How do you verify if someone is registered as self employed?

[Mr Monday]

How do you verify if someone is registered as self-employed? I am aware that they will have a UTR, but this will not suffice.

Any methods to verify this?

 

[simon field]

Self-assessments?

 

[Mr D]

You ask them.

They can ask for a confirmation letter from HMRC if they really want it. However if you aren't going to accept them having a UTR will a letter do any more?

 

[Newchodge]

None that I am aware of, without relying on the self-employed person.

 

[namesweb]

I guess it depends on why.... Why does it matter, and what will verification of their self employed status open up as a next step?

 

[C.B UK]

Confirmation

 

[paulears]

UTR not sufficient? I suppose some might have a VAT number, but again, maybe that's not sufficient either - although in these covid times, just ask them for a copy of their self-employment covid grant. Only self-employed (and not even all of them) will have this? If HMRC gave them the grant, surely anyone would accept that?

 

[Mr Monday]

seeing as there is no common methods to verify if they are self-employed, I am no longer worried.

I just thought of someone providing a fake UTR and claiming they are self employed when they actually aren't. Cause technically in such a situation, this would be considered cash in hand.....Correct?

This was my main concern as I would be the one in problems. But seeing as there is no official way to check I will just request the UTR and this is my way of confirming if they are self-employed.

 

[Darren_Ssc]

Maybe you should just verify their ID and address, then you have covered yourself?

 

[Mr D]

Perhaps if you explained why?
Then between us maybe we have come across solutions others use for that issue.

 

[Mr D]

seeing as there is no common methods to verify if they are self-employed, I am no longer worried.

I just thought of someone providing a fake UTR and claiming they are self employed when they actually aren't. Cause technically in such a situation, this would be considered cash in hand.....Correct?

This was my main concern as I would be the one in problems. But seeing as there is no official way to check I will just request the UTR and this is my way of confirming if they are self-employed.

Cash in hand payment to employees still happens. Deductions made, money handed over in cash.
Perfectly legal and the employer shouldn't have a problem meeting payment requirements for taxes etc.

 

[DontAsk]

I will just request the UTR and this is my way of confirming if they are self-employed.

It's a way of confirming that they file self-assessment returns. Nothing more. Anyone can get one.

 

[DontAsk]

Furthermore, I wouldn't give out my UTR.

 

[paulears]

Maybe it's just a business gamble? If you allow them to invoice and you pay, what is the chance of them not having self-employed status and HMRC taking the time to recover the unpaid tax, employees and employers NI? If you know them, it's easy - if you don't, then how much do you need them?

 

[Mitch3473]

If they are claiming to be SE and you are paying them then you will be getting an invoice from them. Surely that's enough if any problems arise, the ball's in their court..!!
We have staff who both have their own little businesses, SE cleaners, we know that and they work for us when they are available and when we need them. They invoice us monthly and it works for both parties.

 

[John Hemming]

If they are claiming to be SE and you are paying them then you will be getting an invoice from them. Surely that's enough if any problems arise, the ball's in their court..!!

The difficulty is that the law as to when someone is employed and when they are a contractor is not just the issue as to whether or not they issue invoices (or even charge VAT).

 

[paulears]

Not at all safe, to be honest. If HMRC wish, you, as the employer will pay the missing bits. One of the panto companies checked with HMRC, issued contracts, paid the people. Then HMRC changed their minds and demanded the missing money, with the actual people long gone. It went to the High Court. They lost! Now they have people doing certain roles who are PAYE or nothing, because that's where they got hit. I get a different contract and invoice. I don't blame them at all. I suppose realistically, with the self-employment COVID situation we are seeing two kinds of self-employed. People who genuinely are, and the people who are probably not. Some are totally self-employed, but others are that weird in the middle thing - lots of temporary or short term jobs, many PAYE many not, and I suppose when in doubt, you are PAYE being the safe rule for employers.

 

[Mr D]

Furthermore, I wouldn't give out my UTR.

May limit you.

I've been asked for it probably a half dozen times this year and I'm not self employed any more.
Online stuff the alternate options are copy of business bank account, invoices from other suppliers, even scanned tax calculation letter by one place.
UTR is less invasive than some.

 

[paulears]

Surely the purpose of giving you the number is to use it, like your VAT number. NI numbers are different but this is about tax and that’s what the UTR is for!

 

[Newchodge]

The UTR is to identify you with HMRC. It is of no value to anyone else as it cannot be checked or used by anyone else. Anyne can get a UTR without being self employed. Anyone who feels like it can make up a UTR

 

[Newchodge]

The difficulty is that the law as to when someone is employed and when they are a contractor is not just the issue as to whether or not they issue invoices (or even charge VAT).

I got the impression the OP was worried about paying someone who didn't declare their earnings to HMRC. If that is the cse he just needs to get and keep an invoice. If he is woirried whether the individual working for him is self employed or an employee, the 'employer' is responsible for carrying out the necessary checks. A self-employed person can still be your employee.

 

[AlanJ1]

Surely the purpose of giving you the number is to use it, like your VAT number. NI numbers are different but this is about tax and that’s what the UTR is for!

Yeah I wouldn't personally be giving mine out.
As long as the person invoices your company correctly then surely due diligence has been done?