Is The Balance of Power Shifting?

[MOIC]

Are employees in certain industries now in the driving seat to dictate their working terms with potential new employers? In some sectors there seems to be an increased demand over supply, so can employees negotiate better terms, including a better salary.

As an employer, is your industry finding it increasingly harder to get qualified staff and therefore prepared to offer better incentives including a higher wage than the industry standard?

As an employee in an industry where demand is increasing supply, are you dictating better terms including working hours as well as salary?

 

[MBE2017]

I think the enforced lay offs with Covid, where many found they were better off not working has thrown a lot of people off course, and many are now realising that work is not everything.

Of course, now the various benefits are being stopped, and the inflation rate sky rocketing many will be forced back into jobs they would rather not do. Enjoying your job is a relatively new idea, in my youth it was a necessity to work if you wanted money.

ATM many employers are having to recruit replacements whilst hundreds of thousands, maybe millions of former employees chase their dream job/lifestyle, but reality will soon kick back in for most over the next two years.

I do think most jobs are underpaid, most employers are treating staff badly, like children rather than adults, so it is to be expected that an average worker wants to improve their take home pay, to be able to at least offer their kids beans on toast as a treat, when they see directors and owners getting 60% plus annual increases compared to their 2% increase.

Old lessons have been forgotten, treat your workers well and pay well and they will reward you with loyalty. In my town an old shoemaking company has boards throughout its reception of workers who have been with them forty plus years, the same surnames, whole families are shown. I have never seen that company advertise for any workers in my 55 years in the town, almost all people are recruited by recommendation.

 

[MOIC]

In my town an old shoemaking company has boards throughout its reception of workers who have been with them forty plus years, the same surnames, whole families are shown. I have never seen that company advertise for any workers in my 55 years in the town, almost all people are recruited by recommendation.

Northampton - The Mecca of the shoe industry in my days in the fashion & accessory business near 40 years ago! I used to supply the likes of Ravel and British Shoe Corperation.

 

[Mark T Jones]

It's an employee's market - which won't last for ever - perhaps not for very long, even.

That said, the nature of change is that you get a huge surge in a particular direction, followed by a reversion correction, but the change is embedded. Stuff like WFH and 4 day weeks will be critical aspects of employment, much like '4 weeks paid holiday' and 'contrubutory pension scheme' were, way back when.

 

[MOIC]

I also think there's an employee shortage in certain sectors which will mean employers will need to provide incentives to get their employment. I can't see this will be short term, unless the government changes it's stance on 'imported' labour.

 

[MBE2017]

I also think there's an employee shortage in certain sectors which will mean employers will need to provide incentives to get their employment. I can't see this will be short term, unless the government changes it's stance on 'imported' labour.

Has their been any real change? I seem to see more imported labour today than ever before. Not arguing the rights or wrongs, we are where we are, but I don’t think this or any Gov is truly trying to reduce foreign labour, probably the opposite in reality.

 

[MOIC]

Has their been any real change? I seem to see more imported labour today than ever before. Not arguing the rights or wrongs, we are where we are, but I don’t think this or any Gov is truly trying to reduce foreign labour, probably the opposite in reality.

I think in certain sectors there's a dearth of suitable employees, for example which have been in the news lately including care home workers, the medical profession, qualified haulage drivers, as well as restaurant staff from waiters/waitresses to highly trained chefs. The hospitality trade relied on a lot of foreign workers which have returned to their countries for one reason or another with a void to be filled.

There are many other industries which require skilled workers, which is one of the reasons many factories have closed, due to a lack of skills being past down from one generation to the next.

 

[Chris Ashdown]

@MOIC Are you using this site as a marketing tool with all these meaningless questions or are ou just bored to death and needing to write a new question

 

[MOIC]

@Chris Ashdown perhaps they’re meaningless to you in which case you can decide to contribute or not. Let other viewers decide if a thread relates to their business or if it’s worth contributing to.

I’ll try to add some anti China threads in the future which I’m sure you’ll contribute to.

Stay well!

 

[UKSBD]

As my business is just a homebased lifestyle business I am really neither an employee or employer (apart from family members)

Due to health issues I mothballed one of my businesses in 2018, never really started it back up but still just let it tick over (as long as it makes enough to pay insurance, simple running fees and accountancy fees I'll just leave it mothballed.

