Shipping system

[Kerrib4]

Hi,

I am currently having a new website built by an American developer, and I am trying to think of the best way for them to set up my shipping system. The shipping services I will be using are UKMail (courier) and Royal Mail (post office). With UKMail having all different prices for different area's of the UK and Europe I was wondering what sort of system other ecommerce sites use. Also what are the advantages of courier intergetion? What is the best way to do this in order to make this system easier for the developer to set up, and easier for me and my customers?

Any advice would be appreciated, thanks!

 

[Toni Anicic]

Which eCommerce system are you using?

Usually, shipping providers have APIs that your developers can hook to and calculate shipping estimates.

If you're using Magento, there are extensions for both Royal Mail and UKMail integration.

 

[Kerrib4]

My website has been built form scratch by an American developer, but they are still working on it just now. The whole thing (website and admin panel) is being hosted by Vidahost hosting. I'm trying to find out as much information for them as possible as they don't seem to have too much experience with working with a UK ecommerce website.

 

[Toni Anicic]

Is there any specific reason you decided to build the whole thing from scratch?

 

[Kerrib4]

Is there any specific reason you decided to build the whole thing from scratch?

We decided to do it from scratch as we used to use a shopping cart called 3dcart, and we had a very bad experience with them. Basically we when used 3dcart, every developer we hired said they were unable to access the certain code of the website.

 

[Toni Anicic]

Thats because 3dcart is not open source. I'm not sure what your business is and if there is a justifiable reason to build this thing from scratch, because modern open source solutions are most likely superior to anything built from scratch without Enterprise budget.

 

[Kerrib4]

Thats because 3dcart is not open source. I'm not sure what your business is and if there is a justifiable reason to build this thing from scratch, because modern open source solutions are most likely superior to anything built from scratch without Enterprise budget.

Ah okay, what do you suggest doing? As my developers are probably more than half way through it by now. Thanks for your help.

 

[Toni Anicic]

Have a look at features that come with Magento (which is both open source and free) - http://www.magentocommerce.com/product/features

 

[Kerrib4]

Have a look at features that come with Magento (which is both open source and free) - http://www.magentocommerce.com/product/features

Okay thanks, so what would it take for my developers to integrate their code into it? Is it likely to make things easier for them also? Thanks.

 

[Toni Anicic]

Okay thanks, so what would it take for my developers to integrate their code into it? Is it likely to make things easier for them also? Thanks.

This is a piece of software they install on server. Once you configure it, it's a fully functional online store with all the features listed on the link above.

You can then have your own design implemented into it and if you need some features that don't exist, you can see if there are extensions that already grant you that functionality, or have your developers custom code it since Magento is open source and all of it's code is viewable and editable by your developers.

Many well known world brands are using this solution, have a look http://www.magentocommerce.com/showcase

 

[Kerrib4]

This is a piece of software they install on server. Once you configure it, it's a fully functional online store with all the features listed on the link above.

You can then have your own design implemented into it and if you need some features that don't exist, you can see if there are extensions that already grant you that functionality, or have your developers custom code it since Magento is open source and all of it's code is viewable and editable by your developers.

Many well known world brands are using this solution, have a look http://www.magentocommerce.com/showcase

Thanks for the info, it does sound good. Is there anything the free solution does not offer which most ecommerce websites use?

Could you also let me know how I would check what ecommerce solution other stores are using? I would like to check what my competitors are using.

I guess Magento free service allows for integration of UKMail & Royal Mail shipping system?

 

[Toni Anicic]

Magento Community edition (completely free and open source) has all the features necessary to run a fully functional online store and even more. The difference between Community and Enterprise is merely in a few modules, and the fact you don't get any free support from Magento's side.

UKMail & Royal Mail modules for Magento exist, you can easily find them through Google: http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&...=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=e7386a9c3eba4fdd

and

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp...=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=e7386a9c3eba4fdd

UKMail module costs £130 +VAT and you get phone support included. The Royal Mail one is free.

