Royal Mail Price Increase 2013

[smo]

Quick question - do CRL guys need to update their PPI labels to show 24 and 48 images?

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Yes

You have about 2 months to change over to the new system before RM refuse to take it.

Consideing they only changed the PPI stamp last year its VERY short sighted, but fairly typical of RM.

 

[websnail]

My local post office is classing any cube below 16x16x16 as a small parcel ! So, if its 12x12x12 it's a small parcel, is this right ? I thought small parcels had to be no more than 8cm thick ?

Yes and no...

No it doesn't have to be a cube specifically but yes you can also have packages count as small parcel if it's less than 16cm in all three dimensions.

 

[kevin555]

How many pages of nonsense before someone with any sense makes the business point that actually raising costs of hobby sellers knocks them out of the loop or forces them to raise prices instead of selling at cost or just above. It was the first thing I thought of when I looked into the new pricing.

I mean this is a business forum isn't it? Or have all the businesses now left. Suggestions on signing petitions because someone has raised prices so that they can stay in business just beggars belief.

 

[TPH1]

How many pages of nonsense before someone with any sense makes the business point that actually raising costs of hobby sellers knocks them out of the loop or forces them to raise prices instead of selling at cost or just above. It was the first thing I thought of when I looked into the new pricing.

I mean this is a business forum isn't it? Or have all the businesses now left. Suggestions on signing petitions because someone has raised prices so that they can stay in business just beggars belief.

Obviously this side of it is great news. In fact I can't believe anyone that posts on a business forum is someone that sends less 3 items a day or less.

 

[paretowasright]

How many pages of nonsense before someone with any sense makes the business point that actually raising costs of hobby sellers knocks them out of the loop or forces them to raise prices instead of selling at cost or just above. It was the first thing I thought of when I looked into the new pricing.

I mean this is a business forum isn't it? Or have all the businesses now left. Suggestions on signing petitions because someone has raised prices so that they can stay in business just beggars belief.

Well judging by some of the totally over emotional 'I hate Royal Mail' type messages there has been on this subject I think you are right. Yes the price increases are a royal pain where the sun does not shine but if RM were losing money on larger parcels its totally understandable.....we would all do exactly the same thing.

 

[TPH1]

Well judging by some of the totally over emotional 'I hate Royal Mail' type messages there has been on this subject I think you are right. Yes the price increases are a royal pain where the sun does not shine but if RM were losing money on larger parcels its totally understandable.....we would all do exactly the same thing.

This doesn't justify their huge 10% increase on all other prices though, especially after last year's even larger increase and the fact that they reported a profit of over £100m in the last year.

 

[websnail]

How many pages of nonsense before someone with any sense makes the business point that actually raising costs of hobby sellers knocks them out of the loop or forces them to raise prices instead of selling at cost or just above. It was the first thing I thought of when I looked into the new pricing.

I mean this is a business forum isn't it? Or have all the businesses now left. Suggestions on signing petitions because someone has raised prices so that they can stay in business just beggars belief.

Perhaps I'm alone in this one but I remember how I started out, how important Royal Mail was to me and my business as a means of bootstrapping my way into the business I am now. I also recognise that the items I manufacture and sell fall heavily into the area that RM excel at so when prices increase here, my business gets hurt every time.

My own business model aside, it would be easy to sit here and pass judgement on the part timers because "I'm alright jack" but the reality of things is that there are a number of people in business who don't work 9-5, Monday to Friday or who work once the children are in bed, etc... for whom contract rates are not feasible. Are they not "in business" too or is this forum now only for bricks & mortar operations?

As for the changes, this was not some small price increase it was another goal-post moving exercise where the current excuse has been the increase in packets and parcels. Now, correct me if I'm wrong but no such mention was made 14 months ago when they were busy wringing their hands with tales of woe for the press and regulator.. No, last year it was all about the falling rates of letters and how the only thing keeping them going was eBay, etc...

This year the boogie man is parcels... Next year it'll be petrol prices and International mail.

In the past 2 years there has been a huge increase in rates on what used to qualify as small packets, with weight bands tossed out in favour of higher minimums and now we're into dimensional banding. It's a no brainer that sooner or later the same sort of exercise is likely to be applied to contract services given the salami tactics being employed to change things.


If Royal Mail had simply increased their prices instead of insisting on this whole song and dance routine of "It's all so much simpler and for you... honest!" that'd be one thing but, last year, promises were made to the regulator about small packet rates . To get around them they just changed the name and increased the prices considerably more. The fact that the regulator didn't so much as sniff at the change speaks volumes about how toothless they are.

We also get to hear all this guff about costs but if you ask any postie they go on about how top heavy with management the place is. Yeah, there's going to be some sour grapes about manglement, there always is, but the complaints are pretty consistent. Too many managers standing around doing diddly squat. Poor internal communication, no listening to the workers on the ground. Too many consultants with spreadsheets and optimisation routines and very little real world. All of this is costing tons and we're buying the party line wholesale?


