The tobacco taboo - Part 2

[Clint911]

Following on from my previous thread about selling my hand rolled cigars I have been doing a lot of research and putting together an idea that I would like to run past other people to see if I'm on to something or just missing the mark.

Looking at the costs involved I would need to front up around £10K, that would cover legal fees, licensing, admin fees, a range of commercial molds and a nice stock of tobacco leaf to start rolling in larger amounts.

My USP

The process that makes my cigars have a unique flavour and a smooth smoke is a combination of my blend of different tobacco leafs as well as my aging process. I am based in Belfast and currently age the tobacco leaf in a small Titanic Whiskey Cask. I have considered a USP as a limited addition luxury hand rolled Titanic themed Cigar aged in an official Titanic Whiskey Cask.

I was thinking about adding a random individual number on each of the cigar bands and each number will correspond to a passenger or crew member of the Titanic and include a card with information about that person and if they survived or not.

Marketing

Marketing is where Im stumped, as we all know its a very restrictive and limited market when it comes to advertising and promotion so I am open to any suggestions on how I could market something like this.

Funding

I probably could fund the start up costs myself however my concerns with marketing would put me off throwing £10K at something, I have looked at other options loans/crowdfunding etc but tobacco ideas seem to be blacklisted. My final thought was to do a preorder type thing but then Im back to my marketing issue.

Thoughts?

Am I onto something or am I missing the mark on this?

 

[BusterBloodvessel]

I have to say I quite like the idea and certainly something different for cigar smokers, collectors etc. My first 2 concerns though, would be;

- Would this be seen as somehow tying yourself to the Titanic, passing off so to say as "official Titanic cigars" or whatever. Would somebody somewhere have an issue around that?
- I'm not overly sure about the limited number linked to a passenger thing. For me there might be a sense of "sit drinking brandy and smoking this fine cigar in the luxury of your parlour room, whilst reading about a poor teenager that died a cold, freezing, lonely, scary death".... I dunno, something doesn't sit right with that for me!

Is the titanic bit relevant, or is just ageing in whiskey barrels enough of a USP - does anyone do that already? (genuine question BTW, I have no idea). I'm a very occasional cigar smoker (perhaps once or twice a year) but I can tell you that something like that would interest me and I'd be tempted to buy one - as I would with one aged in a brandy cask, bourbon cask etc. Could focusing on different ageing vessels be more the key feature?

 

[Clint911]

Thanks for your comments.

I’m not sure myself regarding using the Titanic brand although there is thousand of businesses across the world who use the brand/image.

I only considered using titanic as I age my tobacco in the cask used for the official titanic whiskey. And I’ll be honest it’s why I love smoking my cigars. I tried the same mix without aging and it was a completely different smoke.

I thought about adding numbers/names as a way of making it more exclusive…but I see your point about being up sad story’s.

Some things to think about I think

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

Your biggest problem here is the high end customers that would enjoy this product many of them own Yachts (here in Devon)
This Titanic idea is a bad omen they have enough problems already

 

[AmazonGeek]

I don't smoke but I like it and I would imagine the marketing could be similar to something like 19 Crimes. Interactive labels for example and social marketing directed at cigar smokers would be fairly straightforward I imagine. I wouldn't personally go in too heavy on the death side of it but the fact that the casks are associated with the ship somehow makes it unique and memorable.

Whilst you can't sell tobacco products on Amazon, you could sell the accessories that go with them, although as @BusterBloodvessel says above, you could have an issue with IP so I would check that out first. On the face of it, the story is in the public domain but you would need to be careful not to step on the toes of others who have trademarked/copyrighted related things (like the movie for example).

 

[FreddyG]

Certain products are really taxes on-the-hoof.

And tobacco is one of them. That is why it is totally illegal to make and sell your own whisky or tobacco. It is even a crime to grow tobacco without a license.

To get a license one must post a substantial bond and have the buildings and equipment inspected and approved!

