Any Enterprise Advisers here?

[Ozzy]

Just been doing some prep work for my role as an EA, I was a founder EA before the Government picked it up and rolled the program out nationally. I was wondering if there were any fellow Enterprise Advisers on here, and if there are (hopefully) how have you found engagement with your link school or college?

If you're not an EA, what advice would you give a school to improve careers advice and work ethic/experience?

EA is a bit like a Non-Exec Director or business adviser for a school or college, advising and supporting careers guidance and business engagement/connections...for anyone who doesn't know what it is.

 

[fisicx]

If you're not an EA, what advice would you give a school to improve careers advice and work ethic/experience?

Stop pushing children into A-levels/university and start promoting trades.

 

[Ozzy]

Stop pushing children into A-levels/university and start promoting trades.

That is exactly the purpose and point of the Careers & Enterprise company (which runs the EA program). An issue has been that schools were judged on how many of their children went to college, and colleges on how many went to Universities. Part of this program is swing the balance back towards vocational training options.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

Open up the lists of jobs that are available in the real world, there are thousands of trades and different jobs and specialists but most are never hinted at yet alone mentioned,

Take a look at say Hospital's the numbers of jobs is massive in all the department's, Nurses all have different skills for each department and that's just nurses. the forces are another with lots of specialised job opportunities and not just Pilots, sailors and soldiers . civilian jobs also come in massive numbers but most school leavers and never given any info on them just a very basic small selection.

You can buy books of children's names but few on different jobs

 

[Frank the Insurance guy]

Stop pushing children into A-levels/university

This 100%!

advising and supporting careers guidance and business engagement/connections

I think your role isn't necessarily to push them either way to university or more vocational roles/trades - I would suggest using the opportunity to widen the students eyes into all the opportunities open to them.

Its more about advising them on looking at what they want to do, what motivates them and the career opportunities open to them......Hold on...As am writing this, its sounding like you are careers advisor...eh??

I think a lot of kids go onto University as that what they thought they had to do, even though they may not want to, or an alternative would be better suited.

I think you need to go in with a balanced approach - ideally with some examples of how a university path and a vocational path in the end lead to the same final outcome, like similar earning potential and career prospects (and the opposite with both routes leading to very little, based on the effort/motivation). So many kids are told that they will never get anywhere and achieve nothing unless they have a degree.

 

[BDF-Anon]

Entrepreneurial spirit is something learnable, exactly like any other human skill!
So, start teaching pupils about the benefits of solving problems and how can they capitalize on the solutions. How money really work. Social value of private enterprise. People skills. Long-term thinking. And sooo much more ...
Personally, I never gave a dead rat's tail if my child has got A, B, or whatever else in school. Though, I am very sensitive about how my child develops physically and intellectually. Hence, now we are home schooling, for over a year! Even if only for being much-much happier than when going to school, it is worth it!

 

[Mark T Jones]

I was a volunteer for Young Enterprise, which appears to be the same thing

The main thing I learned is that I'd make a sh!t teacher (perhaps not having kids is a factor) - which was a surprise because my adult start up courses were well received and reviewed

At the time the organisation itself was shambolic so it all fizzled out after a year

 

[Jayne]

Just been doing some prep work for my role as an EA, I was a founder EA before the Government picked it up and rolled the program out nationally. I was wondering if there were any fellow Enterprise Advisers on here, and if there are (hopefully) how have you found engagement with your link school or college?

If you're not an EA, what advice would you give a school to improve careers advice and work ethic/experience?

EA is a bit like a Non-Exec Director or business adviser for a school or college, advising and supporting careers guidance and business engagement/connections...for anyone who doesn't know what it is.

Hi, can't believe my password still works Haha

Now where to start! Basically, too much pointless marking and paperwork just to please Ofsted. Teachers are way over worked and respect for the profession really has fallen. TAs work super hard, also teaching for rubbish pay and are expected in many schools to do overtime for free.

I'm finding education (Curriculum) at the moment is sucking the life out of both teachers and pupils. Most schools are heavily focused on Maths and English. The kids learn all about grammar and subordinating conjunctions etc. yet find it hard to be creative and think for themselves, which is squashing any entrepreneurial spirit in them that should be encouraged.

