Britain worst place in Europe - to live!

[directmarketingadvice]

Please provide me with the facts regarding University fees when England dont have to pay or Scotland has to pay even when going to English University.

No, actually let's talk about this cancer drug thing, shall we?

Or, is your desire to ignore the question and change the subject a sign that you agree your comments weren't true, but aren't willing to be honest enough to say so?

Steve

 

[ready2mix]

I dont hold a grudge against any of the UK nations i have a grudge against Westminster, England and a parliament all i want to address the concerns of the English, see if we want to remain in the UK or the EU for that matters, we deserve better than what we are getting.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

I dont hold a grudge against any of the UK nations i have a grudge against Westminster, England and a parliament all i want to address the concerns of the English, see if we want to remain in the UK or the EU for that matters, we deserve better than what we are getting.

Again, dodging the question...

I've said it to you before and I'll say it again: go do some research.

You come on here and spout ignorant, un-informed opinions about a minority and how "they have it so good and we white English are second class citizens in our own country".*

Yet, when the facts are presented, you're not even willing to reconsider your views.

There's a word for that and we both know what that word is.

Steve

* Not a verbatim quote, but a summary of your views.

 

[ready2mix]

Free drugs for cancer victims as England takes a prescription U-turn... one year after the Scots


By Daniel Bates
Last updated at 2:30 AM on 20th January 2009

• Comments (28)
• Add to My Stories

Cancer patients in England can apply for free NHS prescriptions from today.

Gordon Brown has bowed to pressure from campaigners and charities and ended charges for sufferers.

Up to 150,000 patients could benefit, saving as much £100 a year in prescription charges, the Department of Health says.

The move is the first step towards scrapping the £7.10 prescription fee for everyone with 'long-term illnesses'.

Cancer patients in England can apply for free NHS prescriptions from today one year after Scotland introduced the scheme. File photo
It comes exactly 12 months after all chronically-ill patients in Scotland were given free prescriptions - at a cost of £50million a year to the English.


Wales banished all prescription charges two years ago, a move Welsh politicians called 'the biggest move to improve public health in decades'.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ription-U-turn--year-Scots.html#ixzz0U1q9ZwLK

It seem that it was granted to the english after a year...! and look at what Wales has been doing free perceptions for over 2 years whilst who picks up the tab for that? Yes 50 million English tax payers.

I dont want it to be stopped i want it extended to the English, look at the benefits that the devolved parliament have had for welsh and Scottish and good for them but what about us the English?

 

Thats some almighty asprins.I wonder if a cost analysis has been done on these products.?

I should think 50 million is peanuts compared to Pfizers take.

Besides England gets all its dosh from Scottish oil.

Pfizer, which makes Sutent, says it costs around £24,000 for a year's treatment.
Avastin also tackles advanced bowel cancer, as does Erbitux. These will not be covered.

The average cost of using Erbitux is about £700 a week, or £11,200 for a fourmonth course, while Avastin costs around £20,000 a year.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ription-U-turn--year-Scots.html#ixzz0Ty35dPM6

Earl

 

[Geoff T]

deleted - "maj" had it covered!

 

[ready2mix]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2007/feb/08/scotland.britishidentity1

Scotland spend more than it earns including the oil. But worth a read. It seems if you read the figures Scotland is geting its revenue of the oild fields any way and 10% extra.

What if the Shetland Islands wanted independent, the oil would be theirs....!

 

[directmarketingadvice]

It seem that it was granted to the english after a year...!

I dont want it to be stopped i want it extended to the English

It's been extended to the English. You said so yourself.

What the ****?

and look at what Wales has been doing free perceptions for over 2 years whilst who picks up the tab for that? Yes 50 million English tax payers.

If only that were true... but it isn't.

Steve

 

[ready2mix]

who pays for the free prescription in Wales steve? the viberate welsh econmy the massive oil reserves in the brecon beacons? the English taxpayer 84% of the population of the UK are english were is the money coming from?

The system of wealth distribution in the UK is unfair not my words people better placed to decide it than you or me. but you will nick and pick at little thing making them sound big to win an augment that is not based on untruth but actual harpings.

