Ecommerce becoming depressing?

deniser

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Jun 3, 2008
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Running an internet retail business in the "old" days was fun as it was new and evolving and there were amazing opportunities because it used to be quite easy.

Maybe I have been doing it too long but I am beginning to find it all rather depressing.

The postal charges keep rising and getting more complicated.
The distance selling regulations keep getting more onerous.
Customers are becoming more fussy, more demanding, wanting everything instantly and being quite aggressive in some cases.
The quality of goods available to stock is going downhill rapidly because of the pressure on pricing and cost cutting by manufacturers.
The social networking opportunities for promoting a business are either saturated or have become costly.
Big companies are now taking priority over niche businesses on Google.
Google, Facebook etc need to make large amounts of money.
Amazon is taking over everything and surviving on its low profit model
The technology side is becoming more complicated.
Internet fraud is increasing.
Ebay has become pretty useless for some sectors as a sales channel.
Primark prices are hard to match for clothing.
Bedroom sellers with no concept of proper profit margins abound.

I can't really see many positives on the horizon. Seriously thinking of packing it in and finding something new to do....
 
I

iboxsecurity

This is all too common to hear now a days. It has gotten a lot harder and as you say there are so many problems that are causing this.

The only thing to do is review where you are at and decide upon the best move forward.
 
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Running an internet retail business in the "old" days was fun as it was new and evolving and there were amazing opportunities because it used to be quite easy.

Maybe I have been doing it too long but I am beginning to find it all rather depressing.
....

I know exactly what you mean about ecommerce (your post could have been written by me!).

This is all too common to hear now a days. It has gotten a lot harder and as you say there are so many problems that are causing this

For me personally, it's not 'how hard it is' (I love a challenge and learning new things!), I just dislike the internet now (and social media really ain't my bag!).

I think (and this probably applies to alot of people!), you have to ask your self 'do I enjoy it anymore'?
If the answers no, well it's time for a change (this is what I'm considering at the moment).

There is a good book called 'Who Moved My Cheese' which can help with big changes.
 
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quikshop

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It's not like the good ol' wild west days, frontier trading in under-populated markets and straight forward unbiased search engine criteria to work to... sigh :(

There is a lot to be said for disruptive business practices, methods that undermine or remove completely the advantage the large operators have.

A great example of market disruption are these new counter-less shops that simply display products; you scan using a smartphone and pay using an app. I give it 18 months before Amazon dominate this idea and new disruptive techniques will need to emerge.
 
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wayzgoose

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Perfectly put !
Just as you say, when we started out in 2000, customers were a joy, suppliers didn't go up against you online and it was a very exciting place.
We've mostly been in niche product lines and it's so sad to see some of the old competitors, with sites that no longer get updated, to be found on Ebay and Amazon making 50p an item.
These days you're no longer just competing with your competitors, it's just a battle with Google all the time. One minute everything is wonderful, the next it's like you've been dropped from the listings altogether. And personally, I started a website because I enjoyed it and I enjoyed the selling. I no longer really enjoy the website and I certainly don't find it any fun at all trying to keep up with what you must do these days to have any hope of success (which is nothing to do with a neat and tidy website and customer service which I'm very proud of).
A couple of months ago I began narrowing down our selling and I will continue to get rid of more and more of what has become a real headache. I've also now got a couple of things which pay the bills and, thankfully, have nothing whatsoever to do with the internet.
 
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Raw Rob

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The postal charges keep rising and getting more complicated.

Through an OBA account it is still relatively straightforward.

The distance selling regulations keep getting more onerous.

I thought there were some improvements in the next set of changes, like that you can wait until you receive goods back before you refund.

Customers are becoming more fussy, more demanding, wanting everything instantly and being quite aggressive in some cases.

The quality of goods available to stock is going downhill rapidly because of the pressure on pricing and cost cutting by manufacturers.

I've not found this at all. Maybe you just need to change your products lines!
 
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Wow I opened this one up straight away - you are a forum member that I have always had extra regard for due to your posts - so it really caught my eye that you are now thinking this way but your posts seem to have been moving this way for a while

Obviously the fun and new and learning with each other days are long gone and the market place has changed beyond recognition and I think it is only going to continue to get tougher and worse

I think it is tougher and tougher for the independents unless they have something quite unique or different and can keep up with the constant change in some way

From what I remember generally of your posts you are bright bunny with plenty of ideas so maybe the time has come for you to move on and use those skills in a different way

And maybe you could use your internet knowledge and skills to give you some sort of leverage in this new area

Does your business have some resale value - if so maybe try and get something for it - it can be nice to see the things we have created and nurtured and put effort into - keep on going even if not with ourselves and sometimes new people bring a fresh approach and can make something work

Selling up is also a great way to get rid of all the stock and the technology etc

If you do decide to sell have an excuse for doing so - you want a change can be all that is needed - and be positive about it while doing so

Or maybe look at a huge restructuring can you shrink down and reduce to your key lines and live off those etc etc
 
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deniser

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I thought there were some improvements in the next set of changes, like that you can wait until you receive goods back before you refund.