So, yes, while there's an element of "All change sucks, Boo to Royal Mail" there's more than a little genuine business related concern that soon we'll have just another courier company that will be bleeding the small packet market dry.

And just as a parting thought... There are a number of core infrastructure services available in this country that contribute to business growth and Royal Mail is one of those. Surely it makes sense to actually use that in a non-profit financial sense if the overall "profit" is that of a strong micro and small business sector that has growth potential or do we really think it's a good thing that all businesses from this point on should be PLC's with bank loan backing and a workforce of 5 from the get go?

Seriously, is that a good thing or do we just care about ourselves and screw the rest?

 

[deniser]

I pay £1.85 for postage

This is presumably plus VAT? Do you pass the VAT on to the customer in your postage prices and reclaim it on the £1.85?

 

[roydmoorian]

This doesn't justify their huge 10% increase on all other prices though, especially after last year's even larger increase and the fact that they reported a profit of over £100m in the last year.

If it is so much of a problem for you why not deliver your packages yourself and see how much that costs !

 

[websnail]

If it is so much of a problem for you why not deliver your packages yourself and see how much that costs !

Yes absolutely... What a stunningly sensible suggestion!

Why don't you suggest that someone complaining about the cost of a new car, learn engineering, technical drawing, smelting, metal working, oh and build their own tools while their at it.. then they can make one themselves.

Oh and while we're at it, build their own oil extraction devices, cracking chambers and storage facilities for their own petrol.

It's called Economies of Scale, Divsion of Labour, Specialisation and a whole host of other concepts we've learned to adapt to and use in modern society.

 

[roydmoorian]

Yes absolutely... What a stunningly sensible suggestion!

Why don't you suggest that someone complaining about the cost of a new car, learn engineering, technical drawing, smelting, metal working, oh and build their own tools while their at it.. then they can make one themselves.

Oh and while we're at it, build their own oil extraction devices, cracking chambers and storage facilities for their own petrol.

It's called Economies of Scale, Divsion of Labour, Specialisation and a whole host of other concepts we've learned to adapt to and use in modern society.

Exactly - These are costs which have to be bourne so get your hand in your pocket and take advantage of this advanced society in which we live.

 

[TheGeekestLink]

Actually, this thread has been incredibly helpful. No one told me that PacketPost had reduced the number of parcels and while we could have achieved the 5000 a year from this year, we had previously fallen short of that number so we couldn't take advantage of it.

So Kulture really helped and we'll be starting their service in a few weeks, which means major savings!

But the number of ridiculous posts on this forum is highly depressing. It's supposed to be a business forum; if you've got issues, go vent them elsewhere so the serious business people can get (and give) the help they need!

 

[TPH1]

If it is so much of a problem for you why not deliver your packages yourself and see how much that costs !

Typical nonsense response to a genuine point.

Don't give me all that "their costs have to be paid" when they made £100m profit. It's just a greedy move to increase by 10% after one of their most profitable years, and they're pushing their luck. There are courier companies now offering £2.50 delivery, and all it takes is for them to come down a bit and Royal Mail to have another 10% increase and then they have a serious competitor.

 

[Chris34]

And just as a parting thought... There are a number of core infrastructure services available in this country that contribute to business growth and Royal Mail is one of those. Surely it makes sense to actually use that in a non-profit financial sense if the overall "profit" is that of a strong micro and small business sector that has growth potential or do we really think it's a good thing that all businesses from this point on should be PLC's with bank loan backing and a workforce of 5 from the get go?

Seriously, is that a good thing or do we just care about ourselves and screw the rest?

Excellent post and this is exactly what I've been thinking for the past couple of years. Lot's of people in business just don't seem to grasp the concept of this. It is quite right that private business should be left to adapt and evolve by themselves but only to a certain extent. When the country is competing with the likes of China for sales to UK customers and China can send it cheaper with the product price and the postage costs to here than we can send it just the postage costs then you know that something is not balanced on the scale of global economies.

To explain this let's use this example. It's an LED bulb shipped from China.

If I want to post a LED bulb from the UK to a customer in the UK the cheapest price I can send that bulb is £1.80 + VAT, now that is just the postage price it doesn't include the cost of the bulb. However I can buy an led bulb shipped from China for 0.99p , thats the bulb and the postage cost for 0.99p

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-GU5-3...Outdoor_Toys_ET&var=&hash=item1e76fc1e4d#shId

Why can a Chinese man send a package from China to the UK for half the price it would cost to send that same package from an address in the UK to another address in the UK?

The only reason I can think of is that the Chinese government are subsidising their postage and China is one of the few countries that still has a credible growing economy.


Chris.

