Take me through it

[BusinessDeli]

I recently decided against opening a retail store and have opted for an ecommerce version instead. I've created websites in the old static styles and in the modern always changing styles such as wordpress so am happy in the main with how it works. What I have not used is a dedicated ecommerce solution so I'd be grateful for some additional knowledge before I go too far wrong!
I was intending to use WP and use woocommerce or similar but having read through some posts here it sounds as though I would be better off using opencart or similar (I have few products to start but anticipate expansion).
I've had a quick read on the opencart site but would like to know more about the similarities between WP and OC. They both appear to have templates but what is OC like for customising? Easy, hard, same as WP? Also, is the process for installing OC similar (ie buy your hosting download and install OC)?
What about the extensions? Does OC come with everything you need or do you have to invest extra to get trading? Is there the ability to add in extra pages such as blogs or just standard information pages that aren't used in the shop?
Finally does OC provide any accounting information reports etc?

Lots of basic questions but I can't seem to get a handle on exactly what OC actually is from their website so any help is appreciated. I'm going to try it out on XAMPP in the meantime to get a better handle on it...

 

[jdbcomputing]

Trying it out on XAMPP is the best plan.

Opencart requires Apache/PHP/MySQL, which should be provided by your hosting provider (unless you have a dedicated server or VPS, in which case you'll need to install them).

Wordpress commerce can be okay for smaller sites, but I'd recommend Opencart for more than 20 or so items.

OC will come with everything you need to accept payments by Paypal or most card processing firms. Theres quite a lot of free extensions, too: http://www.opencart.com/index.php?route=extension/extension&filter_license=0

OC templates are actually pretty hard to customise, as is adding in extra pages. I'd consider running your shop on yourdomain.com/ and a blog or whatever else you need on blog.yourdomain.co.uk/ and just create links between the two.

 

[BusinessDeli]

Thanks for that. I've got it installed on XAMPP and making roads into finding my way about... I found it odd that the 'top admin' has to edit their user group permissions to edit certain things.
I'm reluctant to maintain two sites for the same business but will bear it in mind.
Job for the day is to look at customisation!

 

[jdbcomputing]

I can't say I'm overly familiar with XAMPP. Haven't used it in about three years.

The one thing I will say about it is make sure you have changed the MySQL root password, as, if I remember correctly, XAMPP used to ship with no root password. (bad, bad, bad)

 

[BusinessDeli]

Rightly, slowly getting to grips with this software... as you say - quite hard to modify!

 

[antropy]

OC templates are actually pretty hard to customise, as is adding in extra pages.

I take it you've never tried to customise a Magento template?

Good to hear you got it installed locally, but you could have experimented with the demo to find out what features it has: http://www.opencart.com/index.php?route=demonstration/demonstration

Although admittedly you wouldn't have been able to play with the code.

 

[fairestcape]

Rather than installing locally, you should register a domain (perhaps the one you intend using for your business) then use it for a couple of months to try out different eComm platforms. All have pro's and con's, and your choice will ultimately depend on what you intend to sell.

While you are testing, you can load the various platforms into different sub-directories, which you password-protect behind a htpasswd/htaccess file. (Easy to do in a CPANEL).

BUT BEWARE... Most eCommerce platforms are very sophisticated these days, and MANY of the "cheap and popular" webhosts cannot guarantee proper hosting environments for them. It is very important to chose a proper, reliable and eCommerce-experienced webhost BEFORE you start. Keep well away from fasthosts, 1&1, GoDaddy and all the other "cheap 'n nasty" hosts. They are NOT SUITABLE for eCommerce!!! They apply general settings to the servers - many of which are unsuitable for eCommerce - and they will not allow you to over-ride these settings.

Now... if you want to install and manage your own site, you have to have a fair knowledge of how your webhosting is managed, and must be familiar with setting up databases and using FTP programs. You will also need to know some basic HTML, CSS and possibly some javascript. MOST opensource platforms operate on PHP and MySQL, so it will help if you at least understand the principles of Content Managed Systems, that generate pages "dynamically".

Good Opensource eComm platforms are:

Magento (nice but very complex and challenging to configure and customise)
Zencart (possible one of the best in terms of flexibility and forum support)
Opencart (reasonably good, with a nice admin interface, but poor on support and not many plugins)
OsCommerce (One of the "original" opensource platforms, now forked into several other options such as CRE... OsCommerce is a bit old fashioned and clunky compared to the newer derivatives).
Prestashop (reasonable... but poor community support).
x-cart (I don't like it at all)
cubecart (popular.... but not as good as zencart)

But whatever program you decide to use, PROPER RELIABLE ECOMMERCE HOSTING is essential. If you don't get a proper host, you will spend much of your life in tears...

 

[BusinessDeli]

@Paul - I definitely wanted to be able to see the code, hence the XAMPP. Demo's are fine and dandy but don't tell you the guts of it.

@Fairestcape, appreciate the advice of working 'live' so to speak but really just want to get a handle on the opencart bit. I'm looking at using ipage.com for the hosting (not a done deal yet, just top of the list) if you have any opinion of them?
I'm finding the support for opencart awful and any extension worth having appears to be for a fee. I expected things like having a blog page to be standard stuff but it really does just focus on ecommerce and not the entire consumer experience. I've found a template to muck about with and have found customising is not horrendous but in no way the level of ease that wordpress is!