I think that if pressures where lifted off staff and stop constantly watching and scrutinising teachers every move and let them do their jobs, education would vastly improve. Then all we need is the school buildings tarting up and a few glue stick and jobs a good un'.

 

[Ozzy]

Entrepreneurial spirit is something learnable, exactly like any other human skill!

We shall have to agree to disagree on this one, although it will depend on how you define "entrepreneur" which is a word that has lost it's meaning in recent years. You can definitely learn how to be a brilliant business person, but I believe an Entrepreneur is in your very being triggering by circumstance. Not made or taught.

Hence, now we are home schooling, for over a year!

We also home schooled both our children, for different reasons - but ultimately because the current education "institution" failed them. Absolutely respect and admire teachers, but the institution fails them too.

I was a volunteer for Young Enterprise, which appears to be the same thing

Not really. As EA's we refer to Young Enterprise as a tool the school can use to teach business, but it sounds like you experienced the same disappointment I did. I chaired YE in Northants several years ago and stepped down after seeing a presentation at their head office and realised it wasn't what I signed up for (as a volunteer).

respect for the profession really has fallen

Agreed, and a terrible shame.

expected in many schools to do overtime for free

I know so many teachers who work crazy hours, and even have to buy tools for the classroom out of their own pay because the funding isn't there for the most basic of things.

 

[Deleted member 59730]

If you're not an EA, what advice would you give a school to improve careers advice and work ethic/experience?

First thing is to shoot the headmaster. They hate any outside input and will do everything to thwart your efforts.

Many years ago I was one of a group of parents who put forward the idea of gathering a wide variety of "hidden" jobs that people did to broaden the horizons of the kids in the local very rural school. We had a group of volunteers all lined up including a top Whitehall mandarin on sabatical, a guy who designed car assembly lines, a film maker for CBS, a manufacturer who exported worldwide and many more. The headmaster did everything he could to stop us and then sneaked in his alternative. His career exhibition included all the usual, Navy, police, NFU etc that were already known even in our country area.

 

[Ozzy]

First thing is to shoot the headmaster.

Bit excessive .
Agree though, there are some headteachers who "know best", but they tend to avoid getting their school involved with the Careers & Enterprise Company. I've come across school senior management who resist any change, but I have also come across some who embrace any input they can get. The head of the school I'm a Governor for embraces change and input from anyone and anywhere, which is why the school does very well.

The issue with "most" teachers (@Jayne being one of the exceptions here as she's come from business) is that they go to school, they study. They then go to college and then on to University, and then go back into school to teach children about careers - but an not point in their life has the teacher experience anything other than education. This is where the EA (and other) programs come in, to bring other industries into the classroom...but as you say, not all schools embrace it.

His career exhibition included all the usual

Oh god, the god awful boilerplate "careers fair" that ticks a box and achieves nothing at all. A complete waste of time.
Getting business people from all industries into the classroom or assembly, talking to the students, answering questions, bringing in toys and gizmos from work, telling stories...that is what makes a difference - along with work experience.

 

[Mark T Jones]

Bit excessive .
Agree though, there are some headteachers who "know best", but they tend to avoid getting their school involved with the Careers & Enterprise Company. I've come across school senior management who resist any change, but I have also come across some who embrace any input they can get. The head of the school I'm a Governor for embraces change and input from anyone and anywhere, which is why the school does very well.

The issue with "most" teachers (@Jayne being one of the exceptions here as she's come from business) is that they go to school, they study. They then go to college and then on to University, and then go back into school to teach children about careers - but an not point in their life has the teacher experience anything other than education. This is where the EA (and other) programs come in, to bring other industries into the classroom...but as you say, not all schools embrace it.

Oh god, the god awful boilerplate "careers fair" that ticks a box and achieves nothing at all. A complete waste of time.
Getting business people from all industries into the classroom or assembly, talking to the students, answering questions, bringing in toys and gizmos from work, telling stories...that is what makes a difference - along with work experience.

There are all sorts of valid issues in here!

From experience of selling to schools, the vast majority of heads are promoted teachers. The notion that schools are run as businesses is just a joke

Furthermore they are judged and targeted on fixed academic and curricular outcomes- so introducing anything that doesn't precisely tick a box is very difficult.