Steve if you think it was justified for cancer paitancts to pay for there medication for a year the who is any one else to disagree with you "only a year statement" some may not even lasted that year Steve, I think maybe the family would consider that a dreadful remark.

Steve its abut fairness England having its own parliament to instigate its own polices why cant you except that as good thing, I am perfectly happy for Scotland to go independent and take its oil if it wants.

Now what about the university fees? do Scottish kids have to pay uni fees and can they go to english uni's?

No taxs with out representation Wales got it Scotland got it northern island got but the majority of teh people in the UK has no devolved parliament why the hell not answer that and why do you and every one else fear English nationalism?

Its OK to be a welsh nationalist an Scottish nationalist but english what do you all fear about it, a english parliament might one day bring English independence to the table and you can them move that den of greedy buggers (Westminster Union parliament) to Edinburgh. lol

You think you are winning something here , in fact your loosing simple as that, everything I aimed to achieve is happening Steve and you help fuel it.

I am happy for Scotland go its own way if it wants, happy and for Wales and happy if they stay but i am not happy the English dont get to debate if we want union with Scotland this is going to change. FACT FACT FACT, people are having enough.

Your continued defence of unfairness adds to the augment and also high lights it, you will continue to give platform to the debate,And I thank you for that

Its pointing towards change in the finances of Scotland you will get to raise your own taxes that's gonna happen but you will see reduced revenue from south of the border that is also a fact and higher taxes are what your going to get, FACT. And English parliament is comming better or worse for the union but better for the English and that's Asian English Caribbean English all English people.

 

[ready2mix]

Thats some almighty asprins.I wonder if a cost analysis has been done on these products.?

I should think 50 million is peanuts compared to Pfizers take.

Besides England gets all its dosh from Scottish oil.

Pfizer, which makes Sutent, says it costs around £24,000 for a year's treatment.
Avastin also tackles advanced bowel cancer, as does Erbitux. These will not be covered.

The average cost of using Erbitux is about £700 a week, or £11,200 for a fourmonth course, while Avastin costs around £20,000 a year.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ription-U-turn--year-Scots.html#ixzz0Ty35dPM6

Earl

No its Shetlands oil if they want it to be, maybe Shetland should ask for a devolved parliament and push for the right to the oil revenues lol , no Scotland receives more back than the oil revenue. Not my figures look at the post before.

What if the 1500 islanders wanted to leave the UK the Kingdom of Scotland, I think I would.

Shetlanders could all be millions ten times over with change , I wonder how that compares to the current income and services they have now, with all that oil they could pay no taxes, have best health care in the world and indoor heated swimming pools each. Think i would be asking for devolution right now, maybe independence, long live the Shetland Isle Republic.

Any one from the Shetland Isles here?

Dont go moving there Steve just try win argument. Probably have good friends there already even a relative whom is in constant touch with you regarding the feelings of the islanders and there desire to live without heated swimming pools lol.

 

[Cornish Steve]

I live in a very rich country, so I've decided, based on this discussion, to forget about everyone else and keep everything I have for myself. After all, the children I support around the world don't contribute anything, do they? If they get sick, why should I pay? What are they doing for me? As for foreign aid, if people are stupid enough to vote in corrupt leaders or accept dictators, why should I care? I'm sitting on my own wealth, so clearly it was meant for just me.

 

[ready2mix]

Lucy,

"re whinging poms" comment.

Free elderly care, free prescriptions, free cancer drugs, free hospital car parking, an unelected Scot as PM, disproportionate Scottish representation in the UK govt, Scot MPs who can vote on English matters but not the reverse, £1500 per person per year LESS in national funding than the Scots.

I think we've got a right to moan, haven't we?

The English are not responsible for what Mrs Thatcher did.
And as for "getting over it", that's very rich coming from a country who still harp on about a battle that took place over 700 years ago.
- Helen Donovan, Worcs, 20/1/2009 08:03

 

[directmarketingadvice]

who pays for the free prescription in Wales steve? the viberate welsh econmy the massive oil reserves in the brecon beacons? the English taxpayer 84% of the population of the UK are english were is the money coming from?

