Alibaba Seller Tried to rip me off - chargeback question

[dandandan17]

I bought $12k worth of stock over a 3 month period through a seller on Alibaba. When I received the sample all was good and then l the first order which was fine, I reordered & I feel like they tried to finesse me from this point. The stuff was defective, not as agreed in at least 4-5 different ways, cheaper items included, not agreed items included, broken products, lesser quality items and to boot... unsafe (some items were listed as unsafe and to recall from hmrc) and basically unsellable - we had to refund tonnes of customers and bin the rest of it. Alibaba was no use they don’t speak English barely so I wasn’t able to sort it through them and they are impossible to file a dispute with, they kept siding with the merchant. I paid through Amex luckily, so I opened a claim with them, looks like mostly it’s been successful, it’s been sided with me - apparently permanently. The issue is I now have a barrage of messages from Chinese people (ppl that work for this shady company) who aren’t happy about it - they cut contact with me initially & stopped replying to my complaints about what I’d received then finally after weeks offered me pennies in compensation, literally pennies. I then had no option but to file my chargeback (I had to refund customers) and now the Chinese want to sort it out and engage with me. I have no interest in ever working with them again or speaking to them, they tried to screw me multiple times so this is karma I feel - I did not get what I paid for for a plethora of reasons. Is there any recourse at all for them? Apart from trying to message me? I don’t even care to use Alibaba again, I have a sourcing agent now. Everything on Alibaba is rubbish and the TA is worthless so I dont care if i get blocked from, I just dont want ay recourse, Amex say I'm safe and theres nothing that can be done. Anyone else had issues like this before, thankfully im covered with Amex, but I'm being threatened (literally) and I can keep blocking them but I dont really like to be threatened like they are gangsters or something lol

 

[japancool]

That's what you get when you go to Alibaba and don't vet the supplier.

 

[dandandan17]

Right, thanks for your really helpful input. They havent got my money. Amex refunded me. Is there anything else they can do is what im asking. I have learnt my lesson and not using alibaba ever again.

 

[japancool]

Sure. They could ring up some Chinese fellas in the UK and send them round to break your legs. I wouldn't put it past some of the dodgier sellers to do that.

Unless Amex allows them to appeal the decision, then if their contract with you was made under UK law, they could take you to court here. But they're not going to do that.

Perhaps @MyOfficeInChina has some more insight.

 

[fisicx]

Is there anything else they can do is what im asking.

DDoS on your website. Hack your website. Malware, ransomware. Bombard you with emails. Add poor reviews all over the place. Post junk on you FB page.

Generally make your life a misery.

 

[dandandan17]

Most of that I dont care baout. They dont know my website, but even if they do its protected by Shopify so what else can they even do, Im guessing nothing and furthermore I am in the right, they tried to rip me off.

 

[MOIC]

Was it a genuine Alibaba site/member? There are plenty of (very good) impersonating sites purporting to be Alibaba, but aren't.

If Amex has deducted the payment from their account (a scam artist would withdraw the funds as soon as it hits their account) and you haven't successfully shown or proved the items were defective, they could well try to get their money back, by any means, if it's worth their while.

How much of the $12k stock was defective?

What was the value of the chargeback?

Why don't you get your agent to follow this up and sort the issue with them, showing what was defective and agreeing a figure of compensation? A good agent should do this.

 

[Maple Sourcing]

I suggest you finding a trustworthy QC company to inspect your goods, prior to shipment and before you pay your final payment. It's really important, even though you've worked with the same Chinese factory for a few times, you are not assured the quality would stay good. In fact, most of Chinese factories cannot deliver stable quality in peak seasons (too busy) and after CNY (lack of staff).

 

[Directimport]

I hope all members contemplating buying through Alibaba read dandanan17's sad story. Alibaba gain their income from the fees paid by their vendors and that includes 5% of the transaction value of orders covered by the "feel good" Trade Assurance (TA) scheme. There is no doubt that vendors factor in that 5% when quoting prices.

I have always suspected that Alibaba deliberately make the TA rules so complicated and extensive that very few people will read them, and even fewer who do read them will understand. The latest rules cover 52 pages.

Rather than find comfort in the illusory protection of Trade Assurance, it is much safer to pay an established Quality Inspection service to conduct a quality inspection because as Maple Sourcing advises.....

It's really important, even though you've worked with the same Chinese factory for a few times, you are not assured the quality would stay good.

Directimport​

​

 

[DW76]

Is there anything else they can do is what im asking.

If your story is genuine, there's nothing they can do. But you were lucky to get refunded in this scenario. So, learned your lesson and move on. Your life is too precious to deal with people like that.
You are not the first story I learned about buying from Alibaba with issues you encountered. It might be a quick way to let you know who is offering the products you are interested in buying but all the other steps need to be in place to avoid possible transactional troubles and mitigate potential risks.
Finding yourself a good sourcing agent (or so-called IPO) is a good solution when you are new to the market. Do find one that has experience in your sector. Also, a conversation with them about their knowledge and practices can help you pick a partner that works best for your business. Many sourcing agents are salespeople who previously worked in a particular factory. Aiming to find one who has a deeper understanding of the industry and supply chain management will give your business an advantage over your competitor and hand-hold you to get the supply chain knowledge you need in a shorter time.

 

[Directimport]

Is there anything else they can do is what im asking.

Before using Sourcing agents you need to do due diligence just as you should when looking at suppliers. Using the services of well established Quality Inspection services is a safer way.

These are some of the most reputable and long established Quality Inspection services.
● Bureau Veritas. http://www.bureauveritas.com/ Head office France, with offices worldwide. Established 1828.