Other business just about runs itself and currently just about earns a living but little else.

At 58 and with a couple of properties, savings in bank I don't really need to work but are probably closest to number 4 in your list and are thinking about just getting a little part time job just to keep me active rather than anything else.

I did a property up a few years ago, lost 4 stone, lots more social interaction and was happiest I had been for years, slipping back in to bad ways now just sat at a screen all day and barely seeing anyone.

My biggest problem is the thought of having to be at a set place for set amount of hours, I'd rather do nothing than have to do something, (if that makes sense)

I want a light/manual job where I can just go in and leave anytime I like, chat to other workers throughout the day, not be told what to do and not be treated like an idiot, oh and only be 5 minutes from home - I don't think that job exists though

 

[MOIC]

My biggest problem is the thought of having to be at a set place for set amount of hours, I'd rather do nothing than have to do something, (if that makes sense)

I had an employee many moons ago not to dissimilar to what you've mentioned. I gave him the keys to come and go when he wanted. He started at 5am and left at approx 8am, just when I was arriving. He was at his happiest being able to work within his skillset and the hours he wanted.

 

[WaveJumper]

Northampton - The Mecca of the shoe industry in my days in the fashion & accessory business near 40 years ago! I used to supply the likes of Ravel and British Shoe Corperation.

Ravel now there's a name from the past ..... I used to work for them back in the day great memories

 

[MOIC]

Ravel now there's a name from the past ..... I used to work for them back in the day great memories

Ravel, Bertie, Dolcis, Chelsea Girl, Snob . . . . . . . all distant memories!

 

[UKSBD]

I had an employee many moons ago not to dissimilar to what you've mentioned. I gave him the keys to come and go when he wanted. He started at 5am and left at approx 8am, just when I was arriving. He was at his happiest being able to work within his skillset and the hours he wanted.

One of my problems is I have what can only really be described as claustrophobic feelings if I have to be in same place too long.

Stupid thing is, as long as I know I can just get up and go anytime I don't need to.

It's the same with work I do, I have a few local people who I help out with websites and stuff, don't charge them a lot but have the understanding that if I consider it too much like work rather than something I want to do I will just stop.

Haven't really worked for anyone else properly for 18 years, would probably find it really hard now, but I want to do something rather than just sitting here all day.

 

[MOIC]

Haven't really worked for anyone else properly for 18 years, would probably find it really hard now, but I want to do something rather than just sitting here all day.

If you want to do something to get out and aren't necessarily relying on an income, I would highly recommend taking up a hobby which gets you outside. Something simple like painting with water colours is very therapeutic, cheap to buy materials and you don't need any experience. You'll get better as you go along. Paint indoors when there's inclement weather. I try to spend an hour a day painting and it's a great way to relax.

 

[UKSBD]

I go through phases of thinking about what to do, get enthusiastic about something, then slip back behind the keyboard and back to old habits

I'll have a really good try this time

What I really want is something with a bit of social interaction though, but somewhere where people are there to actually do something rather than just there to meet people, but also something that if I don't feel like going I'm not letting others down

 

[MOIC]

Hobbies that interest you is the way to go, joining 1 or more clubs involved with some of the following examples: books, fishing, cookery, cards (bridge . . .), sports (not strenuous), painting, photography, gardening, but I would try to spend as much time outside in the fresh air. Select 1 or 2 that you're comfortable with.

 

[kulture]

I go through phases of thinking about what to do, get enthusiastic about something, then slip back behind the keyboard and back to old habits

I'll have a really good try this time

What I really want is something with a bit of social interaction though, but somewhere where people are there to actually do something rather than just there to meet people, but also something that if I don't feel like going I'm not letting others down

In my town, every Tuesday afternoon a group of volunteers go out and litter pick. They choose a different area each week.

So it is something constructive, gets them out, a bit of exercise, and social interaction.

 

[Mark T Jones]

Has their been any real change? I seem to see more imported labour today than ever before. Not arguing the rights or wrongs, we are where we are, but I don’t think this or any Gov is truly trying to reduce foreign labour, probably the opposite in reality.