Here's an idea: go do some ****ing research!

Rather than believe/suggest/imply the Welsh are contributing little-to-nothing to the UK, why not spend a couple of hours learning how the Welsh make the UK a better country.

It would be good for your soul.

All this "we're doing everything and others are leeching off us" bitterness is (1) completely uninformed and (b) not helping you.

Learn to appreciate what others are doing and you'll learn to respect them.

The system of wealth distribution in the UK is unfair

Because some politicans said so. Presumably, back in 2003, you thought there were WMD in Iraq... and you've failed to realise that liars tend to lie more than once.

but you will nick and pick at little thing making them sound big to win an augment

I pointed out that things were being ignored in the equation. You've yet to come up with a sensible refutation.

(One of my examples was an unemployed guy in Dundee getting £200 per week in benefits and Jonathan Ross getting £100,000 from the license fee. The first guy counts as a subsidy to Scotland, but the 2nd does count as a subsidy to the South East - but it's all government money)

Steve if you think it was justified for cancer paitancts to pay for there medication for a year

Interesting. Over and over again, you claimed English cancer patients had to pay for their drugs. Until I pointed out they didn't.

Now, without an apology, a retraction or even skipping a beat, it's "pay for a year".

But, of course, the fact you were wrong about that couldn't mean you're equally misinformed about anything else.

Steve if you think it was justified for cancer paitancts to pay for there medication for a year the who is any one else to disagree with you "only a year statement" some may not even lasted that year Steve, I think maybe the family would consider that a dreadful remark.

Whose fault is it that they had to pay for a year?

The money for the drugs in Scotland came out of Scotland's budget - i.e. by paying for this, we had to cut back on something else.

If the English - and, given 80%+ of MPs represent England, it was the English - wanted the same for England, you could have had it. But, they didn't think of it until the Scots did it.

i.e. if Scotland hadn't lead the way morally on this, English cancer patients would still be paying for their drugs.

Thanks. You're welcome.

Steve its abut fairness England having its own parliament to instigate its own polices why cant you except that as good thing

Why blame me? Why not blame the majority of English people for not wanting one?

No taxs with out representation Wales got it Scotland got it northern island got but the majority of teh people in the UK has no devolved parliament why the hell not answer that

See answer above.

and why do you and every one else fear English nationalism?

Who fears that?

Its OK to be a welsh nationalist an Scottish nationalist but english what do you all fear about it,

Where's this fear? Where are you reading Scottish people worried about England deciding to become a separate country?

You think you are winning something here , in fact your loosing simple as that, everything I aimed to achieve is happening Steve and you help fuel it.

And what's that?

Your continued defence of unfairness

Again with the "unfairness". Again with the assumption that figures are "right" even though they're selective.

Its pointing towards change in the finances of Scotland you will get to raise your own taxes that's gonna happen but you will see reduced revenue from south of the border that is also a fact

Everyone is seeing a reduction in revenue. A recession, lower spending, unemployment...

And English parliament is comming better or worse for the union but better for the English and that's Asian English Caribbean English all English people.

Not the Africans or Eastern Europeans, then? Not immigrants who have been in the country a short time?

(nor the Scots, Welsh and Irish living in England)

Interesting.

Steve

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Free elderly care, free prescriptions, free cancer drugs, free hospital car parking, an unelected Scot as PM, disproportionate Scottish representation in the UK govt, Scot MPs who can vote on English matters but not the reverse, £1500 per person per year LESS in national funding than the Scots.

I think we've got a right to moan, haven't we?

You've got a right to moan, but I'd suggest you also have a duty to check your facts.

e.g. we don't have free prescriptions, Gordon Brown is elected, English people also get free cancer drugs...

Steve

 

[StefanK]

I live in a very rich country, so I've decided, based on this discussion, to forget about everyone else and keep everything I have for myself. After all, the children I support around the world don't contribute anything, do they? If they get sick, why should I pay? What are they doing for me? As for foreign aid, if people are stupid enough to vote in corrupt leaders or accept dictators, why should I care? I'm sitting on my own wealth, so clearly it was meant for just me.