But I like the idea - so good luck! (But too many people own some TM for the word Titanic, so I would stay away from that word and find something new and original.)

 

[Chris Ashdown]

Taste is a funny thing and very personal, but in the end you will be selling cigars just like every other seller in the world. It's the cigar that sells, send out 50-100 free to some well known cigar buyers and get their response to your cigars and use that result to market your cigar, Forget things like "Titanic" its in poor taste to market on a disaster. Do you have the skills to make the perfect cigar?

 

[Paul Kelly ICHYB]

You know I am already sold on the idea!

Here's some feedback/thoughts:

• Any connection to the Titanic should be limited and a range/sub brand of the main brand. Apart from potential licensing issues (check to see if the name is protected for tobacco products), there is the class issues, as mentioned, but more importantly, it failed!
  NOTE TO ALL: for those who do not know, the Titanic distillery is on the dockside of where the ship was built. This would be enough to push through the negatives and I assume that you already have a relationship as you are using their casks.
• There are a number of other wonderful distilleries in your part of the world (north and south). Additionally, tie in with them and create branded products, riding on their brand coattails.
• Have at least one core non whiskey product, to demonstrate unadulterated quality
• Marketing has a few prongs
  • Tie ins/joint with the primary whiskey brand
  • Lifestyle marketing (probably where SM comes into play)
  • Wherever cigar brands advertise at the moment
  • Entrepreneurial exposure - when the Titanic Distillery launched, there was a TV program made about it - is something similar possible here? UK made premium cigars is also a good story.

 

[Scalloway]

Any connection to the Titanic should be limited. ..... importantly, it failed!

Among the Titanic themed merchandise available in Belfast is a t-shirt with the slogan 'She was alright when she left here'

 

[Clint911]

Your biggest problem here is the high end customers that would enjoy this product many of them own Yachts (here in Devon)
This Titanic idea is a bad omen they have enough problems already

Nothing better to forget your problems than relaxing with a luxurious hand rolled smooth flavoured Titanic Robusto cigar lol

I don't smoke but I like it and I would imagine the marketing could be similar to something like 19 Crimes. Interactive labels for example and social marketing directed at cigar smokers would be fairly straightforward I imagine.

Yes I do drink 19 Crimes which did give me the similar idea.

Certain products are really taxes on-the-hoof.

And tobacco is one of them. That is why it is totally illegal to make and sell your own whisky or tobacco. It is even a crime to grow tobacco without a license.

To get a license one must post a substantial bond and have the buildings and equipment inspected and approved!

But I like the idea - so good luck! (But too many people own some TM for the word Titanic, so I would stay away from that word and find something new and original.)

Taxes is a huge chunk and something that will always increase every year until tobacco is banned completely which is a concern.

Taste is a funny thing and very personal, but in the end you will be selling cigars just like every other seller in the world. It's the cigar that sells, send out 50-100 free to some well known cigar buyers and get their response to your cigars and use that result to market your cigar, Forget things like "Titanic" its in poor taste to market on a disaster. Do you have the skills to make the perfect cigar?

Agreed I haven't like loads of cigars that I tried previously but my own aged and rolled cigars just taste completely different than I have found so far. Giving out free samples is an idea however I would still have to pay the tobacco tax and it would cost thousands in free samples with the hope of return customers - but it is something that I will think about.

Also people might call it a disaster but it was our greatest success - just a shame about the Englishman in charge of her lol

You know I am already sold on the idea!