 

[kulture]

This is presumably plus VAT? Do you pass the VAT on to the customer in your postage prices and reclaim it on the £1.85?

I am VAT registered, so I have to charge VAT, and naturally re-claim it when charged.

 

[websnail]

Exactly - These are costs which have to be bourne so get your hand in your pocket and take advantage of this advanced society in which we live.

I think you missed my point, possibly deliberately but whatever the reason.

All those economies of scale work to bring the cost down such that the idea of "deliver it yourself and see how much it costs you" is just daft.

You didn't sit there with a ton of solder, metal, and a workbench to build your computer or hand craft every electron to send out on to the Internet so why make flippant remarks that bear no resemblance to the reality we're in.

If we were referring to a high value product, requiring a courier from door to door and the prices for that were being argued, you'd be closer to having a point, but as it stands you're comparing apples to oranges.. Actually no, apples to deep fried squid...

 

[Jeff FV]

Just a reminder folks - you've now got less than a month to change your PPI labels from the Royal Mail 1st and 2nd design to the Royal Mail 24 and 48 design.

This applies to those of using the packet post service and the code "CRL"

The old (1st and 2nd) labels can be used until 5th July, but from 6th July you need to use the new 24 and 48 labels.

I use http://www.ppi-labels.co.uk/ to print my labels - I'm in no way affiliated to them, but have used them several times (recently got my 24 and 48 PPI labels from them - approx £8.50 for a thousand) and I'm happy to recommend them.

J

 

[JPMiddleton]

Just a reminder folks - you've now got less than a month to change your PPI labels from the Royal Mail 1st and 2nd design to the Royal Mail 24 and 48 design.

This applies to those of using the packet post service and the code "CRL"

The old (1st and 2nd) labels can be used until 5th July, but from 6th July you need to use the new 24 and 48 labels.

I use http://www.ppi-labels.co.uk/ to print my labels - I'm in no way affiliated to them, but have used them several times (recently got my 24 and 48 PPI labels from them - approx £8.50 for a thousand) and I'm happy to recommend them.

J

Likewise - very happy with the service, quality and delivery speed. well worth a visit if you need labels quickly.

 

[alanc]

They've made the new PPI image format even wider!
It won't fit on my current stock of blank stickers so I may have to discard those and get in a new lot.

Sheesh!

 

[Jeff FV]

They've made the new PPI image format even wider!
It won't fit on my current stock of blank stickers so I may have to discard those and get in a new lot.

Sheesh!

Don't bin them just yet - the 'delivered by Royal Mail' can be anywhere on the label - my new labels are the same width as my old ones.

J

 

[Golf Tee Warehouse]

What size labels are you using Alan?
We have just redesigned our labels to suit the new requirements and can still use the same blanks labels as we used before (64mmx38mm - 21 labels per sheet), by using the smallest PPI size and moving the 'Delivered by Royal Mail' logo below the new rectangular box and still leaving room for a return address below the Royal Mail 24/48 Insignia.

You can also have the 'Delivered By Royal Mail' logo elsewhere on the parcel and doesn't have to be on the PPI label, so could be incorporated into the address label or as a separate label.

 

[smo]

We have ours pre-printed on our packaging which means at this point in time we have approx 5000 boxes with the "old" style PPI on them already!

Royal Mail are a bunch of d*cks for chaning this again after they did it just last year.

We have been given an extra 2 months before we have to change after the official date....how generous!

 

[gr9ce]

Just about sums up the ridiculous new pricing...

Sent 2 x small parcel up to 1kg first class total cost £6

to same customer (who had paid for 1st class therefore courier out question)

Send both together 1 x medium parcel up to 2 kg 1st class £8.90

Therefore costs £2.90 LESS to process 2 items rather than 1. Imagine if this was a remote customer and one parcel missed the delivery cut off....2 trips simply because RM have not engaged brain.

 

[wayzgoose]

I suppose the thing is 2 small parcels go out in the posties bag. 1 medium parcel goes out in a van, so diesel, maintenance, van running costs etc. Of course the only problem there is that posties now seem to all arrive in a van, deliver to each road and then drive off to the next one!

 

[elraymonds]

I've just finished my new flowchart for my packers and anything going to the UK mainland that doesn't fit into a small packet size is now going by Interlink which is much cheaper than RM and gets delivered the next day. Before we only used to send by Interlink if it weighed more than 1 kilo. That's another 20% of my business that RM have lost on top of the circa 30% they lost on the last lot of increases.

Silly thing is RM gets left with the stuff they don't want which is Scottish highlands, islands and NI rather than my 500-1000g local parcels which must be much easier for them.

Did you publish it anywhere, where is the image. What is the flowchart software you used to draw it?

 

[Ryan_M]

Went to send a shoe-box weighing just over 1kg yesterday and was shocked to hear that the price was £8.90 for 1st class and £8 for second class.