 

[Kerrib4]

Magento Community edition (completely free and open source) has all the features necessary to run a fully functional online store and even more. The difference between Community and Enterprise is merely in a few modules, and the fact you don't get any free support from Magento's side.

UKMail & Royal Mail modules for Magento exist, you can easily find them through Google: http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&...=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=e7386a9c3eba4fdd

and

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp=gsishc&xhr=t&q=Royal%20Mail%20magento&cp=8&qe=Um95YWwgTWEgbWFnZW50bw&qesig=7upvghUPt2XP99DNTbBQ7Q&pkc=AFgZ2tkwInZoREeqKsBW1HDaqkKAPzwGntNcSLeWrboRh_grL2SHXYpSZTiBW7MO6Srm1t7T_HxIgtjAl7u5jVjQT03Jb5In_w&pq=ukmail%20magento&pf=p&sclient=psy&source=hp&aq=0l&aqi=&aql=f&oq=Royal+Ma+magento&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=e7386a9c3eba4fdd

UKMail module costs £130 +VAT and you get phone support included. The Royal Mail one is free.

So for the UKMail module, I guess once I pay for this my developer will need to code it in - how much work would this require from my developer?

How do I find out what ecommerce solution my competitors are using?

I see Magento is a US based company, is it fully functional with the UK?

 

[Toni Anicic]

So for the UKMail module, I guess once I pay for this my developer will need to code it in - how much work would this require from my developer?

How do I find out what ecommerce solution my competitors are using?

I see Magento is a US based company, is it fully functional with the UK?

They don't need to "code it in", they just install it. It's like a few minutes of work.

As far as competitors, I could give you a pretty long answer but it would be full of technical stuff you probably wouldn't be able to follow, so just use this for now http://builtwith.com/ or ask your developers.

 

[Toni Anicic]

I see Magento is a US based company, is it fully functional with the UK?

I see stores built on Magento operating worldwide and there are many stores built with Magento in UK as well.

 

[Kerrib4]

Are there limitations on the free version? Such as a limit of 500 products, and bandwidth limits etc? Thanks for your help.

 

[Toni Anicic]

Are there limitations on the free version? Such as a limit of 500 products, and bandwidth limits etc? Thanks for your help.

It's open source, you can do whatever you want with it, so no limitations. You can host it wherever you want so bandwidth and similar stuff depends on the hosting you choose.

 

[Kerrib4]

Okay it sounds really good. Although, I have just spoken with my developer, and he thinks it will require him starting over again with the work he has already done. He is going to look into this though. I would appreciate if you could let me know what you think? Do you feel it will require starting over again with his code?

My thoughts are that it will be easier for him to integrate modules such as the shipping system, if he used Magento. There are a few other things that I feel would save him time if he used Magento.

 

[Toni Anicic]

Magento was coded by 200+ developers powered by 20 million + dollars of venture capital during the period of 3 + years.

You will not need any of your developer's code if these features that come with Magento are all that you need (which they most likely are), so it's not starting over, it's using a complete solution.

 

[Kerrib4]

Magento was coded by 200+ developers powered by 20 million + dollars of venture capital during the period of 3 + years.

You will not need any of your developer's code if these features that come with Magento are all that you need (which they most likely are), so it's not starting over, it's using a complete solution.

Thanks for the info. I really like the design my developer has used though, how easy would it be to get my design onto Magento. Would I need to have certain parts of my design rearranged?

Also, one thing I can't understand is: why would anyone use Magento's paid solutions if you can get everything in the free solution? There must be something good that the free on doesn't offer?

 

[Toni Anicic]

Thanks for the info. I really like the design my developer has used though, how easy would it be to get my design onto Magento. Would I need to have certain parts of my design rearranged?

Also, one thing I can't understand is: why would anyone use Magento's paid solutions if you can get everything in the free solution? There must be something good that the free on doesn't offer?

