Goodbye UKBF and thanks for all the fish!

[The Byre]

I have had my latest posts deleted because they were blogs. I find that absurd as I was asked repeatedly to become a UKBF blogger, which I declined for the obvious reason that hardly anyone read UKBF blogs - which is, I assume, why they disappeared.

I am also seeing an ever more absurd and childish attitude towards moderation here and an accompanying fall in hits and posts - something I have seen in many other forums that went on to fail!

I have also had my business status rescinded and never received any invoices for any money paid thus far, despite requesting this on several occasions.

I want to thank all the lovely and witty people I have met here - you know who you are and you are too many to mention! I have spoken to many of you on the phone and you have looked at my videos and emailed me. There would have to be personal thanks going out to over 100 people - and I do have other things to do!

I have tried to reach out and help as many people here as possible and in all that time, I have I hope remained polite and courteous, whilst also stating the bunt truths of running a business. (Well, nobody said that it is easy!)

I have also provided (I hope!) insights into what is happening in the wider world economy and it is the editorial nature of those posts that has caused trouble. Perhaps the economy in the eyes of UKBF has little to do with business - who knows! I am after all (AFAIK) one of the few economists here - and I am also I believe the only German here (Despite having a very British name and a second UK passport!) and we Germans are a philosophical people. If you ask a German the time, he will either want to discuss why it is that you need to know - or he will assume that this is the opening to a wider discussion on the very nature of time and man's relationship with time. From there, it is but a short step to discussing life itself!

Overall, it has all been a pleasant time on UKBF, but given recent developments and the clear implication that my opinion pieces are somewhat unwelcome here - that and I spend too much time here anyway - it is time to take my hat and leave.

Be careful out there - share prices are tanking, a banking crisis looms and recession/depression is probably inevitable, either next year or 2025. So all you SMEs out there, buckle up and avoid high-interest debt!

I believe there is a facility to delete an account and I shall be making use of that facility in a day or so.

 

[Bob Morgan]

I'm right behind you - I'm off too!

 

[Socio South West]

Ah - wondered where your interesting post went this morning. Shame - wanted to link others to it to discuss.

Thanks for your interesting input @The Byre - a loss to this forum,,,, Hoping that heavy handed over moderation is not going to stifle healthy business debate on here.

 

[Ethan39]

I have had my latest posts deleted because they were blogs.

We have a specific section of the forum for editorial content from our members, the "Community Writer" section:

Community Writers

This is a space for our community writers to post their articles.

www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk

Any editorial content outside of this section is not something that we allow. Any historic threads, such as your previous "Byretorial" posts haven't been removed mainly because they existed before we moved all editorial content to the Community Writer's section.

The thread was deleted because it was flagged by another member and I stepped in to remove it instead of leaving it to our moderators because they were unsure whether to remove it. We have been banning new users for disguising editorial content as threads on the forum because these are usual used for SEO link farming. Whilst your post did not contain any links, we cannot disallow it for other users and allow it for you.

I find that absurd as I was asked repeatedly to become a UKBF blogger, which I declined

If you had accepted, and the offer still stands, then you're more than welcome to carry on posting Byretorial content in the appropriate place, the Community Writers section. I can get you the community writer privilege this afternoon if you'd like to contribute.

I have also had my business status rescinded and never received any invoices for any money paid thus far, despite requesting this on several occasions.

Your business membership expired on the 24th of June 2023 and you never renewed. You last paid for the yearly membership on the 10th of June last year, so you actually had 14 free days on top of the service you paid for. That's likely due to the transition period between the old style membership and the new style which happened in Dec '22.

The only record I have from you requesting an invoice is from October 2021 which I personally dealt with. An invoice was issued to you 4 days after you requested it. Additionally, PayPal automatically produces VAT invoices for all subscriptions which are available directly from your PayPal account.

it is the editorial nature of those posts that has caused trouble

Only because these were posted outside of our editorial section. The content of the post was insightful and useful, but not in the right section of the site.

my opinion pieces are somewhat unwelcome here

Not at all, we've offered you the ability to contribute to our editorial content through the blog that Ozzy created for you last year. This was an invitation to use our platform to create your opinion pieces. Something that is only available through invitation. We recognise your expertise and wanted to give you the space to share it.

