Freelance websites

mild scientist

Free Member
Aug 5, 2015
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So far I found clients for my consulting work (math, physics, computer simulations, scientific writing/editing/translation) through direct contacts. I am now also looking into sites like freelancer.com, upwork.com, etc. Did anybody here use these to get work as freelancers? Which ones would you recommend?
Thanks for your feedback.
 
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Gecko001

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Apr 21, 2011
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I wouldn't bother. They're a race to the bottom. In the vast majority of cases, you'll make well below minimum wage.
I agree with this. Especially for maths/scientific work since you will be competing mostly with people in the Far East. So you need to be willing to work for about half the minimum wage.

PS
If you were doing something where a good command of English is necessary such as writing, you might get a fair rate, but for anything where perfect English was not a requirement you will expect to get less about $5 an hour.
 
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Alan

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  • Aug 16, 2011
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    As with every marketing channel it is worth testing- in the last 8 years I have tried People Per Hour, Upwork ( ex eLance ) and Fivver. I must admit the experience wasn't pleasant, it makes you almost suicidal, and I wont re test them myself. ( as mentioned the race to the bottom is crazy ).

    Ironically, Fivver probably was the most beneficial!

    There are some premium markets opening up ( recognising the race to the bottom on price = race to the bottom on quality ) An example in the programming world is 'codeable' where they have a minimum rate of $60 per hour - so buyers are not chancers expecting something for nothing, and strict acceptance criteria, apparently they get 250 applications from freelancers per week and accept 2. I haven't applied as I don't take rejection well :)
     
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    mild scientist

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    Aug 5, 2015
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    After looking at listings for a few days, I think I will focus on those jobs that require specific enough skills for the competition (from competent people) not to be too fierce. I'll spend the few tens of dollars necessary to be allowed to bid on these, and see if I get anything. If the lowest bidder always wins, then I'll give up and claim that it taught me a valuable lesson.
     
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    It's certainly possible to find work through freelance sites, but it's incredibly difficult. If your area of expertise is very specific, then you may be in luck, and may find there's not too much competition.

    However, from my experience, people tend to bid on jobs without bothering to read the specs, so even in a very specialised market, the person posting the job will need to filter through a lot of crap before they find you, and in most cases will probably give up and pull the job.
     
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    mild scientist

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    Aug 5, 2015
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    I got started, bidding on a few projects. I selected those for which I am likely to stand out and should normally be at least shortlisted. If I cannot plug my PhD, I forget about that project right away :) If I get nothing, then I'll drop the idea and look for work elsewhere.
     
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    CyberMust

    Free Member
    Jan 8, 2017
    5
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    London
    To succeed as a freelancer online, you need to create an Online Brand for yourself and have some basic plan & strategy for that.

    When you promote yourself offline through personal contacts, you already are a recognisable "Brand" that you've been creating unknowingly since the beginning of your professional life. And, your personal/professional contacts have been your "Brand Ambassadors". Moreover, when you prospect offline, you generally meet the prospective clients face to face and they get a chance to verify your "Brand" and its USP.

    But now, when you enter the online market, you are an almost unknown entity without any recognisable brand and without any brand ambassadors to vouch for you. You need to re-create all these things for the cyber world.

    Moreover, the online competition you'll be facing on platforms like Upwork, Freelancers, PPH etc. will be very different from your offline experience. A lot of your competitors from the Eastern countries will be able quote a much lower price because of the lower cost of living in their countries. Many of them would be as qualified as you. A lot of them would be very proficient in English, too.

    In a nutshell, it's totally a new ballgame. But, it's definitely doable if you have right plan and proper execution.

    I'd suggest that you first start working on creating an Online Brand for yourself. The initial steps would be

    (1) Establish your own branded Online Presence:

    (i) Purchase your own domain and and setup a website.
    (ii) Have a testimonial section where you post testimonials from your past offline clients. (Video testimonials work best)
    (iii) Have a Blog section where you post relevant articles ( prove your subject authority)
    (iv) Of course, display your online resume

    (2) Establish yourself on Social Media: I would recommend to concentrate on Linkedin

    I hope these basic suggestions are helpful. I would love to elaborate further and help you create an Online Brand for you, if you wish. Please feel free to ask here or send PM.

