Why tax employment ?

[Andrew Bolton]

We are soldiering on as a small business, purely damage limitation, because if we furlough one person then we have to furlough everyone, as we function as a team, so I am continuing to pay wages, without recourse to the taxpayer-funded furlough scheme, SO, I feel it is a terrible injustice that on top of that right now, we still , as an employer, have to pay an additional 16.8 % of everyone's wage to cover NI and pensions, I feel that is the Government really putting the boot in

Am I a lone voice ?

 

[Newchodge]

Are you not entitled to the Employer's NI allowance of £4,000?

 

[Andrew Bolton]

yes, though thought it was £3000..maybe it's gone up this year ? but that was on the table anyway, and our total annual bill is well excess this, so I just thought as a means of encouraging employers to continue to operate, and not call upon an 80% wage contribution ( plus NI and pension) this would be a practical concession for the Treasury to make

 

[Mark T Jones]

It’s a tough call, but my general view would be that if you are in a position to contribute you should do so

if everyone looks to take out the problem is either business

that’s a simplistic view, not a dig.

 

[Frimley111R]

On another business forum related to dealing with a recession type situation before, a guy said that the mistake he made before was paying/holding onto staff instead of just letting them go. It nearly bankrupted the company. It's not an easy decision to make but...

 

[Newchodge]

yes, though thought it was £3000..maybe it's gone up this year ? but that was on the table anyway, and our total annual bill is well excess this, so I just thought as a means of encouraging employers to continue to operate, and not call upon an 80% wage contribution ( plus NI and pension) this would be a practical concession for the Treasury to make

Has your income dried up or been substantially affected? Employers continue to operate because they have a viable business. Those who cease are those who have no business.

 

[Andrew Bolton]

Yes Cyndy, that is correct, our revenue has been severely disrupted though we still have overheads largely associated with premises ( and do not qualify for any grants or reliefs), By staying open and keeping people employed, we are limiting the losses and ensuring that we dont lose momentum, but there is no incentive from the State to do this, as opposed to what it would cost them if we furlough all staff,

 

[Mr D]

So why can you not furlough part of the staff?

Choice appears to be get help from government or don't get help from government. You'll have the same premises and other expenses either way - just whether wages bill is partly covered eventually.

 

[Andrew Bolton]

Thanks Mr D.
We need to either operate as a full squad of staff or none at all. I've written to my MP and the Treasury on this point for what it's worth, but of course dont expect a reply..I just think the furlough scheme is too much 'all or nothing' ... struggle on or shut down, The Government wants business to carry on where it can, so why not incentivise continued employment

 

[Mr D]

Thanks Mr D.
We need to either operate as a full squad of staff or none at all. I've written to my MP and the Treasury on this point for what it's worth, but of course dont expect a reply..I just think the furlough scheme is too much 'all or nothing' ... struggle on or shut down, The Government wants business to carry on where it can, so why not incentivise continued employment

One of the many companies who fall between the cracks.

Government does broad brush approach, dealing with business as a whole. Reality as we all know is that there are millions of variations possible some of which won't meet government ideals of business.
And we fall through the cracks to sink or swim without lifejacket, rubber ring, water wings or lifeboat. And the shore is a mile or more away!
A few will make it - by luck, by whatever. Can include mermaids or dolphins in the anology if you want - perhaps occasional businesses will have rich relatives willing to help. Not for most of us.

 

[Andrew Bolton]

I'm waving more than drowning, and just hope we can keep afloat, without any State assistance..and if we do, oh I so look forward to helping to reduce the Budget deficit in the years to follow by paying massive percentages of our hard fought profits to HMRC!

 

[Mr D]

I'm waving more than drowning, and just hope we can keep afloat, without any State assistance..and if we do, oh I so look forward to helping to reduce the Budget deficit in the years to follow by paying massive percentages of our hard fought profits to HMRC!

I'd suggest we move business elsewhere but everywhere will be in the same boat. Just differences in how tight the screws are, not whether there are screws.

 

[Stas Lawicki]

I can't help but feel you are extremely fortunate - as too are your workers. We are losing companies by the thousands a day and yet you are begrudging paying an expected tax bill - suggesting you will still make a profit! I can completely see where you are coming from and I appreciate the bailouts are somewhat lacking for some but the wheels are still turning and you are still making money. I am sure plenty would rather be in your shoes. Many won't come back from furlough as businesses will collapse.

If I were you, I would ready yourself for the looming recession. Streamline your costs, negotiate your rent, supplier bills, increase your supplier credit terms, refinance any debt whilst it's still cheap and available. Blame the pandemic but use this to arm you for what's still to come.

I'm not eligible for a scrap of assistance. I don't begrudge those getting paid to sit at home, instead I'm planning my new business.

Capitalise on what you have. Focus on bolstering your war chest and look back thankful you've ridden through a recession. Instead of writing to your mp, write to customers or anybody who can help your business.

Would you rather mothball your business and sit at home with everybody else? Or drive through and have something others won't have this time next year or in 2022?

 

[Alan]

I've written to my MP

but of course dont expect a reply.

Just an aside, I have written to my MP twice since the lockdown on business issues, and I have had two personal replies. Maybe my MP is more sympathetic to business issues or maybe no one writes to him.

 

[Financial-Modeller]

We are soldiering on as a small business, purely damage limitation, because if we furlough one person then we have to furlough everyone, as we function as a team, so I am continuing to pay wages, without recourse to the taxpayer-funded furlough scheme, SO, I feel it is a terrible injustice that on top of that right now, we still , as an employer, have to pay an additional 16.8 % of everyone's wage to cover NI and pensions, I feel that is the Government really putting the boot in

Am I a lone voice ?

I usually have little affinity to the government or payment of taxes, but surely the current unique situation of the government stepping in to cover costs of a significant portion of the population is exactly when taxation as a policy makes sense. Unfortunately no policy ever benefits everybody.

 

[Mr D]

Just an aside, I have written to my MP twice since the lockdown on business issues, and I have had two personal replies. Maybe my MP is more sympathetic to business issues or maybe no one writes to him.

But has anything changed as a result?

The politicians are good at replying. Actually doing something is much harder of course - and its usually a mistake for government to base decisions on the individual stories that they get told.
If they said tomorrow that all businesses would get £20k a quarter backdated to 1st March then great. Cannot see them saying 'we will alter the criteria to take account of this one additional business'.
Its been done - and backfired badly.

 

[Maxwell83]

If you have reduced revenue, then do you have less 'work'?

If so, now might be a good time to consider some changes - is there literally no way that you cannot complete the amount of work you currently have with less people? Maybe 1 person doing 2 roles, because they have less work in each role so its manageable?

I don't know your business, but you may need to ask whether you are soldiering on with a full team out of necessity or merely convention. The Government won't thank you for your sacrifice.

 

[STDFR33]

Why can’t you furlough some staff and not others?