● TUV Rhineland. https://www.tuv.com/world/en Not to be confused with TUV SUD another substantial inspection service also based in Germany, but TUV SUD does not provide services for small importers. Both original TUVs were established in Germany in the late 1800s

● SGS https://www.sgsgroup.com.cn/en/ Based in Switzerland. Established in late 1800s. This link takes you direct to their China site.

● KRT Audit Corporation http://www.krtinspect.com/ US based, with operations in 12 countries.

 

[adam102]

I bought $12k worth of stock over a 3 month period through a seller on Alibaba. When I received the sample all was good and then l the first order which was fine, I reordered & I feel like they tried to finesse me from this point. The stuff was defective, not as agreed in at least 4-5 different ways, cheaper items included, not agreed items included, broken products, lesser quality items and to boot... unsafe (some items were listed as unsafe and to recall from hmrc) and basically unsellable - we had to refund tonnes of customers and bin the rest of it. Alibaba was no use they don’t speak English barely so I wasn’t able to sort it through them and they are impossible to file a dispute with, they kept siding with the merchant. I paid through Amex luckily, so I opened a claim with them, looks like mostly it’s been successful, it’s been sided with me - apparently permanently. The issue is I now have a barrage of messages from Chinese people (ppl that work for this shady company) who aren’t happy about it - they cut contact with me initially & stopped replying to my complaints about what I’d received then finally after weeks offered me pennies in compensation, literally pennies. I then had no option but to file my chargeback (I had to refund customers) and now the Chinese want to sort it out and engage with me. I have no interest in ever working with them again or speaking to them, they tried to screw me multiple times so this is karma I feel - I did not get what I paid for for a plethora of reasons. Is there any recourse at all for them? Apart from trying to message me? I don’t even care to use Alibaba again, I have a sourcing agent now. Everything on Alibaba is rubbish and the TA is worthless so I dont care if i get blocked from, I just dont want ay recourse, Amex say I'm safe and theres nothing that can be done. Anyone else had issues like this before, thankfully im covered with Amex, but I'm being threatened (literally) and I can keep blocking them but I dont really like to be threatened like they are gangsters or something lol

Products with problems can be returned to Alibaba, only need to upload a voucher

 

[Directimport]

Products with problems can be returned to Alibaba, only need to upload a voucher

What voucher are you referring to?

 

[adam102]

A picture that can prove the quality problem of the goods

 

[Directimport]

A picture will rarely be sufficient. In most cases they will insist on return of the faulty goods, and that can cost a lot of money.

In this case it seems that dandandan17 has got off light.

 

[Hardajimat]

I bought $12k worth of stock over a 3 month period through a seller on Alibaba. When I received the sample all was good and then l the first order which was fine, I reordered & I feel like they tried to finesse me from this point. The stuff was defective, not as agreed in at least 4-5 different ways, cheaper items included, not agreed items included, broken products, lesser quality items and to boot... unsafe (some items were listed as unsafe and to recall from hmrc) and basically unsellable - we had to refund tonnes of customers and bin the rest of it. Alibaba was no use they don’t speak English barely so I wasn’t able to sort it through them and they are impossible to file a dispute with, they kept siding with the merchant. I paid through Amex luckily, so I opened a claim with them, looks like mostly it’s been successful, it’s been sided with me - apparently permanently. The issue is I now have a barrage of messages from Chinese people (ppl that work for this shady company) who aren’t happy about it - they cut contact with me initially & stopped replying to my complaints about what I’d received then finally after weeks offered me pennies in compensation, literally pennies. I then had no option but to file my chargeback (I had to refund customers) and now the Chinese want to sort it out and engage with me. I have no interest in ever working with them again or speaking to them, they tried to screw me multiple times so this is karma I feel - I did not get what I paid for for a plethora of reasons. Is there any recourse at all for them? Apart from trying to message me? I don’t even care to use Alibaba again, I have a sourcing agent now. Everything on Alibaba is rubbish and the TA is worthless so I dont care if i get blocked from, I just dont want ay recourse, Amex say I'm safe and theres nothing that can be done. Anyone else had issues like this before, thankfully im covered with Amex, but I'm being threatened (literally) and I can keep blocking them but I dont really like to be threatened like they are gangsters or something lol

You're 1000% right Alibaba only protects their Chinese sellers, they don't care about the buyers losing their money. I am currently facing a similar issue with a seller whom I vetted their company before placing an order. Is over 21 days now the seller have been coming up with different excuses for not being able to ship the goods, then when I said I need to apply for a refund, the seller quickly created a shipping label and gave waybill but package was not handed to the courier, the tracking confirmed this as well, to make matters worse the seller marked the goods as delivered and Alibaba is giving me 10 days to confirm that the goods have been delivered, otherwise the system will automatically mark it as delivered.

To make matters worse, I opened a refund dispute, only for Alibaba to cancel my dispute claiming that I have initiated a chargeback that's why the system canceled the order as well as the dispute. After I confronted them that my bank did not make any chargeback, Alibaba came back saying is because the order shows in the system that it's in transit that's why the dispute and order was canceled.

Looks like the seller already knows this will happen because when I asked for refund, she practically told me I won't get my money back if apply for refund, and she wants me to keep waiting until the goods is shipped without any specific date for this to happen.

Well is clear to me now that the only option I have now is to apply for a chargeback.

This seller from the beginning was persuading me to make payment on Alibaba via T/T, but my bank advised me never to use such payment method.

Is clear to me now that anything you're buying from Alibaba, your buying at your own risk and never expect Alibaba to protect your trade via any trade assurance etc.