    Wish you all the success in your online expansion!

    Cheers,
    Tashu
     
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    NicolasDevDes

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    Jan 9, 2017
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    As with every marketing channel it is worth testing- in the last 8 years I have tried People Per Hour, Upwork ( ex eLance ) and Fivver. I must admit the experience wasn't pleasant, it makes you almost suicidal, and I wont re test them myself. ( as mentioned the race to the bottom is crazy ).

    Hi Alan,
    Can you share your experience with People Per Hour? Because I'm beginning in there working as freelancer and I'd love to have more information.
     
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    Richard Edwards

    Free Member
    Jun 25, 2015
    30
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    Bristol
    As a web design agency, if we hit a quiet period, we find freelancer.com is ok. You just need to filter out the crap.
    For example, people in the middle-east/asia and even eastern europe work for around £10-15/hr on there, if not less. If you won't work for less than say £400 for a basic project, then filter the Fixed Price offerings for a minimum of £400. This will show you people willing to pay a realistic price, and in turn they expect a decent job done. Then go through and find UK/US/AUS based companies asking for the work - they are much more likely to pick a UK based freelancer.

    You have to remember, a lot of the bids on these sites are automated, have generic proposals and auto-bid a mid-range price even if their hourly rate is half of yours the bids will be the same as yours. So long as you sound genuine and target the right employers, you will get work.

    I haven't been on freelancer for over a year, but Jan can be quiet for us, so I popped on and already picked up 2 jobs worth £1500 each from UK people looking for freelancers
     
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    Steve Samuels

    Free Member
    Sep 4, 2016
    34
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    Hi Mild Scientist,

    There is a lot of good and bad said about freelancing websites, but hopefully my experience will be helpful to you. I run a prototyping company, focusing on developing electronics, software and data analytics prototypes. While not the same as what you do, it is a technical niche, and as a result there is less work around, but also much less competition.

    Prior to starting my company, I used to freelance, and I had best results using PeoplePerHour. The approach that I took was to use google to try and find an engineer, and see where it lead me, and PPH was the top of the list.

    More and more companies seem to be using PPH and similar websites to find skills they need, so I am finding more and more that there are people who need specialist work done, and have a sensible budget for it.

    The best advice I can give about freelancing sites is to always put solid effort into writing your proposals. I have done some outsourcing through PPH, and it is amazing how many boiler plate proposals you receive, where the applicant clearly hasn't read the job description. I tend to just delete these almost immediately.

    A good proposal should introduce yourself, give a little background about your skills/experience and more specifically, how you can apply that to the clients needs. Don't be afraid to talk in a little bit of detail about the techniques you think you might use to help that client, and also ask questions if the project description was a little vague (which it usually is). This shows that you have read the ad, understand the problem and are keen to understand it better, which is exactly the kind of thing that most clients would be looking for, and most freelancers don't demonstrate (in my experience)

    When I put through a proposal, I do the above, and my goal is to arrange a discussion with the client to better understand what they want done and why. From this I put together a more detailed proposal document, breaking down the work I think needs to be done, and justifying the price. I have had a lot of feedback from clients I got from freelancing websites that this has really stood out to them.

    If you notice that the job you apply for has had a lot of other applicants, pay to make yours a premium application. Focus on the projects that you know you can do really well, and make quality applications, rather than going for hundreds of boiler plate proposals. It is an investment of time, but I think it pays off.

    It is true that many clients are tempted to go with cheaper options, but I have had a couple of times where a client initially did so, and then came back to me a few months later saying that it hadn't worked out for them, and they needed something better. Many people have been burned by bad freelancers, and as a result avoid the cheapest option.

