The #AntiWork Movement

[Ozzy]

I'd never heard of this until about 5 minutes ago, when we got a journalist enquiry come through. A quick Google to see what it means and I'm going to be most un-PC for me but...seriously?

For those like me who had never heard of this;
Antiwork is a moral alternative to the obsession with “jobs” that has plagued our society for too long. It’s a project to radically reframe work and leisure. It’s also a cognitive antidote to the pernicious culture of “hard work,” which has taken over our minds as well as our precious time.

I quickly realised this request isn't one for UKBF, where I'd advocate that if you want to build a successful business you need to put in the hard work and the dedication needed. No-one owes you anything, don't expect anything from anyone, and be prepared to put in 24/7. Don't expect the same from your staff, they owe you nothing, but look after them and they'll look after you.

At least that's what I think, anyone have a different opinion?

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Yes
Having been out of work in the past, albeit many years ago, I met people from both ends of the spectrum for whom work was an impossible choice. At the top were business executives who were at a level of ability and of an age where they were unemployable through personal circumstances, lack of drive, been their got the t-shirt etc., and who were only attending 'Job Club' so they could get their stamp paid. At the lower end, the social inadequate's who didn't get a good education, who didn't fit in with anyone, who likely these days would be assessed as being on some sort of spectrum, were quite simply unemployable, yet were destined for a lifetime of harassment by the SS (Social Security not the Waffen) using energy and time spent that would be better directed elsewhere.

There's an acceptance that some people don't like heights, spiders, crowds, all of which are considered to be acceptable phobias, yet zero acceptance of those who are not attuned to a 40 hour working week?

I'm not advocating Antiwork but we've all heard stories of people working themselves into the ground, 'you need a holiday mate', and think life work balance is essential.

 

[ctrlbrk]

From what I understand, post #1 is about people who claim to be 'anti-work', but post #2 is about people who are either burn out or their work skills aren't up to scratch for whatever reason.

Isn't this apples and oranges?

 

[AllUpHere]

I'm not a fan of the whole work / life balance idea. I know it's a bit of a cheesy cliché, but if you love what you do, you'll never work a day in your life.

Half the time, an observer would be hard pushed to know whether I'm working or not.

 

[Ozzy]

Isn't this apples and oranges?

Partly yes, but I think the "movement" could cover both (I don't actually know as I only just found out about the hashtag).

I actually agree with ensuring a work/life balance and always encourage my team to take time for their families and personal lives, use up their holidays, etc. Our employment contracts have no working hours on them, start work when you want and leave when you want, take as long as you like for lunch. It states we expect to see 7 hours of productivity a day, at a time that suits you.

However, as the business owner I still have 17 days holiday to take by the end of the year which I won't find the time to take and I'm not sure I could reduce my hours to only 40 hours a week. There once was a time I had, but not since Covid and then buying these forums back . I don't practice what I preach, and that was where I was coming from - coming from the perspective as a business founder/owner and the idea of #Antiwork.
My OP isn't relevant or aimed at employees, but thinking of employees perspective I agree with @Lucan Unlordly 's post hence my comment "don't expect the same from your staff".

 

[Newchodge]

I'd never heard of this until about 5 minutes ago, when we got a journalist enquiry come through. A quick Google to see what it means and I'm going to be most un-PC for me but...seriously?

For those like me who had never heard of this;
Antiwork is a moral alternative to the obsession with “jobs” that has plagued our society for too long. It’s a project to radically reframe work and leisure. It’s also a cognitive antidote to the pernicious culture of “hard work,” which has taken over our minds as well as our precious time.

I quickly realised this request isn't one for UKBF, where I'd advocate that if you want to build a successful business you need to put in the hard work and the dedication needed. No-one owes you anything, don't expect anything from anyone, and be prepared to put in 24/7. Don't expect the same from your staff, they owe you nothing, but look after them and they'll look after you.

At least that's what I think, anyone have a different opinion?

I recall a senior common room conversation in Durham in the early 90's. Unemployment was high and it was suggested that one of the things needed was to stop identifyig people by their 'role' I am a student, you are a lecturer, what are you? I am nothing as I am unemployed. At the time the premise was that full employment was never going to happen. Now the 'presence' attitude to the wokplace is causing a different problem. I got to my desk at 6am and stayed until 8pm. Really, and in that time you achieved about 3 hours of productive work.

Has anyone noticed how the word 'pensioners' when mentioned by politicians is always suffixed with the words who have worked hard all their lives. What a pile of rubbish. Anyone who has spent their entire life on state benefits is entitled to a full state pension, for what THAT is worth. Similarly 'hard working families' as if they are more deserving of help than those who are unable to work.

 

[The Byre]

Two issues are being mixed here - work and jobs. I am anti 'jobs' but pro-work. haven't had a job since the 70s, but I still work hard. The future of work is not 'jobs' but business relationships.

I used to have employees - now I provide employment. PAYE is dying, to be replaced with employment.

 

[WaveJumper]

Funny enough I was reading about this the other day after picking up on the topic on Redditt. I think the subject has come to the fore again during the pandemic where people have been questioning their life work balance, or lack of this and I think for many this has been bought into focus even more so due to the imposed work from home which was forced upon many.

Coupled with the underlying feeling that companies in so many cases just treat you as a number, have shown no loyalty to the workforce and in many cases over the last few years have undertaken policies forcing down wages, incentives etc thus not encouraging any long-term commitment from their employees.