Unfortunately, a lot of the corrupt leaders and dictators over the past fifty years have been the result of your countries 'foreign aid' programmes from your taxes, which actually 'aid' military coups and paramilitary activity much more often than they provide food, water and shelter to the needy. See Iran, Venezuela, Chile, Nicaragua, Colombia etc etc etc.

 

[ready2mix]

Yes Steve even Gurkha English whom you forgot to to mention, all the english ethnic mix we english are a nation built of racial integration for the last 2000 years the term english is not just me its everyone whom lives and breaths England. This is not about race its about the fairness to choose, lets face it say 84% of the UK population and the soon to be English parliament decided to go it alone, that should be a respected right you should confirm...! but to disallow the means and process of debate at a country level is ultimately unfair. Parliament and devolution is what the English want, with each further step and more power the Scottish parliament draws or demand so does the the English desire for the same, you see its a no boner augment

My figures? my dates are slightly confused but the essence of the point still remains Steve, and yes you cant win this...? but you will not lay down its your nature to paint the world as you want to view it, which is fine with me.

And the main thing is this is not my view, if you cared to start looking at other peoples concerns in the UK union you will know that its not just a Scotland that's been hard done by in the last 200 years, the fact that your language has diminished to the level it has same with the welsh, cultural identity you have England is struggling with its own trying to find its place in the world and with in the UK. Better to allow a smooth transition of devolution to the English and then we can renew partnerships on a fair level.

The method of calculating the revenue that Scotland gets is 30 years or more out of date and we the English are waking up to that, maybe some of this money deserves better placement up the north of England. The fact that this is becoming main stream and more people aware of it is were the win is Steve.

The fact is a year was too late as i am sure some of the families that have suffered from cancer and any life dilapidating dease would attest. We would have not got it a year later if it was not for the SNP or Scottish governments desire to give the people some element of fairness in Scotland.

So equal democracy for every country in the Union or no shared founding, the Americans were upset about funding and representation so they revolted. What the rulling elits in these islands feared the most was not a rebellion in Scotland, Wales or Ireland was a rebellion in England and that is still true to day take away the support of 84% of the population you have very little indeed to run, rule, kick around extra.

 

[ready2mix]

You've got a right to moan, but I'd suggest you also have a duty to check your facts.

e.g. we don't have free prescriptions, Gordon Brown is elected, English people also get free cancer drugs...

Steve

Gordon brown was not elected by me? his party headed by Tony Blair was elected by me ? he was elected by his party of 300 members (Steve what ever the figure) its not democracy is it , another wrong the executive should be elected by the people and the parliament should be elected by the people and the executive remain independent of that parliament.

I never elected John Major i elected the conservatives and Maggie Thatcher she was replaced rightly so but should have been at general election, The fact that local conservative council in Basildon pass the leadership like a batton as if it was the council relay race and sports day dont make that right either. The leader chossen between 30 people is that democracy?

What makes me laugh is when Cameron calls Gordon brown unelected but his party did the same will continue to do the same and does the same currently in local authorities.

I want executive mayors in all councils, I want4 year fixed term for teh elected executive government at country and Union level.

 

My two pennies:

We are the best nation on the planet. no other nation can say they have a history as rich as ours NONE. We live, in the most a free soceity, we pee and moan about the NHS and politics, but make a choice of that or Zimbabwe, try to keep things in perspective. Unlike the US we do not have a right to carry arms which in my opinion is a good thing, you may be quick to say we need it but how many MORE people would die?
As for the English/Welsh/Scottish/Irish argument. I think we are better as group then individually, the welsh bring a lot of history and there are eight US presidents with Welsh roots so they well respresented in recent orld history. The scots speak for themselves, in the pasted a feared nation that the romans could not conquer, a proud nation and now a free one. The irish are proud, respected the world over and must own New York based on population deriving from Ireland

My point is that we should be proud of who we are, what we have done, and hope that in 100 years we are still the great nation we always have been.