I believe there is a facility to delete an account and I shall be making use of that facility in a day or so.

Absolutely, this can be found below:

Jira Service Management

bdgroup.atlassian.net

 

[Mark T Jones]

I have always enjoyed your contributions on here (I believe our senses of humour are similarly twisted).

I don't always agree, and as you know I absolutely avoid 'doom & gloom' prophecies - even if I suspect they might be right.

Avoiding/ignoring them is very easy - I can certainly see no need for anybody to be offended or upset by them.

You will be missed!

 

[Clinton]

Oh no, sorry to hear you're leaving @TheByre . You are one of the few sane voices around here.

But I completely get where you're coming from. The "direction" of the forum, since @Ozzy's return, leaves much to be desired, especially the drive towards making this a mega woke place.

Soon we won't be able to take any line except the standard establishment line whether on women/minorities, climate change, LGBTQ+ issues, Brexit, Covid vaccinations, whatever! You will not be able to express any view that doesn't meet with approval from the extremists among the "progressives".

Posting in a blog is different from posting in the forums - you'll get replies/responses in the forum from people you know (and don't know) so I've no idea what this Ethan guy is on about!

It seems UKBF wants the free content - the UGC - but without giving the author the satisfaction of having others respond to his content, without the interaction (probably the sole reason why he posted it in the first place!).

That's greedy, that's exploitative. And it would seem pretty dumb for any of us to make contributions in the "Community Writers" section except, of course, for those who're after a nofollow link. I'm certainly not going to make any more contributions there.

In the past, I've taken long breaks from this forum, the last was for a year. I'm considering another one and, possibly, deleting the account in due course if the woke nonsense continues.

All this deleting otherwise compliant threads because they've touched on "sensitive" topics or because they're deemed "editorial", moving them to Time Out so they'll stay out of search engine results etc. is crooked and dishonest (unless the T&Cs state clearly the preference for views that align only with certain political ideologies).

You've got my email address. Hopefully we can still keep in touch.

 

[ctrlbrk]

Sorry if you're going @The Byre - as others are saying, you're a valued contributor on UKBF - one of many examples is this crash course in Marketing (video in the link) which I found outperforms several paid-for courses (and many wannabe markteters in here) in just over 15 mins!

I hope you reconsider. I am sure many - like me - can learn much more from you.

 

[IanSuth]

I liked having someone to point out the shortcomings in my uni level economics which has become more and more obviously "perfect world" rather than real world optimised.

I can't honestly think of anything Byre has ever written that i thought was wrong - maybe more extreme in scope than I would expect but that is a matter of subjectivity and I think he has more life experience than me so I defer anyway.

As an aside i tried to react to the post but i seem to have lost the ability to

 

[Ethan39]

As an aside i tried to react to the post but i seem to have lost the ability to

Woops, that one's my fault.

Fixed now! Apologies! ?

 

[Joseph K]

I have had my latest posts deleted because they were blogs. I find that absurd as I was asked repeatedly to become a UKBF blogger, which I declined for the obvious reason that hardly anyone read UKBF blogs - which is, I assume, why they disappeared.

I am also seeing an ever more absurd and childish attitude towards moderation here and an accompanying fall in hits and posts - something I have seen in many other forums that went on to fail!

I have also had my business status rescinded and never received any invoices for any money paid thus far, despite requesting this on several occasions.

I want to thank all the lovely and witty people I have met here - you know who you are and you are too many to mention! I have spoken to many of you on the phone and you have looked at my videos and emailed me. There would have to be personal thanks going out to over 100 people - and I do have other things to do!

I have tried to reach out and help as many people here as possible and in all that time, I have I hope remained polite and courteous, whilst also stating the bunt truths of running a business. (Well, nobody said that it is easy!)

I have also provided (I hope!) insights into what is happening in the wider world economy and it is the editorial nature of those posts that has caused trouble. Perhaps the economy in the eyes of UKBF has little to do with business - who knows! I am after all (AFAIK) one of the few economists here - and I am also I believe the only German here (Despite having a very British name and a second UK passport!) and we Germans are a philosophical people. If you ask a German the time, he will either want to discuss why it is that you need to know - or he will assume that this is the opening to a wider discussion on the very nature of time and man's relationship with time. From there, it is but a short step to discussing life itself!