Just look at the number of posts on the forum during the pandemic regarding people wanting advice on starting a new venture for many (quite often commented on) exchanging one job for another but in reality, are probably just trying to take back control of their lives by working for themselves.

I found my way to this link on the subject which was quite an interesting read and probably sums it up a lot better than myself.

https://www.huckmag.com/art-and-cul...-community-calling-for-the-abolition-of-work/

 

[Deleted member 59730]

This was a common theme in Sci-Fi stories in the 50s and 60s. One day machines will do the work and we will all fill our time with pleasure.

Now its the Chinese will do all the work and cause all the pollution while we play CandyCrush all day.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

From what I understand, post #1 is about people who claim to be 'anti-work', but post #2 is about people who are either burn out or their work skills aren't up to scratch for whatever reason.

Isn't this apples and oranges?

No it's you say Tomata I say Tomato, another angle. I await your contribution with baited breath

 

[cjd]

The problem with being alive is that you have to do something that prevents you from being dead. Our big mistake was agriculture. Before agriculture we just foraged and hunted and if we called it anything (we didn't) we called it living. When we invented farming it became work.

Work is something you wouldn't do if you didn't have to.

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

This a charter for lazy b£££££ds

I like the rewards from what I have done and there is a reason we are one of the riches nations on the planet

 

[Ozzy]

Work is something you wouldn't do if you didn't have to.

I think many people still would in one form or another. Some, and I include myself in this, get satisfaction from a sense of purpose and work gives some a sense of purpose.
Had this conversation with friends a while back about would you work if you didn’t need the money too, and most proclaimed they would.

 

[cjd]

I think many people still would in one form or another. Some, and I include myself in this, get satisfaction from a sense of purpose and work gives some a sense of purpose.
Had this conversation with friends a while back about would you work if you didn’t need the money too, and most proclaimed they would.

Sure, lots of people work when they don't need to. I'm one of them.
But if you work when you don't have to, it's called a hobby.

 

[InsuranceBroker]

Yes, I've heard of it and watched some videos from fresh out of uni students to try to understand the 'movement'. No matter what philosophical, economic spin these want to put on it, it appears to me to be another self entitled trend. Everyone wants something for nothing. This is the 2021 version of the nonsense that suggests capitalism is evil. In their view, it's saintly to sit around all day and watch the world spin why they decry the evil capitalists who pay their own bills, and the bills of these dreamers, through hard work.

 

[cjd]

There's a theory that humans blew it a few thousand years ago when they started farming. Up to that point people caught and gathered their food and lived in shelters that they made as they needed them. Life was just living.

As soon as they started farming, they invented work and it's been downhill ever since.

 

[AllUpHere]

There's a theory that humans blew it a few thousand years ago when they started farming. Up to that point people caught and gathered their food and lived in shelters that they made as they needed them. Life was just living.

As soon as they started farming, they invented work and it's been downhill ever since.

I read that and thought ''i just read the very same idea a few posts back''.
Turns out it's not me going mad, it's you.

 

[cjd]

I read that and thought ''i just read the very same idea a few posts back''.
Turns out it's not me going mad, it's you.

Yup, I'm getting too old for this sh!t...

 

[japancool]

Even up until fairly recently, most human activity involved generating enough calories to survive until the next day, and not being eaten by bears.

 

[simon field]

I think many people still would in one form or another. Some, and I include myself in this, get satisfaction from a sense of purpose and work gives some a sense of purpose.
Had this conversation with friends a while back about would you work if you didn’t need the money too, and most proclaimed they would.

But, don’t you think that’s because we’ve been indoctrinated into believing that work is what we have to do to ‘make a living’?

If there was no such concept (hard to imagine I know), would anyone - once past childhood - just start randomly labouring for fun?

 

[Paul Carmen]

It's like everything else, horses for courses. Some people love their jobs, others hate them. Many have no choice in the matter.

Most of us on this forum either control our work and destinies, love our work, or at least have a strong say in how/where we work, so are not a representative bunch.

Unfortunately many jobs are pretty crappy in some way. Presenteeism is rife, the rise of zero hours, low rate pay, 5 over 7 contracts with no overtime, supposedly self employed jobs that are really disguised employment, means that many people work really hard and don't get a good reward. They don't have any control or enjoy much of their daily life. They won't go to their grave wishing they had worked more or harder, but that they spent more time with their family or experienced more of the world...

 

[MattRumbelow]

I'd not heard of this specific hashtag, but I've heard a lot around this idea. I think a big part of it is some people stepping away from the overly competitive 'presenteeism' of many offices. I think some people found that they don't want to end up like the 'salarymen' in Japan, who are expected to work all hours godsend, sleep at their desk and even 'work' in their social hours by making sure they get tactically, outrageously drunk with their colleagues to keep up with expectations.

At a broader scale, I think a lot of people look at the progress made at the start of the 20th century (8 hour work day, 5 day work week, holiday pay, sick pay, etc.), and have noticed that very little progress has been made since. For people working zero-hour contracts, or who simply cannot 'switch off' due to their 24-hour connection to work, they may even feel that the world is going backwards.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

even 'work' in their social hours by making sure they get tactically, outrageously drunk with their colleagues to keep up with expectations.

Been there, done it, got the t-shirt, although from my perspective I was working - for a newspaper serving the licensed trade, albeit somewhat poorly explained as 'market research'