!
Points like this are irrelevant to how the Regulations have operated in practice. This doesn't add anything.

In all my years of trading I have not once actually received a notice of cancellation as prescribed by the regs.
 
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Jeff FV

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The postal charges keep rising and getting more complicated.

Charges do keep rising (boo!) but I don't think things are getting more complicated (for us, at least). The price banding on our OBA has narrowed such that we now only have two effective bands: large letters and packets (or parcels as I think they are now called.) When we started, I remember sorting my packets into different weight bands etc.

The social networking opportunities for promoting a business are either saturated or have become costly.

Agree - Facebook being our biggest gripe. We spent a long time building lots of genuine fans, Fbook now only shows our posts to a fraction of those fans. (This also annoys me as a FBook user - I want to see stuff from those that I've liked, not something they think I might like)

Amazon is taking over everything and surviving on its low profit model

Definitely.

The technology side is becoming more complicated.
Disagree - new technologies are making things easier. Although I do agree having to cater for more devices - not just the desktop PC - has meant things have had to be updated.

I can't really see many positives on the horizon. Seriously thinking of packing it in and finding something new to do....

We sometimes think this, but then we remember the money to be made from a few hours work on a 'good day' would takes days to earn in many other jobs.

As a thought experiment, I often do the 'lottery test': if I won big time on the lottery, would I still do this? To be fair, in the first few years the answer would have been yes - it was fun, it was exciting, now the answer would probably be no, but as we've still got bills to pay and kids to feed we'll keep doing it. The big bonuses for us are the effective hourly pay rate, and the flexibility it gives us.

J
 
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Chris34

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Feb 3, 2009
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I'd agree that the fun isn't there anymore. Gone are the days where you could predict that if you buy 'x' amount of products you will increase sales by 'x' amount, that used to be the case. Now it's anyones guess how many sales you will get, it's like keeping your fingers crossed and hoping for the best, no skill it's just luck.

As an example I bought 5 new lines of hot selling products (around 5 sales per day per line from other sellers on Ebay) and listed them 3 weeks ago. I invested more money in lighting for the photo's so the photo's looked either as good or better than the other sellers photo's. I priced them within the middle of the price range of the other sellers, which was very competitive (about £1 more than the cheapest). The products are in season and are related extremely closely to the other products that I sell (in the same category).

The other sellers were selling on average 5 sales per day (the best were around 10 on each line). I wanted 2 sales per week on each line (yes that's per week not per day), a very low target that I thought would get smashed. Guess how many sales I've had from each line after 3 weeks of them listed? After splashing the cash on stock, splashing the cash on lighting, working a day at a weekend to create all the photo's and listings I have sold out of the 5 lines of hot selling products at a cracking price point, I have sold the grand total of 0 sales on all 5 lines from 3 weeks. That's right, zero sales.

That's the thing that I don't like anymore, it's too unpredictable to make any plans and that's what used to make it fun. You used to make a decision based on your research and knowledge and then when you saw the results you could pat yourself on the back and say "nice one, I was correct in my thinking". The difference now is that if you get a flurry of sales you say "I don't know why the hell that just happened".

Even my suppliers seem to be at a loss these days, they are not restocking like they used to.

Put it this way, I'm seriously considering taking a pan and going on a years vacation looking for gold as I figure it's pretty much the same risk as what I'm doing now except if I don't find gold at least I've had an adventure and got to see the outdoors whereas if I don't get the sales I'm looking for then... well I don't really call packing boxes day after day and dealing with abusive customers an adventure.

Chris.
 
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deniser

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Even my suppliers seem to be at a loss these days, they are not restocking like they used to.

.
Actually yes, very good point that I should have added to my list, Even when you have a good selling product, it's either difficult to get hold of or there is suddenly something wrong with it and has to go back. Suppliers are holding such limited amounts of stock to minimise their own risks that it creates a big knock on effect.
 
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geoffb

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I can agree with the above.
We make a garden product, 3 years ago a competitor popped up and started importing a similar product from China, selling it really cheap and making pence on a sale. They weren't VAT registered and managed to really hurt my companies margins. I persevered making my USP better, then 18 months ago another competitor popped up importing the same product and undercutting my original competitor
Last week on ebay there is now a listing from another seller, selling this product for even less than the other 2 but selling it from the Netherlands

These sellers are just about breaking even, and are happy to make next to nothing on each sale.

What is really annoying is that it costs me £15 to send to the Netherlands - if it cost them the same to send to the UK then their profit is sub zero
 
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R

RepricerExpress

If it's any consolation folks, it's not just e-commerce. The Internet is affecting every line of business and unfortunately if we don't move with the times, our competitors will. I used to work in the print industry and it has seen profits squeezed to next to nothing, with closure after closure (of some really well established businesses decades old) but in all honesty, those that didn't adapt went out of business and those that embraced all the changes made some money.

Unfortunately with the pace the Internet pushes everything, that change will keep coming and nothing will remain the same for too long. I'm going to give the Euromillions a punt tomorrow night!!
 
