lead to further questions, but they should be able to give you some good information.

I don't know a great deal about it, but also ask the Building Control Officer if the wall or walls concerned (as constructed) comply with the Party Wall Act, as that could be related to this issue also.

If the architect is registered as a member with the RIBA they may also be able to give you some advice as well.

As the architect is also the designer, his work is likely to fall under the CDM regulations as well, and that may well be another thing to bring to throw into the pot!

 

[The Resolver]

A mediator would help the architects to see the huge benefits to them (avoiding various forms of consequential damage) in reaching a resolution with you rather than this being raised with building control, their PI insurers, court etc. If there was no settlement reached, they face PI premium prejudice, as well as reputation damage (that may bite them when liaising with Building Control on other projects not to mention the local gossip that you may , non-maliciously , engage in when discussing informally with other builders and which could lose them other business). The positive side of the coin is other work you may be able to engage them in in the future if they help you now. This should be readily and quickly resolved- whereas formal complaints and pursuing remedies will create loss and damage for everyone, yourselves included (I can't imagine you will relish the delay before construction is complete).

 

[Michael Gerard]

Before you consider your options, you will need to satisfy yourself that the Architect is in fact in breach.

You will need to compare the test results and why it failed to what the Architect was obliged to design, which would include reference to the Building Regulations and any other employer requirement that the Architect was made aware of (ie the contractual requirement could be of a higher specification than BR's).

You will also need to advise the Architect of the failure and request a speedy response.

You are not [yet] up to the stage where you would need third party assistance. Once you are confident that your Architect is negligent, then in the first instance you should enter into direct negotiations in an attempt to settle the matter quickly and as cost effective as possible.

 

[Deleted member 130603]

Hi all,

We are doing a new build of 3 houses, and have been told by the sound testing people that the wall divisions have been specified incorrectly, and hence we will now have to do alot of remedial work to get them to pass the relevant tests.

These have been done to the specification of the architect, so we feel that they should meet the remedial cost of the work in terms of labour, as well as the cost of wasted materials.

Has anyone come across anything like this before? Not trying to make extra here (hence only looking for extra labour + wasted materials), but don't see what's the point of taking professional advice if this happens.

Thanks!

I don't know anything about sound testing wall divisions or even walls, other than that they keep people out, but as someone unfortunate enough to be an electrician I can relate to the type of problems you are having.

I know certain LBC's can have different rules from others, is this problem something small that is preventing the wall from passing, i.e., would it pass in another Borough? I would request - in writing - information detailing precisely what the problem was and outlining the standard it needs to be in order to pass. If you can't, and they haven't request they cross reference the unsatisfactory result against the specific building regulation which has caused it to fail, and then, if it's not too much hassle have these results inter verified by an independent expert.

I'm not actually sure where LBC's stand on fabricating their own rules on building regulations and raising the bar in certain areas (like the examples below) and how they are obligated to make this information available to architects and contractors.

The LBC of Westminster have rules stricter rules on fire rated cables than other LBC's, and certain LBC's insist on gas and water main earth bonds being 16mm2, where the Regs would permit 10mm2. Although the Architect may well still be liable there could be an unusual rule like the one's above, unique to the LBC which he was not aware of which is preventing them from passing.

By carrying out the following 'detective' work you should be able to ascertain exactly who was at fault, it does sound to me like the architect was responsible for making sure the wall complied with the LBC's and the building regs standards.

One possibility I wouldn't rule out is (if I'm correct and a silly 'quirk' is preventing it from passing, not a dangerous defect) is offering someone a 'drink' to pass it. My experience with these LBC building inspectors is that they're a joke. Most couldn't build lego.

I actually met a guy from the council once involved with environmental safety who was doing a 'sound test' on a gate in a block of housing association flats because it was making too much noise when it closed. He ordered a replacement electric gate and didn't even check how much noise it made when it shut! The guy was such a jobs-worth tool it was almost beyond comprehension.