Questions for Advertising salesmen

[Tregeor]

I read Drayton Bird's blog (quite a famous Marketing expert} and his latest blog is here
http://twurl.nl/6wzvt0

He is big on testing and making sure you get a ROI, he is extremely dismissive of simply advertising/marketing just to get your name out there. At the end of this blog he suggests asking the sales people who want you to buy ads. the following questions. I wondered if anyone had tried this and what was the ad. sellers response?

“Really? Show me the sales results.”

And, “Can I talk to a few of the people who are getting sales through you?”

And, “Please explain to me why and how that ad you’re suggesting will work?”

Or even: “How about I pay you on the results? The replies can go to you and I’ll pay you so much a lead.”

You’ll soon find out where you stand.

 

[marketingquotes]

An interesting angle.

We get asked all the time if marketing/advertising companies will work on results:

Telemarketing - instead of day rates what about a cost on the success of a sale
Advertising - instead of a cost per advert, how about a % of the value of any business

Not many marketing/advertising companies will consider this - if there are lots of customers that are willing to pay for their marketing.

Regards,

Marketing Quotes Support.

 

[Perfect Windows]

Or even: “How about I pay you on the results? The replies can go to you and I’ll pay you so much a lead.

Love it.

Here goes. I run a window cleaning business in Southampton. I'll pay anyone the value of a customer's first clean if they can get me the business. The way I'll pay is 50% after the first clean, 25% after the second (42 days) and 25% after the third (84 days). That's to stop people getting me one-off cleans. I'll give any help I can to any advertising sales people who call me on this basis.

Give me a call.

Vin Kennedy

 

[S-Marketing]

Love it.

Here goes. I run a window cleaning business in Southampton. I'll pay anyone the value of a customer's first clean if they can get me the business. The way I'll pay is 50% after the first clean, 25% after the second (42 days) and 25% after the third (84 days). That's to stop people getting me one-off cleans. I'll give any help I can to any advertising sales people who call me on this basis.

Give me a call.

Vin Kennedy

That' not going to work as its not worth our while doing it unless we get you a huge amount of clients. You wouldn't be able to clean enough windows to make it pay.

 

[Perfect Windows]

Seems odd that the advertising salesmen who call me never seem to complain that I'm too small to handle the work they can create.

OK, Stretchy, since it's (apparently) my business scale that's stopping you, I'll find you window cleaners across the country who will buy work off you on this basis.

I will commit to finding you someone (of sufficient quality) to cover every single postcode sector in the UK. I'm serious if you are.

Vin Kennedy

 

[Perfect Windows]

Seems odd that the advertising salesmen who call me never seem to complain that I'm too small to handle the work they can create.

OK, Stretchy, since it's (apparently) my business scale that's stopping you, I'll find you window cleaners across the country who will buy work off you on this basis.

I will commit to finding you someone (of sufficient quality) to cover every single postcode sector in the UK. I'm serious if you are.

Vin Kennedy

And I'm so confident that I can pass on work on this basis that I'll personally buy every customer you can generate in this campaign. That way, I take the risk of whether I can sell it on.

Vin

 

[S-Marketing]

Seems odd that the advertising salesmen who call me never seem to complain that I'm too small to handle the work they can create.

OK, Stretchy, since it's (apparently) my business scale that's stopping you, I'll find you window cleaners across the country who will buy work off you on this basis.

I will commit to finding you someone (of sufficient quality) to cover every single postcode sector in the UK. I'm serious if you are.

Vin Kennedy

That's because all the salesmen who are calling you are no good at finding work.

I'm very local to you (I have a house in Romsey) and have several clients in the Southampton area. If your average clean is a tenner, and I can get you about 50 new clients a day, how long will it be before you cant keep up? It would only be worth my time doing it at this rate. Any less than £500 a day and I've got better things to do. I hope that makes my point a bit clearer.

With respect, if I wanted to generate window cleaning leads and sell them, I'm not quite sure why I'd need your help. If I couldn't do that myself I'd be thinking i'm in the wrong business.

 

[Perfect Windows]

That's because all the salesmen who are calling you are no good at finding work.

I'm very local to you (I have a house in Romsey) and have several clients in the Southampton area. If your average clean is a tenner, and I can get you about 50 new clients a day, how long will it be before you cant keep up? It would only be worth my time doing it at this rate. Any less than £500 a day and I've got better things to do. I hope that makes my point a bit clearer.

With respect, if I wanted to generate window cleaning leads and sell them, I'm not quite sure why I'd need your help. If I couldn't do that myself I'd be thinking i'm in the wrong business.

If you can find me £500 worth of clients a day, I'll buy every single one of them off you. I'll sign a contract to that effect. You can thus discount from your calculations whether I can handle them or not (what I'm saying here is that I'll do my job if you do yours).

The problem is that this is all academic. You can make all the bold claims you want. You can also claim that the reason you won't do it is firstly because I can't handle them, then, when I say I can, you say you'd rather not as you don't need my help. I await your next explanation as to why it can't be done. Which, just to remind you, is where this thread started and is definitely where you're taking it.

The question is this: Will you run me a campaign on that basis or is it just empty talk? I think we both know the answer. If you want to run one, don't waffle on here, just call me. My number's easy to find.

Vin

 

[Robert Willford]

[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']I like the idea depending on their sector I think if I could manage a whole leaflet campaign from start to finish including design and print then I would be happy to be paid on result and I might even run this as an offer in the future.[/FONT]

 

[S-Marketing]

I agree, we can waffle on here all night.

I'm not quite sure you understand this is what I actually do for a living. I am a marketing and business development consultant and specialise in trade and service businesses. Its not that i'm sat here thinking it should be possible to generate those levels of work, its what I do every day. Although to be honest simply generating leads isn't generally how we work. There is an awful lot more to marketing than simple lead generation.