Overall, it has all been a pleasant time on UKBF, but given recent developments and the clear implication that my opinion pieces are somewhat unwelcome here - that and I spend too much time here anyway - it is time to take my hat and leave.

Be careful out there - share prices are tanking, a banking crisis looms and recession/depression is probably inevitable, either next year or 2025. So all you SMEs out there, buckle up and avoid high-interest debt!

I believe there is a facility to delete an account and I shall be making use of that facility in a day or so.

Hi The Byre,

Sorry to hear that.

Few weeks ago I was about to leave this Forum too, from the reaction I've received when I was trying to just share some positive news. I've realised that people can say what they want, but it's me who decide whether that opinion is pointless or not. I don't mind what people say or think about me, I'll carry on helping and encouraging others!

I think your contribution in this Forum has been positive for some, maybe not very good for others, but it's ok, at least you've expressed your thoughts.

I hope you reconsider.

Best regards

Joseph

 

[clyde123]

@TheByre : really sorry to read this. I don't often contribute in this forum, although I look in fairly frequently. I will miss your take on the overall business situation. Business - whether big or small - is affected by many environments. Keeping your eye on the ball involves much more than just the next sale.

All the best.

 

[Mark T Jones]

Is it just me wondering how @The Byre got fish, but we got nothing?

 

[Annoying Donkey]

Sorry if you're going @The Byre - as others are saying, you're a valued contributor on UKBF - one of many examples is this crash course in Marketing (video in the link) which I found outperforms several paid-for courses (and many wannabe markteters in here) in just over 15 mins!

I hope you reconsider. I am sure many - like me - can learn much more from you.

Except he's full of b*ll*cks...!

I've just watched the video and it did crack me up.

OK, if you follow his rules you'll likely produce a half decent Ad and maybe sell something.

But let's take a couple of examples, then I'll tell you the most important thing he missed out...

1. "It's All about the customer" he says.

Take a look at your website analytics. I'll lay you odds that the About page is one of the most visited pages on your site. If it's all about the customer, why is this so...? (It's also most likely where people exit your site, because usually the About page is boring...)

Some years ago, while preparing to go off on an adventure in the States, a friend sent me a video. It was a talking head, with this guy talking about his love of bread - not something that I am overly interested in, beyond eating it. He talked about how he went to Italy to learn how to make the best bread, blah blah blah.

But guess what... his enthusiasm for bread was infectious and I made a note of the address of his shop in San Francisco.

And we visited. The place was buzzing. We bought some bread and it was indeed very good. We went back several times. All because of this video that was all about the seller.

2. About half way through The Byre's video he recommends a book, Ogilvy on Advertising. And he shows the book. On the cover, in addition to the title, there are three words. "I hate rules". Yet here we have The Byre sprouting his 12 rules... Sorry, but that did make me chuckle...

So, what's the most important thing he missed out...?

The so called king of marketing, Gary Halbert called it his starving crowd.

If you're out in the desert and you come across somebody with a bag of gold dying of thirst... how hard do you think it would be to get him to exchange the bag of gold for a bottle of water? The worst copy in the world, "Gold for water", sold!

Try the same thing outside a supermarket where water can be bought fo 20p for a 2 litre bottle, even with the best copy in the world you will struggle...

With a starving crowd, you can have the worst sales pitch, the worst products, the worst personality and you'll still make sales...

Despite the above comments, I think the forum will be poorer with out The Byre, and I vote he should stay...

 

[ctrlbrk]

Yes, you just proved my point.

 

[fisicx]

Nobody is forcing him to leave. He has just got all pear shaped because he can’t post articles in the main forum. @Ethan39 has pointed out how he was given an opportunity to become an article author but he declined.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

We have a specific section of the forum for editorial content from our members, the "Community Writer" section:

Am I missing something?

The Community Writers link you posted doesn't appear to have a single article posted from 2023?

 

[MOIC]

@The Byre You'll be missed by all the forum members.

Your posts were witty, factual and provided a sense of humor that this forum really needs.

Enjoy your 'retirement' from UKBF . . . . . if you don't return!

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

@The Byre
This is a bad idea! I for one don't want you to leave as your advice wisdom and guidance is very important to me!