There are pocketed problems, which will ultimately resolve themselves in a variety of ways. Unfortunately, in these traditionally minimum wage environments, paying more (however it's packaged) is really not an option unless the customer will bear the cost.

In hospitality, there is already some return of leavers who went to other sectors, realising that the grass isn't greener, and that delivery driving (for example) comes with its own set of stresses.

Technology will play a part. I'm currently financing 2 waiter robots - made in China - for a hotel customer. Costing £10k each, they will do the work of 4 floor staff at a fraction of the cost (and without worker rights) . QR codes are widely adopted for labour-saving throughout Europe. Now cutting-edge tech, expect those prices to drop pretty quickly.

And then there is recession which unfortunately will hit the mid-market hospitality sector very hard (we're already seeing a significant tightening of credit terms here)

The care sector is different again, where tight margins meet extensive regulation (I'm talking specifically about the state-sponsored end of the market) - this is a political problem, which the Government have no choice but to resolve; I suspect by relaxing rules on foreign labour. Again, paying more really isn't an option to most care homes

 

[MOIC]

There are pocketed problems, which will ultimately resolve themselves in a variety of ways. Unfortunately, in these traditionally minimum wage environments, paying more (however it's packaged) is really not an option unless the customer will bear the cost.

If it's a question of getting the right staff in to run your business efficiently, I think ultimately consumers will end up paying more.

If you look at most consumer products that are on the shelves now, there has been an increase of between 10% - 20%, caused by a variety of reasons.

In hospitality, there is already some return of leavers who went to other sectors, realising that the grass isn't greener, and that delivery driving (for example) comes with its own set of stresses.

Agree, I also think there has been an increase in pay, as well as incentives to entice them back.

Technology will play a part. I'm currently financing 2 waiter robots - made in China - for a hotel customer. Costing £10k each, they will do the work of 4 floor staff at a fraction of the cost (and without worker rights) . QR codes are widely adopted for labour-saving throughout Europe. Now cutting-edge tech, expect those prices to drop pretty quickly.

I'm not sure that prices will come down quickly due to 2 main factors, chip availability and a large chunk of the cost is the software development to program the robots, which are unique to each customer. Software engineers are in very high demand in China and their salaries are gong through the roof, typically 50% more than last year.

And then there is recession which unfortunately will hit the mid-market hospitality sector very hard (we're already seeing a significant tightening of credit terms here)

Agree, banks will be very cautious.

The care sector is different again, where tight margins meet extensive regulation (I'm talking specifically about the state-sponsored end of the market) - this is a political problem, which the Government have no choice but to resolve; I suspect by relaxing rules on foreign labour. Again, paying more really isn't an option to most care homes

Agree on the state-sponsored end of the market. I think there's sufficient profit for the private care homes to afford higher salaries to get the staff required, probably at the expense of them going to work in the state-sponsored care homes.

 

[SillyBill]

Never had any issue finding staff (rarely have to), my only issue has been retention. And not as you may think. In that few ever leave my business voluntarily once in the door and zero turnover is as bad for a business as no turnover in my experience. We'd actually like to be in the market far more often and target fresh ideas/enthusiasm as a result, immaterial of pay/benefits they want, it makes total sense to bring new life in. I've got a guy now who I've been totally ambivalent to if he left for a long while. Wage increases have all but stopped to try and force the hand and yet still nothing to take accountability of the situation, you hint as strongly as you can that looking elsewhere for a higher wage may be wise...seemingly unable to recognise you tend to look after those who the business actually wants to keep. So when people talk to me of staff leaving because they are underpaid etc. I'd like to know how they do it, all I get is staff sticking forever and a day until we have to show them out the door in an expensive formal process that is unpleasant for everybody concerned. Clearly they like working for us, despite the moaning is my only conclusion.

 

[bodgitt&scarperLTD]

The tide is definitely turning. I've had multiple unsolicited calls asking if I have any work in the last few weeks.

 

[ctrlbrk]

So when people talk to me of staff leaving because they are underpaid etc. I'd like to know how they do it, all I get is staff sticking forever and a day until we have to show them out the door in an expensive formal process that is unpleasant for everybody concerned. Clearly they like working for us, despite the moaning is my only conclusion.

Never underestimate the power of inertia.