That is absolutely absurd and it's really quite sickening. Our courier charges £7.50+vat for next day delivery, signed for with £50 insurance and anything up to 5kg - COLLECTED.

I was expecting the shoebox to cost around £4. Cannot understand what the RM are playing at or why they have been allowed to raise prices so high.

If they continue that way they'll go out of business in no time if privatised.

 

[wayzgoose]

If they continue that way they'll go out of business in no time if privatised.

It's the parcels that they wanted to reduce or get paid more for delivering - that was the plan. They were the loss makers and it had to be done to get the figures looking better for privatisation.

 

[Unshoesual]

Went to send a shoe-box weighing just over 1kg yesterday and was shocked to hear that the price was £8.90 for 1st class and £8 for second class.

That is absolutely absurd and it's really quite sickening. Our courier charges £7.50+vat for next day delivery, signed for with £50 insurance and anything up to 5kg - COLLECTED.

I was expecting the shoebox to cost around £4. Cannot understand what the RM are playing at or why they have been allowed to raise prices so high.

If they continue that way they'll go out of business in no time if privatised.

I found that. I sell shoes too and always post second class recorded. I sent a pair in march, £3.65. Same style in June, £6.30! I also have a few pairs that come in over 1kg. I've taken to weighing them first and removing any unnecessary packaging from the box. Boots will have to go via courier though as they're over 1kg

 

[highlander99]

I have just been looking at the PacketPost page on the RM website and one of the questions is 'do all of the parcels fit through a letterbox' - answering yes to this results in postage of £0.80+VAT, answering no results in postage of £1.80+VAT.

We do fit through letterboxes for our product (we have tested this extensively), however we are more than 25mm thick (which is the requirement if you click the help button for the question). Our product is about 33mm thick.

So would we need to tick no to this question and pay the higher postage despite making the general criteria of 'do you fit through a letterbox'?

 

[smo]

I have just been looking at the PacketPost page on the RM website and one of the questions is 'do all of the parcels fit through a letterbox' - answering yes to this results in postage of £0.80+VAT, answering no results in postage of £1.80+VAT.

We do fit through letterboxes for our product (we have tested this extensively), however we are more than 25mm thick (which is the requirement if you click the help button for the question). Our product is about 33mm thick.

So would we need to tick no to this question and pay the higher postage despite making the general criteria of 'do you fit through a letterbox'?

Have you got a link to that.

We use packetpost all the time for tens of thousands of packages but never heard of the 80p rate.

25mm is to do with large letters rather than parcels.

 

[highlander99]

Have you got a link to that.

We use packetpost all the time for tens of thousands of packages but never heard of the 80p rate.

25mm is to do with large letters rather than parcels.

royalmailtechnical.com /parcelpricecalculator/step1_calculator.cfm

I can't post live links on the forum yet, so remove the space after .com and add www at the front of the link.

Then just follow the steps, the letterbox question is towards the bottom of step 2

 

[Jeff FV]

I have just been looking at the PacketPost page on the RM website and one of the questions is 'do all of the parcels fit through a letterbox' - answering yes to this results in postage of £0.80+VAT, answering no results in postage of £1.80+VAT.

We do fit through letterboxes for our product (we have tested this extensively), however we are more than 25mm thick (which is the requirement if you click the help button for the question). Our product is about 33mm thick.

So would we need to tick no to this question and pay the higher postage despite making the general criteria of 'do you fit through a letterbox'?

The 'letterbox' dimensions are: 25mm thick by 353mmx250mm. If your item is below those dimensions it is a Large Letter, bigger and it becomes a packet. If your items are 33mm thick then they will not be a large letter and you will have to pay the higher rate for them to go as a packet.

You might want to get something like this to check your post.

royalmailtechnical.com /parcelpricecalculator/step1_calculator.cfm

I can't post live links on the forum yet, so remove the space after .com and add www at the front of the link.

Then just follow the steps, the letterbox question is towards the bottom of step 2

Here's a link to the page referred to above:

http://www.royalmailtechnical.com/parcelpricecalculator/step1_calculator.cfm

 

[roydmoorian]

Apparently a "standard" letterbox is 200mm x 38mm

 

[VATHelp]

Just a reminder folks - you've now got less than a month to change your PPI labels from the Royal Mail 1st and 2nd design to the Royal Mail 24 and 48 design.

This applies to those of using the packet post service and the code "CRL"

The old (1st and 2nd) labels can be used until 5th July, but from 6th July you need to use the new 24 and 48 labels.
/
I use to print my labels - I'm in no way affiliated to them, but have used them several times (recently got my 24 and 48 PPI labels from them - approx £8.50 for a thousand) and I'm happy to recommend them.

J

Hi, I use the BPL code. Can you please confirm that this does not apply to me as I am still using the 1st and 2nd class labels..

Thanks