 

[fairestcape]

@Paul - I definitely wanted to be able to see the code, hence the XAMPP. Demo's are fine and dandy but don't tell you the guts of it.

@Fairestcape, appreciate the advice of working 'live' so to speak but really just want to get a handle on the opencart bit. I'm looking at using ipage.com for the hosting (not a done deal yet, just top of the list) if you have any opinion of them?

No... they are not good for proper eCommerce...

The best host in the UK for eCommerce is terranetwork.net

I'm finding the support for opencart awful and any extension worth having appears to be for a fee. I expected things like having a blog page to be standard stuff but it really does just focus on ecommerce and not the entire consumer experience. I've found a template to muck about with and have found customising is not horrendous but in no way the level of ease that wordpress is!

While there are some plugins for wordpress that handle "eCommerce", bear in mind that wordpress is not really an eCommerce platform. The good plugins, like Woocommerce, are still just "plugins"... Wordpress is excellent for blogs and suchlike, and in the hands of a good developer can be an excellent general CMS.

We usually advocate a dedicated eComm system if you intend to sell online seriously. You will need the extensibility and flexibility that is just not available in the wordpress plugins.

 

[Ali-v-8]

No... they are not good for proper eCommerce...

I notced that you are promoting Zencart as opposed to Opencart and one reason you have said is

Zencart (possible one of the best in terms of flexibility and forum support)
Opencart (reasonably good, with a nice admin interface, but poor on support and not many plugins)

I have to totally disagree with you here - As an SEO specialist and with yeras of experience in all major Ecommerce platforms I believe that Opencart is fantastic.
You also dismissed Magento, which surprises me when your recommendation is one of the most outdated CMS's around.

@OP - wordpress ecommerce solution isn't that clever at the moment - My advice is go with Opencart. It takes some time to get to know it but is is easy once you do.

 

[allsquare]

The best host in the UK for eCommerce is terranetwork.net

And what is that based on? Fact? :|

 

[BusinessDeli]

Am definitely persevering with OC simply because of the advice given on the forum - WP is a CMS, not an ecommerce. My desire is for a combo! I will carry on seeing where I can reasonably develop my test site to a level I think is good enough and provides the functionality I want. If I can't then I have to make a decision... Totally appreciate that WP only offer ecommerce as a plugin, not a root ability.

Thanks for the opinion on hosting, I'll re-visit that when the time comes.

I'm [at this point] only interested in OC as I can't muck about getting to grips with all of them! I'm pretty happy with the functionality, features and usability of OC and will confuse my tiny brain if I go down too many roads.
I've also tinkered with the idea of having both WP and OC on the same domain but heard customers have to register with both platforms which is a deal breaker.

 

[BusinessDeli]

Having had that thought dinging in my head for a bit I'm thinking - do I actually need customers registering on a WP side...?

This post was mainly for my own thought process!

 

[fairestcape]

And what is that based on? Fact? :|

No... experience...

Having been in the internet industry for nearly 20 years, and having built nearly 300 websites (for clients all over the world), we have had the opportunity to put sites onto scores of hosting platforms.

In the UK, we have found terranetwork.net to be one of the most reliable and service-oriented hosts.

Terranetwork is staffed by people experienced in most OpenSource eComm platforms. They use some of the fastest and most sophisticated servers in the country. They use an off-site backup service, where all hosted sites (including WHM re-seller setups) are backed up automatically every 6 hours. (This is offered FREE as part of the hosting package).

Many good features offered in their CPANELS.

Of course there are a lot of good hosts - but in our experience, if you are looking at eCommerce, terranetwork is one of the best.

 

[BusinessDeli]

Have managed to get the test site looking pretty decent and have found a free extension that in theory allows for additional pages in the main navigation menu as opposed to the information footer.
Still not happy about it but as there are extensions to provide the functionality available for a fee, I can live with that.
Phew! So I have a platform, next choice is host and I already have a few to read up on thanks to the above

 

[antropy]

My desire is for a combo!

A good way to do this is to install WordPress in a subfolder called /blog or similar and then create a theme for it that matches the OpenCart menu etc. That way although it's 2 separate platforms, from a user's perspective it's one website.

 

[BusinessDeli]

Hi Paul, yes did consider that (see last sentence of post 12). It has its merits but finding the exact matching theme is nigh on impossible so the 'experience' from a consumers point of view would be a tad unbalanced if you see what I mean?
(That said, I am still thinking about it lol)

 

[antropy]

Ah yes I see. Don't worry about the registrations just for a blog (for a forum it's a different matter). Yes you won't be able to find themes to do it, you'll need to build the theme yourself. We did it with a forum here and you can't really tell they're different sites:

http://www.rcgeeks.co.uk
http://forum.rcgeeks.co.uk

It may have been better to put the forum in a folder rather than a subdomain though for SEO purposes.

 

[BusinessDeli]

you won't be able to find themes to do it, you'll need to build the theme yourself.

If I find myself with either the time or the spare cash (for someone else to do it) then I'll definitely take a look at doing that.

 

[antropy]

Yep. There are free blog modules for OpenCart.

They're about as good at blogging as WordPress is at ecommerce - that is to say they're okay but they're never going to compete with a system designed from the ground up for the purpose with its own plugins.