SO, GROUP HUG!!!

P.S. They were obviously not talking about Church Crookham when they mention the worst place in Europe!!

 

[Becky Midgley]

Gosh this is a heated debate isn't it? I'm going to add my cheery tuppence-worth and say; while there are some fantastic places around the world, I enjoy living in England; I love the British Isles; sure, some things are a bit rough, and we've a history that is somewhat shaded by arrogance and ill-conceived plans of world domination (that is a very brief summary, I know) but I wouldn't be without; the English countryside; fish and chips; day trips to the beach when it's raining; the smell of a wet autumn; the annual 'will it snow for Christmas' debate; Stonehenge; moaning about the NHS, First Great Western, BT or any of our other 'fine' institutions; or my very British accent!

 

[telemax]

As someone who has emigrated and then returned, all I can say is that Britain is fantastic!!

 

God Bless You And The United States Of Britain...send Her Victorious

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Gordon brown was not elected by me?

That's not the definition of "unelected".

Maybe you should go find a desert island and live there on your own. Then you could have whatever form of democracy you want.. and you wouldn't have to subsidise all these leeching Scots, Welsh, N Irish, immigrants, poor people, old folk, children etc...

Steve

 

[ready2mix]

That's not the definition of "unelected".

Maybe you should go find a desert island and live there on your own. Then you could have whatever form of democracy you want.. and you wouldn't have to subsidise all these leeching Scots, Welsh, N Irish, immigrants, poor people, old folk, children etc...

Steve

So when your lost the argument you add other nations to create effect and when you feel that's not enough you add minority's, children , old folk and for major impact dole eyed puppies , I am so evil in wanting fair government in the UK fair taxation in the UK just fairness for all not a minority like we seem to cater for.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

Yes Steve even Gurkha English whom you forgot to to mention

3 points:

(1) Ghurkas aren't English.

(2) You mentioned "Asian English" - the Ghurkas are from Asia, so I'm not sure what you're trying to imply.

(3) ****ing hell.

Steve

PS I noticed you sidestepped the questions about your "England for the English" manifesto. No mention of Eastern Europeans.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

So when your lost the argument you add other nations to create effect and when you feel that's not enough you add minority's, children , old folk and for major impact dole eyed puppies , I am so evil in wanting fair government in the UK fair taxation in the UK just fairness for all not a minority like we seem to cater for.

You seem to feel that "fair taxation" is that you get back what you put in.

What do children or poor people contribute to the tax pot? i.e. they're "minorities we seem to cater for".

Why? Why them?

Steve

 

[ready2mix]

All i want is a better place than we have and just to add the spanish health service is very good my uncle can attest to that, also his rates are £290 a year as oppesed to £1200 I pay a year and his rubbish is collected every day.

Unfortunate for him his and his wife pensions are making it difficult to remain in retirement in Spain. Should not be a problum for the bankers or any government minister or MP's, they will be fine so looking on the bright side and the silver limning is its not happing to all of us.

The NHS is in a better sate than it was 10 years ago, and i know, if you see were some operations were being carried out i have seen butcher shop cleaner, but most people would be sedated and not know the conditions of the operating theatre they are being wheeled into. Still 10 years ago he NHS enjoyed the immunity or the crown now thats gone they have to shape up.

 

[ready2mix]

3 points:

(1) Ghurkas aren't English.

(2) You mentioned "Asian English" - the Ghurkas are from Asia, so I'm not sure what you're trying to imply.

(3) ****ing hell.

Steve

PS I noticed you sidestepped the questions about your "England for the English" manifesto. No mention of Eastern Europeans.

ok Steve eastern Europeans that have settled here are including in the statement "everyone that lives here" now is that cleared up for you steve (oh and the scopions that have found home in Liverpool docks them too) no i am not racist or prejudice i would like greater unity with the commonwealth and that is filled with culture and races across the globe like London is very multicultural. So try again go with the puppies Steve i love watching you kill augment in the death throngs of your posts, it can be funny.