Here's some feedback/thoughts:

• Any connection to the Titanic should be limited and a range/sub brand of the main brand. Apart from potential licensing issues (check to see if the name is protected for tobacco products), there is the class issues, as mentioned, but more importantly, it failed!
  NOTE TO ALL: for those who do not know, the Titanic distillery is on the dockside of where the ship was built. This would be enough to push through the negatives and I assume that you already have a relationship as you are using their casks.
• There are a number of other wonderful distilleries in your part of the world (north and south). Additionally, tie in with them and create branded products, riding on their brand coattails.
• Have at least one core non whiskey product, to demonstrate unadulterated quality
• Marketing has a few prongs
  • Tie ins/joint with the primary whiskey brand
  • Lifestyle marketing (probably where SM comes into play)
  • Wherever cigar brands advertise at the moment
  • Entrepreneurial exposure - when the Titanic Distillery launched, there was a TV program made about it - is something similar possible here? UK made premium cigars is also a good story.

Yes I had considered a Titanic cigar to be part of the range not the actual brand.

I haven't actually tried other distillery casks mainly because I don't have contacts to get my hands on one but its something I could look at.

Marketing is still the massive grey area, one dodgy post on social media could have your pages shut down without question and it seems every form of advertising that I have done in the past outlaws tobacco ads.

Among the Titanic themed merchandise available in Belfast is a t-shirt with the slogan 'She was alright when she left here'

THIS!

 

[Paul Kelly ICHYB]

'She was alright when she left here'

Maybe that is part of the branding.

 

[Clint911]

'She was alright when she left here'

Maybe that is part of the branding.

Love it, I actually had an idea for a 4 pack box with the titanic printed on the bottom of the front and and transparent window making the 4 cigars the 4 funnels of the titanic.....

 

[ethical PR]

Following on from my previous thread about selling my hand rolled cigars I have been doing a lot of research and putting together an idea that I would like to run past other people to see if I'm on to something or just missing the mark.

Looking at the costs involved I would need to front up around £10K, that would cover legal fees, licensing, admin fees, a range of commercial molds and a nice stock of tobacco leaf to start rolling in larger amounts.

My USP

The process that makes my cigars have a unique flavour and a smooth smoke is a combination of my blend of different tobacco leafs as well as my aging process. I am based in Belfast and currently age the tobacco leaf in a small Titanic Whiskey Cask. I have considered a USP as a limited addition luxury hand rolled Titanic themed Cigar aged in an official Titanic Whiskey Cask.

I was thinking about adding a random individual number on each of the cigar bands and each number will correspond to a passenger or crew member of the Titanic and include a card with information about that person and if they survived or not.

Marketing

Marketing is where Im stumped, as we all know its a very restrictive and limited market when it comes to advertising and promotion so I am open to any suggestions on how I could market something like this.

Funding

I probably could fund the start up costs myself however my concerns with marketing would put me off throwing £10K at something, I have looked at other options loans/crowdfunding etc but tobacco ideas seem to be blacklisted. My final thought was to do a preorder type thing but then Im back to my marketing issue.

Thoughts?

Am I onto something or am I missing the mark on this?

Who do you see as your target market? you should build your marketing plan around a clear understanding of the media , consumer and digital habits of your target market.

I normally research and develop 4-6 detailed 'persona's' when doing a marketing campaign.

 

[Kerwin]

In terms of marketing have you thought about getting in contact with YouTubers who smoke cigars and other tobacco products? There are quite a few of them out there. I'm not sure what the laws are regarding this but you could probably send them a "gift" to smoke on camera.

 

[bodgitt&scarperLTD]

Certain products are really taxes on-the-hoof.

And tobacco is one of them. That is why it is totally illegal to make and sell your own whisky or tobacco. It is even a crime to grow tobacco without a license.

To get a license one must post a substantial bond and have the buildings and equipment inspected and approved!

But I like the idea - so good luck! (But too many people own some TM for the word Titanic, so I would stay away from that word and find something new and original.)

Slight correction here (assuming you're a Brit, this is after all a UK forum)-

Distilling alcohol of any kind is illegal without a licence (but a thoroughly enjoyable hobby nevertheless)
Growing tobacco for your own consumption is legal- but selling it is not. And you should technically declare how many kilos you grow and pay duty on it...