Scotland - Ruling for a Referendum Declined

[DEBS Ltd]

Allow me to explain....
Scotlands grid relies on the spinning reserves in large generators, same as any grid.
You see, renewables, such as solar and wind are generated through semiconductors, so they have no reactive power. In short, they cant be used for starting heavy loads, like pumps and motors (the very things your life relies on every day).

Its a sad sign of todays world.....poloticians and news sells by the best soundbites.
So, when SNP stand up and state Scotland generates more electricity than they use......well not strictly true!
Yes, in terms of energy they do.....but its power that is important.
The truth is, Scotland does generate energy....but poor quality, thats not much use for powering a grid. Handy for topping up......but thats about it.

Fun fact.....Solar and wind can make ONLY 20% of a grid (any grid) maximum before the grid becomes unstable.

You come on raging fresh from the game by any chance?

 

[Scubadog]

Oh dear! Dunning Kruger syndrome strikes again!

As I have written several economics papers on UK and Scottish electricity supplies and their markets, you can take it as a given that Scotland was, is and always has been a net exporter of electricity. Of course, it is also a net exporter of oil and gas, and mankind will require oil and gas for industrial purposes for a few hundred years to come for such things as plastics, fertilizers and other chemicals.

The main export markets for Scottish electricity are England and Ireland and will continue to be so, with or without independence. The big story here is renewables and wind in particular. Overall, renewables have multiplied threefold in the past 12 years and today account for 99% of all electricity generation in Scotland.

When I wrote my first paper on the subject, it was just 25% and neither I nor the various politicians on all sides expected renewables of all sorts to become as successful as they have been.


I think you are confusing spinning reserves with whatever you think spinning generators means. All electromechanical generators used for power supplies spin. Scotland has considerable hydroelectric pump storage to cover the few periods of low wind and low rainfall and also has gas and for the time being, nuclear - until such time as more pump storage and other standby sources come online.

I have never met a Scottish lefty, junkie alcoholic*, so I cannot judge your hysterical insult for its accuracy.

I did meet an extreme right-wing junkie alcoholic once, but he was one of those vapid English, Oxford - PPE graduate business types and I am sure that you would agree that a whole nation should not be judged by just that one specimen! (Though he did fit the popular view of what a joke Englishman should look like - right down to the pot belly and the bad teeth!)

*If I did see one coming, I would probably give him a wide berth!

HA HA HA HA HA HA

See....this IS THE EXACT problem. people like you, writing "papers" on subject you no absolutely nothing about! ZERO! Nilch, NADA, not a thing!

Shall we unpick it?
1) Spinning reserve is an angering term....it applies to the inertia of large generator and provides reactive power. Without this, you can only power resistive loads (so your pumped hydro wont work).

2) Yes...all generators spin...but that's not wind or solar (which moat of scotlands power is from)! DoH!

3) Pumped storage is used only for demand side frequency response. Its a great thing....for short sharp and quick responses. Base load demands.not a chance! and not forgetting it relises on Englands Reactive power to run those large pumps!

4) Maybe you need to check out the state and commission on scotlands nuclear sites.....Surely you did this in your papers.....or maybe you didn't? How many are in service? How many are in decommission? How many are used by the military and do not feed domestic grids? Take a guess,.....or do some research?

5) We may joke about Junky scots, or Brits with bad teeth. But one thing is for sure, thank god neither are fat obese gun obsessed, god loving Americans. The scourge of any society (though most are too dumb to even know there is life beyond their shores)

 

[Scubadog]

I presume you're referring to the Western HVDC link

The one that tripped on Friday 18th June 2021, and took more than a month to fix?

https://www.nationalgrideso.com/document/198776/download

Strange I don't remember all the lights going out for a whole month. Does anyone else in Scotland remember?

As Scotland has no cables or pipes connecting us to Russia, can you explain how our grid relies on them?


Maybe that's because we produce more power than we need and have a ready customer in England for all the power we want to export.

Since we're playing what if. What if Scotland cut off the gas supply to England? 25% of all the UK's gas comes through St Fergus.

We'd love to be your new energy partner. - Niccolo Gas and Power

We source electricity and gas for mid sized energy users.

niccolo.co.uk

That's a big drop and England has very little gas storage.

England wont need to import any gas in 20 years time.....Gas will be obsolete in my lifetime. Its already legislated.

And wjhilst you are learning about your national infrastructure.....why not go and look at what Scotland had to do to divert issues during that trip period? What did they have to do with heir wind farms? Here's a clue.....the answer isnt turn them on! Now, take a second guess....where did Scotland get its power from during that period? Heres a clue.....its not russi, or the wind, or Scottish nuclear......any ideas?