Maybe the site owners are much less knowledgeable than us and help is required .
Collectively we would have far more skill than them so forgiveness may be a wise choice today not walking away

 

[fisicx]

It’s a fit of pique. He has just gone all pear shaped because he has been reminded of the rules. If you want to post articles you do so in the right place.

 

[MOIC]

It’s a fit of pique. He has just gone all pear shaped because he has been reminded of the rules. If you want to post articles you do so in the right place.

A polite direct message to explain, rather than dismiss articles from a regular and one of the best forum members would have been more prudent.

 

[fisicx]

A polite direct message to explain, rather than dismiss articles from a regular and one of the best forum members would have been more prudent.

He has had multiple messages about this. If you read @Ethan39’s post he explains all that was done to accommodate him.

 

[Clinton]

Nobody is forcing him to leave.

Duh! No kidding!

...he has been reminded of the rules

The rules don't matter as much as you think they do. Don't kid yourself. My thread on why Pride should have a whole month was deleted despite the fact that it was completely within the rules.
The thread on banks closing accounts was moved to Time Out to take it out of visibility.


The tone of the forum has changed. And it's not for the better.

 

[fisicx]

The tone of the forum has changed. And it's not for the better.

@Ozzy has posted about this. He has good reasons for the changes and as explained, the forum will be a very minor part of the overall business.

Then there is the very mercenary answer which is: if you don’t like it, leave.

 

[Mark T Jones]

Things change

People move on.

Life and forums continue.

I see Ozzy had a big challenge here in maintaining a certain balance - keeping knowledge and experience whilst attracting young blood.

UKBF currently is something of an 'old boys' club', with the same voices dominating everything. Yes, I'm one of those old boys (sorry @Newchodge , so are you) - it is undoubtedly off-putting to newbies

I don't know the answer, but I suspect part of it is to keep the forum content relatively light and on point, whilst creating separate areas for deeper discussion.

Finally, I'll throw in the unpalatable thought that we are the old gits, still going to the same nightclub, but now complaining about the price of drinks and the volume of the music.

 

[Newchodge]

Finally, I'll throw in the unpalatable thought that we are the old gits, still going to the same nightclub, but now complaining about the price of drinks and the volume of the music.

While pointing out how good it usd to be.

 

[Newchodge]

I have had my latest posts deleted because they were blogs. I find that absurd as I was asked repeatedly to become a UKBF blogger, which I declined for the obvious reason that hardly anyone read UKBF blogs - which is, I assume, why they disappeared.

I am also seeing an ever more absurd and childish attitude towards moderation here and an accompanying fall in hits and posts - something I have seen in many other forums that went on to fail!

I have also had my business status rescinded and never received any invoices for any money paid thus far, despite requesting this on several occasions.

I want to thank all the lovely and witty people I have met here - you know who you are and you are too many to mention! I have spoken to many of you on the phone and you have looked at my videos and emailed me. There would have to be personal thanks going out to over 100 people - and I do have other things to do!

I have tried to reach out and help as many people here as possible and in all that time, I have I hope remained polite and courteous, whilst also stating the bunt truths of running a business. (Well, nobody said that it is easy!)

I have also provided (I hope!) insights into what is happening in the wider world economy and it is the editorial nature of those posts that has caused trouble. Perhaps the economy in the eyes of UKBF has little to do with business - who knows! I am after all (AFAIK) one of the few economists here - and I am also I believe the only German here (Despite having a very British name and a second UK passport!) and we Germans are a philosophical people. If you ask a German the time, he will either want to discuss why it is that you need to know - or he will assume that this is the opening to a wider discussion on the very nature of time and man's relationship with time. From there, it is but a short step to discussing life itself!

Overall, it has all been a pleasant time on UKBF, but given recent developments and the clear implication that my opinion pieces are somewhat unwelcome here - that and I spend too much time here anyway - it is time to take my hat and leave.

Be careful out there - share prices are tanking, a banking crisis looms and recession/depression is probably inevitable, either next year or 2025. So all you SMEs out there, buckle up and avoid high-interest debt!

I believe there is a facility to delete an account and I shall be making use of that facility in a day or so.

How am I going to cope without my surrogate Dad?

You will be deeply missed, not just by me.