    With specific regards to PPH, they have an hourly system that is great, you can list fixed proceed services that are effectively 'buy it now'. I'd recommend creating a few of these, and they should be competitively priced. I have received a huge number of inquiries from people finding my hourly, which resulted in them wanting much more than the scope of the hourly, thus committing to a larger project.

    I hope that this information is helpful, and I wish you luck building your freelancing business.

    Regards,
    -Steve
     
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    Rob Ellis

    Free Member
    Business Listing
    Jun 30, 2017
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    www.m365chap.co.uk
    I've been active on upwork. peopleperhour, freelancer and guru since last summer, but overall I have the most success with upwork and peopleperhour - although I suspect that would be different for different people.

    It doesn't pay the mortgage - but it brings in extra income and experience.

    All of the sites have the high volume / low pricing bidder problem, but what I tend to do is ignore the budget values for the most part, unless they are actually accurate in my estimation (which almost never happens), and I highlight that I am UK based.

    I've also done what -Steve has done with PPH - created a couple of 'hourlies' - and then done the upsell based on those - because I generally find people don't know exactly what they want to begin with.
     
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    Chris Ashdown

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  • Dec 7, 2003
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    I would say do not play on qualifications very much but spend far more time on what you can do and have done in relation to what they want. Many qualifications are out of date a year after you finish the course, its about what you have learnt after or if you are just resting on the past.

    Sometimes you cannot beat the old post cv's to every company you fancy working for and whilst it can be a slow route it can be beneficial and if your cv stood out most people put them aside for possible work in the future.

    Believe it of not there is still a snail post system and people do read rather that hit the delete button
     
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    Free.stockphoto.com

    Free Member
    Jul 17, 2017
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    I would say do not play on qualifications very much but spend far more time on what you can do and have done in relation to what they want. Many qualifications are out of date a year after you finish the course, its about what you have learnt after or if you are just resting on the past.

    Sometimes you cannot beat the old post cv's to every company you fancy working for and whilst it can be a slow route it can be beneficial and if your cv stood out most people put them aside for possible work in the future.

    Believe it of not there is still a snail post system and people do read rather that hit the delete button

    Sorry to hijack this thread a bit but I'm a n00b here and can't DM forum members directly yet. @Chris Ashdown - your website workandfashion .co .uk needs to have a redirection setup so that both 'workandfashion .co .uk' and 'www. workandfashion .co .uk' work. Currently only the latter works. Just update the htaccess file (I'm sure you know). Cheers. Sorry again, Mods.

    Jon
     
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    AllUpHere

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    Jun 30, 2014
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    What's the best advice for price? Should you go for a higher price to look more 'professional' or lower to get the job?
    Always higher, but with one very important condition; your entire marketing strategy must be built around your being expensive. You need to have engineered an advantage into your business that will justify the high price.

    As with all things marketing, it's all in the preparation.
     
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    HazelC

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    Sep 7, 2013
    1,168
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    Cambridgeshire
    I used freelance sites at the beginning, I set out my stand and only offered things at money that was reasonable to me and I was happy to work for (some people fight to the bottom / lowest price but this was something I avoided) - I used it as a way to keep me busy / occupied, a way to get some 'pocket money' but also (and perhaps more importantly) a way to get some amazing testimonials for my business which I put on my website.
     
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    Darren Starr

    Free Member
    Sep 1, 2017
    7
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    I agree with this. Especially for maths/scientific work since you will be competing mostly with people in the Far East. So you need to be willing to work for about half the minimum wage.

    PS
    If you were doing something where a good command of English is necessary such as writing, you might get a fair rate, but for anything where perfect English was not a requirement you will expect to get less about $5 an hour.

    Having hired and been hired on Freelancer.com and now Upwork.com and PeoplePerHour, I completely agree.

    People who live in parts of the world where the cost of living completely outprice you often win in this regard.

    As others have said, I'd get my site looking great, show the value of what you offer, some case studies/testimonials and then I'd go prospecting, writing emails/phoning and visiting businesses who match your target client criteria.

    You can use the aforementioned site to hire people to do this prospecting for you! ;)
     
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