Ps England will get fairness , so nothing to add regarding the Uni fees in Scotland? or you want to blow smoke else were, look ready2mix hates puppies lol

Gurkha's that settle in England are English same as every other nationality and faith. Ps the Anglo Saxons that invaded 1600 years ago come from the northern regions in Europe, they mixed with people from all over the Roman empire that were stationed in the British Island, and there were the Vikings the Britons and many more oh the Jews (East London) that settled here after being chucked out of Spain during the inquisition and indeed from Germany during the ww2. The Indians that were kicked out of Uganda (settled around Middlesex mainly) and many more that make up this rich cultural country of England. Oh and the Huguenots that fleed France (setteld in east London) and the Irish feeling the famine and Religous intolerance in both parts of Ireland i am not so sure of the multicultural history of Scotland which i should read up on. If i missed any one out sorry you deserved a mention please add your self s.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

For those intersted, here's an article from late 2007:

Why the figures peddled by Scotland's critics don't add up

Scotland, with its many remote areas and pockets of deprivation, certainly has hefty public spending by any standards. But the highest? It is not even close.

That honour, by a considerable margin, goes to Northern Ireland. Official public expenditure there is measured at £10,271 per head at the last full count in 2005-06. The social and economic legacy of 30 years of civil strife means that the province needs more support than any other part of the UK.

Next up in Britain's regional league table of state spending is London. The government, in all its guises, dished out £9748 for every man, woman and child there, not least because of its armies of civil servants and creaking, expensive and essential transport infrastructure.

Next we come to Scotland, which edges ahead of the north-east of England to take third place in the spending stakes. Scots account for an average of £9631 in state expenditure all kinds

Now, I want to make 2 points:

(1) A lot has changed since November 2007

and

(2) I don't blindly believe these numbers, just as I don't believe the Westminster numbers. The truth is somewhere in between. But I'm not surprised by the top 3 in that table. It's what I would have expected.

Steve

PS There's an article on the Ch4 website (from 2006) which addresses a claim that Scotland subsidises the rest of the UK by £800 a head. Ch4 questioned the figures, but concluded "Case still open":

http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/world/do the scots subsidise the english/166260

Again, I'm sure the figures are wrong, but it gives a different perspective to the inaccurate (and agenda-driven) figures produced by Westminster.

 

[ready2mix]

Oh and a big up for the Normans (forgot all about them) another mix to the Great English MIX of peoples from beyond our shores and French for the next 200 or more years was the main language of England.

So not to cause offence to all you whom are descended from the Normans....doomsday book thanks for that.

 

[ready2mix]

For those intersted, here's an article from late 2007:

Why the figures peddled by Scotland's critics don't add up



Now, I want to make 2 points:

(1) A lot has changed since November 2007

and

(2) I don't blindly believe these numbers, just as I don't believe the Westminster numbers. The truth is somewhere in between. But I'm not surprised by the top 3 in that table. It's what I would have expected.

Steve

PS There's an article on the Ch4 website (from 2006) which addresses a claim that Scotland subsidises the rest of the UK by £800 a head. Ch4 questioned the figures, but concluded "Case still open":

http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/world/do the scots subsidise the english/166260

Again, I'm sure the figures are wrong, but it gives a different perspective to the inaccurate (and agenda-driven) figures produced by Westminster.

so lets take only the English element here 51 million times £800 =£40,800,000,000 this is 40 trillion?

5 million Scottish people / 40 trillion = £8160 per head nice one have you thought about buying them magic beans swapping your luxury car for them.

I truly dont get this figure, you need to explain further i think..! is this if your losing invent something. lol just joking Steve. i will look at the link.

 

[directmarketingadvice]

so lets take only the English element here 51 million times £800 =£40,800,000,000 this is 40 trillion?

Hahahahaha!

Classic.

Steve

 

error............

 

[ready2mix]

I think this should be debated openly for all the UK and to make a fair distribution of the wealth.

I want to curb Westminster growing power.

I still want an English Parliament

I still want union with Scotland but we should be able to debate it, and with fair figures.

I dont trust the figures provided by government as you have to know what elements they keep in and leave out, like crime and the dole.

