TAS Books & MTD

[andoclaire]

Hi,

I'm just wondering if anybody is using TAS Books, and if so what you're doing about MTD.

On their advice, we've moved over to Sage. But I hate it! It doesn't do what they said it would do, and really doesn't work well for us.

They do an add-on to make TAS MTD, but that's only going to be effective until Jan 2020 when, in their own words, they will be winding down TAS.

 

[John Hemming]

You should be able to bridge from TAS to HMRC.

 

[NicoJ]

John is correct but bridging software is only a short term solution. If TAS is winding down (I thought they'd disappeared actually) then you would be better off looking for a bookkeeping software that you like and switching to that.

 

[John Hemming]

I cannot myself understand why bridging software is a short term solution beyond TAS winding down which may be a good reason to move somewhere else. (only may, however)

 

[NicoJ]

Bridging software is a short term concession regarding MTD. The goal of which is that HMRC has 4 quarterly submissions from accounting software.
Eventually everybody will need to have accounting software if HMRC gets it act together.

 

[John Hemming]

That is not true. The short term concession which applies until the end of March 2020 is about Digital Links.

The key vat notice is this one:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...t/vat-notice-70022-making-tax-digital-for-vat

What evidence is there that sustains your argument about bridging software? I am not aware of any.

 

[DWS]

Originally HMRC said that bridging software could only be used for the first 12 months but they went back on this.
At a MTD seminar at Accountex earlier this year the speaker from HMRC was asked this question about bridging software and she confirmed it will still be able to be used after the initial 12 month period

 

[NicoJ]

I have no interest in any argument therefore this will be my last post on this thread.

There has been many concessions & backtracking from HMRC with regards to this issue. They want everybody on accounting software with figures being sent directly to them, bridging software does not achieve this. Various issues have kicked this can down the road but this is the aim, as I said, when HMRC get their act together.

I am simply advising the OP that, in my opinion, it would be better for them to look at new software now instead of being forced to move software later down the line.

 

[John Hemming]

A lot of this is the sort of confusion that often occurs when people report what public bodies are doing. It has never been and would never be a requirement that any accounting system only operates on one server or in one virtual machine.

For example if the accounts are kept on an IBM iSeries there is no reason why that information has to go directly from the iSeries to HMRC. Instead it goes through bridging software (a practical example) to HMRC.

There has been a debate as to whether Excel or any other spreadsheet is functional software. I have not seen any evidence that HMRC have formally said it isn't.

Even if the UK implemented SAF-T that would prevent the usage of spreadsheets.

There have been concessions from HMRC, but I don't think any were on the actual issue of using spreadsheets and they never could be about the use of intermediate software to transfer data to HMRC.

 

[UK Contractor Accountant]

As above the MTD goal is for the annual Tax Return to dissappear and everybody would have their own tax digital acccount which would be pre populated with pensions, employment income, savings interest etc direct by HMRC.

Self employed taxpayers will have to send up three quartertly summaries of income less expenses and then final quarter with details of capital allowances claims and other income & allowances claims.

 

[John Hemming]

That is the Self Assessment API which is in fact already live.

 

[UK Contractor Accountant]

Yes but the point being that when MTD for SA becomes manadotory self employed taxpayers will be forced onto some form of book-keeping sofware which will already be MTD VAT enabled.

HMRC said they will only be providing free MTD software for businesses with the most simplest of affairs, whatever that maybe.

 

[John Hemming]

It is useful to see the original sources to work out what HMRC actually mean.

From the developers email I can say. HMRC will provide a submission system for businesses with a turnover below 85K for VAT and this will probably happen in August. (that is their target date). Similarly self-employed businesses with a turnover below 85K do not have to provide an analysis of their expenditure. That, probably, is what they are meaning, but if you can give a link to the original source I may be able to explain this further.

Although I am working on software (a cloud cashbook) which will be capable of doing an SA analysis and return as well as VAT (which it does at the moment), I would expect excel plus bridging to be able to do this as well and I offer that.

It is, of course, complicated because you get things which are allowed for VAT and things which are allowed for SA both on the income and expenditure side which do not have a correlation coefficient of 1 and, of course, there are capital allowances etc.

Hence as long as the cost is reasonable I would expect many people to migrate to some form of accounting system. My cost is quite low for the cashbook compared to cloud accounting.

MTD runs on a new database/mainframe system and obviously HMRC would not want to run the old one for ever. Hence I would expect them to default new registrants to MTD at some stage and allow the opt out (which is also August 2019).

 

[dvddarren]

I'd just like to add to the debate about bridging software.
HMRC's latest developer email states:

Following our exit from the pilot, into live, we are seeing an encouraging increase in developer led marketing and communications around MTD. While we welcome all of your assistance with raising MTD awareness we have also received a small number of complaints about some developer material suggesting that bridging products will be unsupported after 2020. This is incorrect, we have no plans to stop supporting bridging solutions. The complex nature of some business models makes bridging solutions the most practical solution in some scenarios.


We would appreciate you ensuring that your messaging around bridging products is clear and accurate.

Bridging software is going nowhere and is a great solution for many.