Meanwhile, if you are acting on an edict they will buy pretty much any rubbish on any terms.

Ah, those career fairs! I volunteered once to represent sales as a career. I had 2 visitors, whilst the vet had a queue (predominantly female( around the room all evening.

At a guess I'd say a fair portion of them have a sales related jobs, whilst many of the wannabe vets are now hairdressers

 

[Ozzy]

Furthermore they are judged and targeted on fixed academic and curricular outcomes

It is too early to say whether this will have the desired impact or not, but the latest guidance and changes in Ofsted inspection criteria should make a difference. There is a focus on careers guidance, which must be provided by an independent person separate from the school, and must demonstrate the students are provided broad and personalised guidance to the individual of all options.
There is also a push to raise the value of vocational training, so University isn't the best nor only option.

Early days, but I'm hopeful

 

[Ryan Paul]

An issue for young kids finishing school is that they do not know what they want to do.
They need support finding what it is that interests them - what they are perhaps suited to as they are unaware of their options.
Not all children are getting the support from school or at home that they need.
I don't know if it exists in schools but I think the students would be benefit from having a transitions coordinator in to work, apprenticeship or further education.

There are kids who may not be scoring well academically but need to realize that with the correct attitude and drive that they have the potential to succeed in other fields.

Ultimately, the audience needs to be asked what they want from the engagement and it's up to the network to offer support, guidance and highlight the obstacles / challenges and how to overcome them, and they will range from the simple to the more complex.

 

[Ozzy]

Not all children are getting the support from school or at home that they need.

This is such a sad but very real reality.

I don't know if it exists in schools but I think the students would be benefit from having a transitions coordinator in to work, apprenticeship or further education.

This is the role of the Careers Leader // Careers Adviser who is supposed to go into the school and meet with and discuss all these options with the students.
Ultimately the student should also be reassured that they can change their mind if they find their first choice didn't work out. Want to be an accountant and find you hate it after 6 months as you want to be working outdoors, no worries, try landscaping instead. It's never too late to change your career.

 

[InsuranceBroker]

I've read the whole thread and still feel uninformed about EA role but I can only say that my kid went to a public school and barely passed because the focus by the staff and headteacher was uniform adherence and making sure the only junk food the kid got was from the school and not home so as to ensure the schools revenue drive.

Then, my very unacademic kid went to university for 2 years on an unconditional offer, which is code for nonsense, and dropped out after completing the 2nd year because the uni wanted full tuition for 'Zoom' courses which meant no lab time and was the only reason for the course in the first place.

I'm glad I only had one child because the school system, from smallest child to young adult, is a shambles. Not all teachers are great. Some are barely present, physically or mentally, and no amount of low pay talk, resources etc excuses this in my book. I'm not blaming the school, entirely, on the outcome of my childs education but any lapses or gaps were enabled, and so tacitly encouraged, by disinterested staff. It is difficult as a parent to encourage a child academically and have it undone between the hours of 9am - 3p.m.

Maybe the answer is making sure kids who declare they want to be teachers actually want to teach. That could fix a whole host of problems down the road for them and the future of the kids who go to schools.

 

[Ozzy]

I've read the whole thread and still feel uninformed about EA role

It's a volunteer role where you as a business person go into school on a regular basis and challenge the school management team on what they are doing to provide good careers advice, and ensuring the students leave education ready for work. That's the short answer, basically giving a business perspective on careers related education.
It only works if the school is receptive to hearing your advice and challenge though. Thankfully the school I work with does but I know many EA's who have quit the role because felt they were wasting their time with the schools they were supporting.

It is difficult as a parent to encourage a child academically and have it undone between the hours of 9am - 3p.m.

For different reasons but similar, that is why both my children were home schooled. The school environment did not support my children's education.

 

[InsuranceBroker]

Thanks for clarifying the role of the EA and thanks for being a volunteer. I wish it was something I could volunteer to assist with as I'm passionate about education but have no idea how to go about it all.

I'm glad you had the opportunity to home school your children. I was younger, naïve and had faith in the 'system'. Hindsight is not always a beautiful thing..it can trigger regret when enlightened by time that cannot be reversed!