Self Employed Income Support Scheme - REJECTED

Discussion in 'General Business Forum' started by Vending Siting Services, May 13, 2020.

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  1. Vending Siting Services

    Vending Siting Services Contributor

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    I have just been informed, as a self employed individual, I do not qualify for the self employed income support scheme. My accountant and I are totally baffled after having my claim rejected this morning. I have run my current business for 8 years, I have paid PAYE every month and I have one member of staff who has been furloughed.

    The term 'trading profits' does not account for the wages that I pay myself each month which is money I live on. My business makes a small annual profit which is in the £100's.

    This scheme does not seem fair at all - my member of staff is being paid via the furlough scheme which is wonderful and I am being penalised as I don't have so called 'trading profits'. I know I am not alone here as my accountant has received many rejected claims from a lot of their self employed clients.

    I thought this scheme was to equal that being offered to furloughed members of staff? Of the self employed people that I come into contact with or know, they are all exactly the same as me, ie what they are able to earn is reliant on business being conducted and that's it.

    It looks like the Government have TRULY TRULY allowed the self employed to fall through and their scheme certainly is not the same as that offered to staff.

    Barbara Fellowes
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Vending Siting Services Member since: Jan 26, 2007
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  2. Hunnie

    Hunnie Contributor

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    I don't think the scheme is for those with PAYE
    Can you furlough yourself?
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Hunnie Member since: Oct 19, 2011
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  3. Newchodge

    Newchodge Contributor

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    If you are self employed you do not dedcut your 'wages' from your profits. Your accountant should know that.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Newchodge Member since: Nov 8, 2012
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  4. Vending Siting Services

    Vending Siting Services Contributor

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    Hello Hunnie, many thanks for your reply.

    My initial understanding is that a self employed individual were not able to Furlough themselves? I have spoken to my accountant and that is what we are going to try and see what happens. The information about self employed individuals was to wait and no other instructions from what I can gather were advised otherwise.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Vending Siting Services Member since: Jan 26, 2007
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  5. bovine

    bovine Contributor

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    I think the employee was paye. How are you paying yourself? I would expect what you pay yourself to be part of trading profits for self employed. Unless it’s a director of a small limited co. which is or isn’t classed as self employed depending on which gov department you deal with.

    The self employed package is actually better (in my opinion) than the furlough scheme. The support for paye/dividend directors is the worst.

    edited to add: better for the person who can still work, but has had some loss of business as they can actually get more than they usually get.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: bovine Member since: Aug 23, 2007
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  6. Newchodge

    Newchodge Contributor

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    If you are self employed (that is, not working through a limited company) you do not receive wages. All the profit that the business earns is yours and the fact you take some money for living expenses is completely irrelevant. The self employed business profit is turnover less allowable expenses.

    You can only get furlough pay from the government if you have been paid through PAYE. You cannot, when self employed, pay yourself through PAYE.

    I would check your accountant's qualifications.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Newchodge Member since: Nov 8, 2012
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  7. Vending Siting Services

    Vending Siting Services Contributor

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    I pay myself monthly and pay the relevant tax and NI each month. Since Covid my business is zero.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Vending Siting Services Member since: Jan 26, 2007
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  8. Newchodge

    Newchodge Contributor

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    Then you must be a limited company?
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Newchodge Member since: Nov 8, 2012
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  9. Mark T Jones

    Mark T Jones Contributor

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    All of which would suggest that you are an employee, not self employed.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Mark T Jones Member since: Nov 4, 2015
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  10. Vending Siting Services

    Vending Siting Services Contributor

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    Yes that was my understanding too. Now I am completely confused! I pay (paid) my taxes monthly for myself and that of my employee and my accountant issues me with pay slips. When I ran a much larger business which was Ltd and VAT registered, we done our payroll along with all members of staff and deductions were paid monthly to HMRC as I do now - or did until the pandemic hit.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Vending Siting Services Member since: Jan 26, 2007
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  11. Vending Siting Services

    Vending Siting Services Contributor

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    Hello Newchode, no, I am self employed and it's just me and one other member of staff operating way below the VAT threshold.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Vending Siting Services Member since: Jan 26, 2007
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  12. Newchodge

    Newchodge Contributor

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    It does not help at the moment, but, if you are NOT working through a limited company, you need a new accountant.

    Edit: NOT added
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Newchodge Member since: Nov 8, 2012
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  13. Vending Siting Services

    Vending Siting Services Contributor

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    If that is the case then I should qualify for furlough? I don't see how though as I have a Self Assessment Form which is submitted annually.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Vending Siting Services Member since: Jan 26, 2007
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  14. Vending Siting Services

    Vending Siting Services Contributor

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    Why do I need a new accountant? I choose to pay my taxes monthly and be self employed. I don't actually understand why I need to be a Ltd Company? There are many self employed individuals out there who pay their taxes monthly.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Vending Siting Services Member since: Jan 26, 2007
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  15. Maxwell83

    Maxwell83 Contributor

    755 209
    I take this to mean you are paid via PAYE? Or do you mean that you simply pay an estimated sum for tax & NI into your HMRC account each month, to chip away at your annual bill?
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Maxwell83 Member since: Aug 4, 2012
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  16. Vending Siting Services

    Vending Siting Services Contributor

    2,152 553
    Hello Maxwell

    I pay HMRC an exact amount as calculated on what I am able to pay myself each month and it is paid monthly. I have just looked at my HMRC payment method and the document is called Employer Payment Record and the Employer name is Vending Siting Services which is my business name. Maybe I should have been furloughed in the beginning? My accountant is going to be submitting a furlough claim next week so I am hoping this will resolve the issue. So confusing ....
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Vending Siting Services Member since: Jan 26, 2007
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  17. ecommerce84

    ecommerce84 Contributor

    987 345
    Are your initials BEF?

    If so you are not currently a director of a limited company.

    I think the confusion is arising because a few things you mention don’t correlate with being self employed. Pay slips for instance being one, and paying tax and NI monthly to HMRC.

    I’ve heard of people putting tax and NI aside in a bank account for payment when needed but not to HMRC. I’ve never heard of a self employed person receiving pay slips.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: ecommerce84 Member since: Feb 24, 2007
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  18. Anna Chandley

    Anna Chandley Contributor

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    Are you saying that you operate Vending Site Services as a sole trader but your accountant has processed wages through the payroll for you as though you were an employee?

    On your self assessment tax return have you entered the "wages" in the employment pages of the return and the profit remaining after these wages in the self employment pages?
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Anna Chandley Member since: Jun 2, 2008
    #18
  19. Vending Siting Services

    Vending Siting Services Contributor

    2,152 553
    Hello ecommerce, yes, that's me BEF and thank you for your reply

    I have just written to my accountant as I feel something is not right here. I have to profess to not knowing the ins and outs of accountancy and have run my current business in the same way since I started. I truly don't understand what is right or wrong as I never had reason to question until now. When I started this business my accountant asked if I wanted to pay monthly or pay at the end of the year to which I replied monthly to save me having to fork out for a big bill at the end of the year. When my accounts are done it is then that I find out how much additional tax I have to pay or if indeed there is a refund owing. Confused.com I am.
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Vending Siting Services Member since: Jan 26, 2007
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  20. Vending Siting Services

    Vending Siting Services Contributor

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    Hello Anna

    I don't know. My accountant filled it in for me, I must have checked it before submission but would not have known if the figures were put in the right place. Is this something I should ask her?
     
    Posted: May 13, 2020 By: Vending Siting Services Member since: Jan 26, 2007
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