 

[Clinton]

Then there is the very mercenary answer which is: if you don’t like it, leave.

Er, what do you think @The Byre has done?

He has good reasons for the changes and as explained, the forum will be a very minor part of the overall business.

Let's see. ? The forum was the business!

keeping knowledge and experience whilst attracting young blood

One major contributor of the knowledge and experience has now left. And the young blood? We've seen their "contributions"
???

 

[fisicx]

While pointing out how good it usd to be.

Except a lot of it wasn’t. It could be a nasty place with a lot of trolls. Thankfully that’s all gone now.

 

[fisicx]

Let's see. ? The forum was the business!

Emphasis on ‘was’. It’s not anymore.

 

[Clinton]

Actually, you know what, I think I'll take another break as well. I'm going to stop posting for a bit. I'll try not to make it a one year gap like before.

@The Byre , thanks for the kick in the backside.

Have a good time, all. I'm out of the forums for now.

 

[Ethan39]

Am I missing something?

The Community Writers link you posted doesn't appear to have a single article posted from 2023?

No, you're not missing anything.

 

[Ozzy]

As has already been shared in the past, the forums are not what I bought this site back for. They don’t form an important part of the direction of the site, and they are being changed away from the soap boxing and chitter chatter.

As @HFE Signs and @MOIC know, we removed blogs to remove site abuse and setup moderated and invitations only community writers to launch this year. Their accounts were setup ready for them to be able to post editorial content. I’ve also spoken to @Mark T Jones who has also provided content to form part of the business guides and advice within the community writers sections, such as business plan templates as an example.

As far as Google SEO and our marketing efforts are devoted, Google devalues forum content and our editorial side of the site is performing well.

@Clinton also knows this and has sent me some editorial for him to be include as a community writer, but reading his posts above I guess his memory isn’t what it used to be. I take from above he’s no longer interested in being included as a community writer.

@Mark T Jones pretty much hits the nail on the head and gets it. Some people won’t like it, and think the “value” of young and new people to business isn’t worthy their time or the questions being asked are below them. That’s fine, I make no issue with that and there are places such as Facebook and the likes for people to soap box about how young people are being encouraged into business by TV shows and how easy it is to make money.
I’ve decided to invest in publishing content and inviting members of the community to be involved and promote their businesses for doing so.
My objective is for the writers to win business, to get new orders in return for their content. Advertising on the site, links to their service or products, etc.

@The Byre was invited on more than one occasion (he’ll recall this as “blogs”) but he wanted to keep posting on the forums. It’s a shame he decided to ignore my requests and when we enforce the rules he leaves, it happens. His mechanism to post such threads is disappearing next month, we had to bring everyone in line at some point.

Again not everyone will like this direction of travel, the price of the drinks aren’t what they used to be etc etc. Clinton believes the UGC is of some high value within the forum, it really isn’t and Google’s way of devaluing that content demonstrates that. The forum has also devalued my business and caused more cost and issues to my business than I anticipated so having a site for people to just soap box and chitter chatter has no commercial benefit. Even less so if an unwelcoming culture in the forums drives young and inexperienced business people away. @Ethan39 deals with the requests from people for their accounts to be deleted, the reviews on various sites of people publicly stating how hostile the site is, and on top of that an unwelcoming post on these forums directly cost me a contract worth tens or thousands. I spoke to the member who’s post caused this on the phone and explained what had happened, hoping a chat would limit the risk to my business of their posts costing me business again. It would appear not to be the case.

If anyone doesn’t like the direction of travel for this site please do request for your account to be deleted through the support link Ethan posted above. I have a job to do and I know I won’t please everyone.

 

[Bob Morgan]

As has already been shared in the past, the forums are not what I bought this site back for. They don’t form an important part of the direction of the site, and they are being changed away from the soap boxing and chitter chatter.

As @HFE Signs and @MOIC know, we removed blogs to remove site abuse and setup moderated and invitations only community writers to launch this year. Their accounts were setup ready for them to be able to post editorial content. I’ve also spoken to @Mark T Jones who has also provided content to form part of the business guides and advice within the community writers sections, such as business plan templates as an example.

As far as Google SEO and our marketing efforts are devoted, Google devalues forum content and our editorial side of the site is performing well.