Enterprise licence costs ~$13 000 per year. It's not something a small business can easily afford. Once you're an Enterprise business, the cost/benefit equation shifts towards Enterprise edition drastically since things like Warranty and Support become much more important to you than saving $13 000 per year.

As far as design, you can integrate any design into Magento, some elements should be changed since there are lots of features in Magento that your old design probably didn't predict. It will not be the easiest task for your developer, since Magento is cutting edge technology and even the most experienced php developers have a long learning curve with it.

Also, don't build an online store with design "you like". That's not the way you do a serious business. It's not important what you like, the important thing is what your customers like and what's usable for them. You wouldn't believe how bad design decisions can significantly influence the amount of money you make with your store.

No disrespect meant, but, I have a strange feeling you're not very tech-savvy and also not very experienced in eCommerce business. I think you should get a consultant.

 

[Kerrib4]

Enterprise licence costs ~$13 000 per year. It's not something a small business can easily afford. Once you're an Enterprise business, the cost/benefit equation shifts towards Enterprise edition drastically since things like Warranty and Support become much more important to you than saving $13 000 per year.

As far as design, you can integrate any design into Magento, some elements should be changed since there are lots of features in Magento that your old design probably didn't predict. It will not be the easiest task for your developer, since Magento is cutting edge technology and even the most experienced php developers have a long learning curve with it.

Also, don't build an online store with design "you like". That's not the way you do a serious business. It's not important what you like, the important thing is what your customers like and what's usable for them. You wouldn't believe how bad design decisions can significantly influence the amount of money you make with your store.

No disrespect meant, but, I have a strange feeling you're not very tech-savvy and also not very experienced in eCommerce business. I think you should get a consultant.

Our design is very user friendly, and is well layed out. We have looked at competitors websites too, and have taken some ideas from their websites and made them even better.

I don't understand why anyone would NEED a consultant in order to make a business work? A consultant would just cost even more money on top of everything else.

 

[Toni Anicic]

Our design is very user friendly, and is well layed out. We have looked at competitors websites too, and have taken some ideas from their websites and made them even better.

I don't understand why anyone would NEED a consultant in order to make a business work? A consultant would just cost even more money on top of everything else.

Really, how much money did you spend so far paying a developer to develop something that already exists for free? How much money would a minute of consultant's time save you just in this one incident?

Back to design... There is a process called Conversion Rate Optimization. It's a process of using numbers and science instead of faith when determining what design solution makes you more money. Serious online businesses don't create a design and place it there and say they improved it beyond what they competitors made. You can't know how your solution performs compared to other solutions since you didn't do a split test.

Just to give you an example of what I'm talking about: I've seen with my own eyes a 100% increase in online store's revenue with changing a color of one button. Now imagine how bad you can make it completely, if color of a button can influence it this much.

Serious online business is much more complicated than most people think.

 

[Kerrib4]

Really, how much money did you spend so far paying a developer to develop something that already exists for free? How much money would a minute of consultant's time save you just in this one incident?

Back to design... There is a process called Conversion Rate Optimization. It's a process of using numbers and science instead of faith when determining what design solution makes you more money. Serious online businesses don't create a design and place it there and say they improved it beyond what they competitors made. You can't know how your solution performs compared to other solutions since you didn't do a split test.

Just to give you an example of what I'm talking about: I've seen with my own eyes a 100% increase in online store's revenue with changing a color of one button. Now imagine how bad you can make it completely, if color of a button can influence it this much.

Serious online business is much more complicated than most people think.

Most people I know who own ecommerce sites do not hire a consultant. Also, when I used 3dcarts system, I took advice from a consultant which did more harm than good.

Magento is not completely free, as you still need to pay for a website design and pay to get it coded onto the website. There are also extra modules such as the shipping one that you explained to me earlier on.

You are saying that for a good design which converts, you need to do conversion rate optimisation. Would this not require paying someone to do this research?