With out this argument I would never have understood the complexities or the issue or the facts which as you say are questionable.

I am not against Scotland its one of hem places i truly regret i have not visited in the UK.

I do hate the class system in England which i feel still exist and country's like Scotland are not effected by it so much.

I do apologise for my command of the english language and my grammar

I do not even begrudge Scotland its oil revenue, it would be a net contributer to the EU if independent and that money would be distributed to the poorer regions of the EU.

If Independence is what Scotland wants lets debate it freely and from positions of equality.

England wont get a parliament on the agenda of the main parties unless they are threatened by a new party. But the regional idea is dived and conquer.

Freedom of information is still an issue for all of us. Took me 4 request and a complaint to the ICO to find out what the cheif executive salary was and then a further 5 letters and another complaint to find out the name of the person refusing the previous 3 letters and that person was the chief executive.

 

[Cornish Steve]

Unfortunately, a lot of the corrupt leaders and dictators over the past fifty years have been the result of your countries 'foreign aid' programmes from your taxes, which actually 'aid' military coups and paramilitary activity much more often than they provide food, water and shelter to the needy. See Iran, Venezuela, Chile, Nicaragua, Colombia etc etc etc.

Stefan:

Everything I wrote was tongue in cheek. The point is that I feel very fortunate to have lived in a couple of the world's wealthiest countries. That's an accident of birth. There was a greater probability that I was born into abject poverty, but I wasn't. Personally, I feel a strong sense of responsibility to help those in dire need through no fault of their own. The press likes to condemn foreign aid as wasted on corrupt leaders, but this isn't a fair representation of reality. I've been to many developing countries, and aid does make a difference and so does out-sourcing work.

Applying this to the discussion about Britain, there are richer and poorer areas of the country. I happened to be born in one of the poorer areas - although still very wealthy by the world's standards. Did I feel that I was ripping off individuals from the richer areas who contributed more to my education than locals, for example? Not at all. If the situation had been reversed, would I have felt hard done by because I was contributing to the needs of those in poorer regions? Not at all. Now, I would prefer that this was handled voluntarily and through personal giving rather than being coerced by government in the form of taxes, but that's a technical point.

As some of the world's wealthiest citizens, we have a moral obligation to help those in need. In the context of our union, this is no big deal, so I'm not sure why this argument is raging. In the wider context of the world, there's so much more we could be doing. Maybe it's a case of "out of sight, out of mind", but millions go to sleep hungry and sick while we wonder what extra features we'll buy on our latest flat screen.

 

[ready2mix]

Talking of flat screens is LED better than the others? Plasma or LCD

 

[dave_webb]

Where I live, Enfield North London, loads of people get stabbed and shot.

 

[telemax]

Not sure what thats got to do with it. Every country in the world has bad areas. The gun and knife problem is on another level to the UK in North America.

I lived in Enfield the vast majority of my life, I know for a fact there are a few hotspots but it isn't really that bad. The local crappy paper there tends to oversensationalise everything a lot though.

 

.

As some of the world's wealthiest citizens, we have a moral obligation to help those in need. In the context of our union, this is no big deal, so I'm not sure why this argument is raging. In the wider context of the world, there's so much more we could be doing. Maybe it's a case of "out of sight, out of mind", but millions go to sleep hungry and sick while we wonder what extra features we'll buy on our latest flat screen.

Yep for all those that think they have a hard time in the UK.

Go spend a weekend in Mogadishu.

Earl

 

[dave_webb]

Not sure what thats got to do with it. Every country in the world has bad areas. The gun and knife problem is on another level to the UK in North America.

I lived in Enfield the vast majority of my life, I know for a fact there are a few hotspots but it isn't really that bad. The local crappy paper there tends to oversensationalise everything a lot though.

lol I know it aint that bad was just hyping it up. But it is pretty bad. Loads of wannabe gangsters. Rather than enfield I was talking more of Tottenham which is only up the road.

 

[telemax]

lol I know it aint that bad was just hyping it up. But it is pretty bad. Loads of wannabe gangsters. Rather than enfield I was talking more of Tottenham which is only up the road.

True enough