 

[Scubadog]

LOL, perhaps they used the AC links?

Yep....that's exactly what they dropped back and relied on to import their reactive power. DC doesn't have any reactive power.

 

[Scubadog]

You come on raging fresh from the game by any chance?

Not for me......Nice try, but unlucky guess.

Out of interest....here is a funny puzzle for you.
Supporters of Scottish Independence often cite "gas and oil exports".....which must be difficult for SNP supports to say.Especially since they are propped up by the Green party whose entire party wants to ban oil.

Such a conundrum, but strangely never spoken.
A bit like the borders issue, the currency issue, the fact the royal navy would have to depart from Scotland and take with it all its infrastructure.

But no...nice soundbites......thats all you listen too and all you share.

 

[Scubadog]

That's dozens of small countries, including several in Europe like Luxembourg, Andora and Lichtenstein, screwed then! And as stated before, usually considerably more affluent than their larger counterparts.

He asked for independent countries....not ones who have signed most of their sovereign rights to an unelected bureaucratic commission.

got any good examples of any not inside the EU?

Or is your premise that Scotland and Wales can only proposer inside the EU? Hardly independent is it.....

 

[DontAsk]

Allow me to explain....
Scotlands grid relies on the spinning reserves in large generators, same as any grid.

THe spinning reserves you said they had now of, earlier? How do they rely on nothing?

You see, renewables, such as solar and wind are generated through semiconductors, so they have no reactive power. In short, they cant be used for starting heavy loads, like pumps and motors (the very things your life relies on every day).

Renewables are converted to AC before they feed the grid. Once upon a time you might use a motor-generator set. These days, power semiconductors have advanced to the point where they are used in inverters.

Yes, in terms of energy they do.....but its power that is important.

Not sure if you are trying to allude to power factor, or something else but do you really understand the relationship between power and energy. You sound like you are just using buzzwords.

 

[Scubadog]

THe spinning reserves you said they had now of, earlier? How do they rely on nothing?


Renewables are converted to AC before they feed the grid. Once upon a time you might use a motor-generator set. These days, power semiconductors have advanced to the point where they are used in inverters.


Not sure if you are trying to allude to power factor, or something else but do you really understand the relationship between power and energy. You sound like you are just using buzzwords.

They dont have large spinning reserves...they rely on the UK grid for that.

They use IGBTs to chop DC into AC waveform (a really poor quality waveform full of harmonics)....again, no reactive power what so ever....not a single bit! This is why they export via the DC link....shift their low quality DC voltage to an area than can manage it (as well as a few other benefits of DC transfer like improved efficiency and no need to synchronise frequency)

Nope...not talking power factor as that is caused by load not the source. But since we are here....the power factor caused by the load has to be matched by the source (called impendence matching) it is this very thing the Scottish grid and in particular renewables cannot match. Without it, you literally cannot start anything that has a negative power factor. You have just demonstrated a prime example of someone knowing a little bit of information but not a lot of it.....perhaps try and get your understanding right before calling someone out online?

Go on...elaborate, how do you think Scotland will manage with all the negative sequence harmonics produced by IGBTs converting DC to AC? Flickering lights and electronics not working anyone? Honestly....let the engineering be done by the engineers.

 

[NickGrogan]

All England needs to do is shut down the DC link for a few minutes and Scotland's entire grid will collapse.

why not go and look at what Scotland had to do to divert issues during that trip period?

So can we agree that Scotland's grid wont collapse if the DC connection is down?

 

[NickGrogan]

Reactive Power from Solar

Lightsource BP delivers night time reactive power using solar in ‘UK first’ - Solar Power Portal

A solar farm has provided National Grid ESO with reactive power overnight in what is being lauded as a UK first.

www.solarpowerportal.co.uk

 

[DontAsk]

Reactive Power from Solar

Lightsource BP delivers night time reactive power using solar in ‘UK first’ - Solar Power Portal

A solar farm has provided National Grid ESO with reactive power overnight in what is being lauded as a UK first.

www.solarpowerportal.co.uk

Nice link.

Confirms that supplying "reactive power" is nothing to do with reactive (non-unity power factor) loads.

I found it amusing that they say nothing about how a "solar farm" provides power in the dark

 

[Avilon]

Will Wales survive if they left the UK?

They dont have a "chance" to trade with another country nor have a chance to have a dialogue with someone from out of Wales.