 

[Toni Anicic]

Most people I know who own ecommerce sites do not hire a consultant. Also, when I used 3dcarts system, I took advice from a consultant which did more harm than good.

Magento is not completely free, as you still need to pay for a website design and pay to get it coded onto the website. There are also extra modules such as the shipping one that you explained to me earlier on.

You are saying that for a good design which converts, you need to do conversion rate optimisation. Would this not require paying someone to do this research?

You can run an online store without a consultant, if you have the knowledge and skill required but even the biggest online stores in the world hire a lot of consultants. You have to figure out the difference between a snake oil salesmen and a consultant that has actually done what you're trying to do numerous times before.

No, Magento IS completely free. You don't have to pay anything for the code they give you. Saying that something isn't free because you don't know how to use it or because you'd like something beside that free thing that is not free is a logical fallacy.

Yes, for good design you need to do conversion rate optimization. Yes it costs money to have someone do it. Biggest online businesses never stop testing variations and improving their conversion rates. It's an ongoing process. Some of them run hundreds of test simultaneously at any given moment (think Google, Amazon, eBay...)

 

[Kerrib4]

You can run an online store without a consultant, if you have the knowledge and skill required but even the biggest online stores in the world hire a lot of consultants. You have to figure out the difference between a snake oil salesmen and a consultant that has actually done what you're trying to do numerous times before.

No, Magento IS completely free. You don't have to pay anything for the code they give you. Saying that something isn't free because you don't know how to use it or because you'd like something beside that free thing that is not free is a logical fallacy.

Yes, for good design you need to do conversion rate optimization. Yes it costs money to have someone do it. Biggest online businesses never stop testing variations and improving their conversion rates. It's an ongoing process. Some of them run hundreds of test simultaneously at any given moment (think Google, Amazon, eBay...)

Okay well I know that everything you are saying is correct, and fyi we are planning to do split testing once the website is ready - I know about the colour of buttons etc. Of course website design and development costs money, and that would be part of the process with using Magento.

I do think you are being unfair here, as you seem to be trying to tell me that this website will be no good. All of this is somewhat demotivating for me. I am currently trying to learn things myself, and I enjoy learning all about ecommerce. I have unfortunately been given bad advice from many people in the past, and I am trying to figure things out for myself now.

 

[Toni Anicic]

Thats awesome, if you have time to learn things yourself and are ready to accept the risk of taking wrong directions and learning on your own mistakes.

I'm not saying it will be no good. I'm just saying it's highly likely that it will be very far from perfect and I'm trying to open your eyes to how serious and complex this thing really is and that you shouldn't underestimate it.

 

[Kerrib4]

Thats awesome, if you have time to learn things yourself and are ready to accept the risk of taking wrong directions and learning on your own mistakes.

I'm not saying it will be no good. I'm just saying it's highly likely that it will be very far from perfect and I'm trying to open your eyes to how serious and complex this thing really is and that you shouldn't underestimate it.

I'm happy to learn things on my own as I feel that is the best way for me, even though it may take a bit longer. I would like to see how things go for the first few months of business before I pay anyone to help me out.

Back to the original question though, is it possible for my developer to add this API for my courier into his code? If not, he will just need to set up his own system.

Thanks again for the advice.

 

[kulture]

Ok, back to the original question. If your developer can developer a cart then he can certainly add an api. Of course the question I would ask is why did your developer not advise you to look at open source carts? Does your developer have YOUR best interests in mind or is he just interested in making money from you.

 

[Raijin44]

For shipping purpose also you can use 3Dcart too.t is the best I think

 

[P4D | Parcels4Delivery]

Hi,

We build our own systems in-house and have our own API, or we can link up with any MySQL database, shopping cart, etc.

We've an FAQ here http://www.p4d.co.uk/faq/what-is-an-api, but feel free to drop me a line if you'd like to know more from our Chief Geek!

Thanks,

Nat