You will have to work harder than that to persuade me to work for you. I wont be falling for the 'prove it' tactics. You may need to remember that consultants who are good at what they do, actually have the benefit of selecting their clients, not the other way round.

I was merely making a point that your commission offer was not a very tempting proposition to those of us actually capable of getting you the work.

 

[Perfect Windows]

I agree, we can waffle on here all night.

I'm not quite sure you understand this is what I actually do for a living. I am a marketing and business development consultant and specialise in trade and service businesses. Its not that i'm sat here thinking it should be possible to generate those levels of work, its what I do every day. Although to be honest simply generating leads isn't generally how we work. There is an awful lot more to marketing than simple lead generation.

You will have to work harder than that to persuade me to work for you. I wont be falling for the 'prove it' tactics. You may need to remember that consultants who are good at what they do, actually have the benefit of selecting their clients, not the other way round.

I was merely making a point that your commission offer was not a very tempting proposition to those of us actually capable of getting you the work.

I understand what you do. I may only be a window cleaner but I can read. Both the lines and the bits between.

I think you'll find that your view "There is an awful lot more to marketing than simple lead generation" is why you're restricting yourself to clients you select, as you clearly need the ones who will swallow that kind of tosh. Down here in the harsh world of making money by selling either stuff or services, we just need marketing budget to generate more revenue than it costs. That boils down to new customers or more money from current customers. Very simple. This thread is largely about asking people like you to put your money where your mouth is.

In an amazing echo of your views, I won't be falling for any of the

• "You wouldn't be able to keep up with the amount of work I would generate" excuse
• "I'm not quite sure why I'd need your help" excuse or
• The all-new and improved "I'm too good for you lot" excuse.

If I dealt your latest excuse, you'd just line another one up and I'm not planning to play your game, as it's endless.

This thread started with "marketing and business development consultant"s like you not being prepared to work on a commission basis and my participation in this thread ends when yet another one says the same three times.

Vin

 

[S-Marketing]

I understand what you do. I may only be a window cleaner but I can read. Both the lines and the bits between.

I think you'll find that your view "There is an awful lot more to marketing than simple lead generation" is why you're restricting yourself to clients you select, as you clearly need the ones who will swallow that kind of tosh. Down here in the harsh world of making money by selling either stuff or services, we just need marketing budget to generate more revenue than it costs. That boils down to new customers or more money from current customers. Very simple. This thread is largely about asking people like you to put your money where your mouth is.

In an amazing echo of your views, I won't be falling for any of the

• "You wouldn't be able to keep up with the amount of work I would generate" excuse
• "I'm not quite sure why I'd need your help" excuse or
• The all-new and improved "I'm too good for you lot" excuse.

If I dealt your latest excuse, you'd just line another one up and I'm not planning to play your game, as it's endless.

This thread started with "marketing and business development consultant"s like you not being prepared to work on a commission basis and my participation in this thread ends when yet another one says the same three times.

Vin

You are taking this far too personally. My point was that, in my opinion, your idea was not a good one, that's all.

You are being ridiculous, I work with unskilled trades and skilled trades alike. I have no problem at all working with window cleaners, general cleaners, valeters or anyone else who wants to use my services. I dont , however, as a general rule work for clients found on an internet forum.

With enough clients to work year round with a daily fee of between £400 and £1000 its matters not if you rate my opinion

I will take on board what you have said and will look into the value of window cleaning leads. I recently asked a question on another thread along similar lines, asking cleaners what value they would put on having a full diary. As suspected the conclusion is that leads for cleaning are of little value as the scalability and profitability of the work is low. Ill do some research into the viability of what we have discussed and would be happy to keep you informed with the findings if you are interested.

 

[Herswell]

Love it.

Here goes. I run a window cleaning business in Southampton. I'll pay anyone the value of a customer's first clean if they can get me the business. The way I'll pay is 50% after the first clean, 25% after the second (42 days) and 25% after the third (84 days). That's to stop people getting me one-off cleans. I'll give any help I can to any advertising sales people who call me on this basis.

Give me a call.

Vin Kennedy

Hi Perfect Windows, Just seen your very interest thread about leafletting. Seems instead of dropping a leaflet somebody could make a very good living selling your service door-to-door!

 

[WirralPrinters]

I am a marketing and business development consultant and specialise in trade and service businesses.

Why do I not see a link to your services then? £40+VAT PA,

I bumped into this thread and then seen your replies and considered contacting you!

I am looking for a sales rep that CAN sell @ 30%.

Sales comm will depend on sales type, printing website adspace, wallplanner etc.

 

[S-Marketing]

Why do I not see a link to your services then? £40+VAT PA,

I bumped into this thread and then seen your replies and considered contacting you!

I am looking for a sales rep that CAN sell @ 30%.

Sales comm will depend on sales type, printing website adspace, wallplanner etc.

I don't have contact details on the forum as I am not actively selling my services here. People occasionally contact me via PM and I consider it, but have only ever said yes once. Although I would welcome contact from any window cleaners, as I feel an experiment coming on

Additionally, I'm not a sales rep.

 

[john resident]

Vin,

I like your no nonsense attitude!

The problem with many "marketing consultants" is that there is a lot of BS and its difficult to pin down what they will actually do for their money. (I say many because I have started to work with a good one)

Whilst I dont necessarily agree that I expect them to work entirely on results - (for many reasons) I do think that a marketing service should be accountable. And would not want to invest in a marketing company if they couldnt at least show me a ROI rather than vagaries of "strategic marketing" and other such waffle.