@Clinton also knows this and has sent me some editorial for him to be include as a community writer, but reading his posts above I guess his memory isn’t what it used to be. I take from above he’s no longer interested in being included as a community writer.

@Mark T Jones pretty much hits the nail on the head and gets it. Some people won’t like it, and think the “value” of young and new people to business isn’t worthy their time or the questions being asked are below them. That’s fine, I make no issue with that and there are places such as Facebook and the likes for people to soap box about how young people are being encouraged into business by TV shows and how easy it is to make money.
I’ve decided to invest in publishing content and inviting members of the community to be involved and promote their businesses for doing so.
My objective is for the writers to win business, to get new orders in return for their content. Advertising on the site, links to their service or products, etc.

@The Byre was invited on more than one occasion (he’ll recall this as “blogs”) but he wanted to keep posting on the forums. It’s a shame he decided to ignore my requests and when we enforce the rules he leaves, it happens. His mechanism to post such threads is disappearing next month, we had to bring everyone in line at some point.

Again not everyone will like this direction of travel, the price of the drinks aren’t what they used to be etc etc. Clinton believes the UGC is of some high value within the forum, it really isn’t and Google’s way of devaluing that content demonstrates that. The forum has also devalued my business and caused more cost and issues to my business than I anticipated so having a site for people to just soap box and chitter chatter has no commercial benefit. Even less so if an unwelcoming culture in the forums drives young and inexperienced business people away. @Ethan39 deals with the requests from people for their accounts to be deleted, the reviews on various sites of people publicly stating how hostile the site is, and on top of that an unwelcoming post on these forums directly cost me a contract worth tens or thousands. I spoke to the member who’s post caused this on the phone and explained what had happened, hoping a chat would limit the risk to my business of their posts costing me business again. It would appear not to be the case.

If anyone doesn’t like the direction of travel for this site please do request for your account to be deleted through the support link Ethan posted above. I have a job to do and I know I won’t please e

Consierate, Understanding and a National Treasure! - We could not expect anything less!

 

[ctrlbrk]

As far as Google SEO and our marketing efforts are devoted, Google devalues forum content and our editorial side of the site is performing well.

Bit off-topic for here, but why does Google devalues the forum? Is it because it has some 'unwelcoming' keywords as you mentioned? Or...?

 

[Ozzy]

Bit off-topic for here, but why does Google devalues the forum? Is it because it has some 'unwelcoming' keywords as you mentioned? Or...?

I don’t actually know the in’s and out’s, but what is fact is threads rank lower in the search results than editorial.
We’ve done a number of experiments taking a thread topic and writing a piece of editorial on the same subject, and the thread did nothing and the editorial hit front page results.

It’s been a long term issue for UKBF since before I bought it back, Google just slow death’d the forum over a few years. The domain name has a lot of content value though so published articles hit Google instantly.

 

[Ozzy]

LOL I can’t edit my own post @ctrlbrk but was going to add, that’s why people were selling posting a blog post on UKBF for £200 on sites like Fivver etc which is why we had to pull the blogs. We had “members” posting ****** and other spam blog posts be the hundreds.

 

[ctrlbrk]

LOL I can’t edit my own post @ctrlbrk but was going to add, that’s why people were selling posting a blog post on UKBF for £200 on sites like Fivver etc which is why we had to pull the blogs. We had “members” posting ****** and other spam blog posts be the hundreds.

Well you don't want that clearly.

As an aside - I can't edit my posts either - @Ethan39 have you been fiddling? ?

 

[Kerwin]

@Ozzy Sorry if this is a stupid question, but if the forums are not your main business, is that going to affect people with business membership?

 

[scstock]

Duh! No kidding!



The rules don't matter as much as you think they do. Don't kid yourself. My thread on why Pride should have a whole month was deleted despite the fact that it was completely within the rules.
The thread on banks closing accounts was moved to Time Out to take it out of visibility.


The tone of the forum has changed. And it's not for the better.

I could do without Culture Wars on here - plenty of that on Twitter.

 

[Ozzy]

@Ozzy Sorry if this is a stupid question, but if the forums are not your main business, is that going to affect people with business membership?

Yes, I did cover some of that in the announcement ?. In the Messages from UKBF area.