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S

silvermusic

Too many memories through rose tinted glasses if you ask me. :rolleyes:
If you're selling the same old stuff that others are then yes it's boring as hell. If you're trying to squeeze a living out of trading on eBay, hah, I wish you the best of luck. Yes those two things would depress me too. Being you own producer with your own products is great fun and in my opinion the only way forward unless you want to be little more than a busy fool playing race to the bottom on prices and margins.
 
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deniser

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Being you own producer with your own products is great fun and in my opinion the only way forward unless you want to be little more than a busy fool playing race to the bottom on prices and margins.
We manufacture our own product too but everything we do is quickly copied and while our product is a quality one, the copies are poor quality and consequently cheaper but there is no way (other than seeing and touching the product) that people can distinguish by looking at photos online. So very difficult to do as an online business.
 
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TheGeekestLink

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Bedroom sellers with no concept of proper profit margins abound.

This is the #1 problem for me. Companies that set up and have no costs. I met one of my competitors a few weeks ago and he's quite happy shipping over the weekends to make a few extra quid for holidays, etc.

Which is just outrageous. How can anyone compete when they're happy to sell on eBay and make a few quid per purchase? The profit margins are a joke these days; I was looking on eBay today and I'd break even selling stock at the ridiculous prices they're charging.
 
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deniser

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Sounds good for the consumer though ;)
Is it though, in the long term?

I can see that what will happen is that, in the never ending quest to sell for the lowest price:
1. the quality of goods and their life expectancy will deteriorate further - this has far reaching consequences for the planet in terms of use of raw materials and energy as goods are continually replaced.
2. margins will be so eroded that all middlemen will be cut out. The bigger operators will source directly from the factory and there won't be any wholesalers left to sell goods in smaller quantities to the bedroom sellers. Wholesalers have already disappeared in many sectors. This will lead to less choice for the consumer.
3. people become so used to buying for artificially low prices that when there is a price hike - which can happen for many reasons from import control to currency fluctuations to oil shortages to blighted wheat crops or a million other reasons that they will struggle to make ends meet in the same way that people would face problems if interest rates went up to "normal" levels.
4. the world has become dependent on China for manufacturing
5. many shops have already closed down because they can't compete with the artificially low prices that internet shopping from bedroom sellers is creating. This has social consequences which haven't made themselves felt yet.

Probably many more consequences but I have to sit down and think it through...
 
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The postal charges keep rising and getting more complicated.

Postal charges have been a problem for us for a while, after implementing a decent shipping matrix we removed a lot of these problems. Instead of charging a standard £6 for all shipped goods, we were able to tailor the cost per cart. Try to optimise where you can save on shipping, is it worth sending a £2 item signed for Royal Mail or could you just slap a 2nd class stamp on it. Obviously this is going to be specific to your market but you get the point, optimise the process.

The distance selling regulations keep getting more onerous.

I don't sell abroad so can't help there.

Customers are becoming more fussy, more demanding, wanting everything instantly and being quite aggressive in some cases.

The customer is always right.. I don't think this way because people are generally fickle beasts. But you do need to cater to your target markets needs. We live in an age where people can watch TV on demand, shop from home and find anything online in an instant. This wont change, you need to find a solution to counter this, we found a faster courier and kept more product in stock.

The quality of goods available to stock is going downhill rapidly because of the pressure on pricing and cost cutting by manufacturers.

There is always a tipping point for quality vs price. It will get to a point where your customers will hit a floor and go "this is too cheap and nasty, I need to spend more to get a decent quality item" and they will come back to you. Think of Argos furniture, why do you think companies like that Oak Furniture one (the TV advertised one) are doing so well? It's because people know cheap stuff from good stuff and will buy accordingly. If your target market is now starting to look for cheaper goods, change your product or change your target market.

The social networking opportunities for promoting a business are either saturated or have become costly.

Social networking is a funny one, a lot of businesses think they need to be everywhere, Facebook, Twitter, Google+, Instagram.. etc. You don't, you just need to be where your target market is and more often than not, you're not selling there, you're making a presence there. Personally, we get more engagement (up to 1000% more) for our "Funny Friday" posts on Facebook than we did when we offered £1500 of free stuff in exchange for a email address.

Big companies are now taking priority over niche businesses on Google.
Google, Facebook etc need to make large amounts of money.
Amazon is taking over everything and surviving on its low profit model
The technology side is becoming more complicated.
Ebay has become pretty useless for some sectors as a sales channel.
Primark prices are hard to match for clothing.

There is always going to be someone bigger than you moving in on your patch of ground, you have the upper hand though as you've likely been doing it longer so know more about your market. Use this information to counter-act your new competition. Alternatively, take pointers from the bigger companies to optimise your own company, where can you save money, how can you do more for less?

Ebay, Amazon, Large Chains are again always going to try take up the smaller people and move into everything. Its their business model, they don't get huge by staying with the same products. If possible, either beat them on price (rarely possible) or take the loss and move onto another product (keep stocking it at the price you need to, but don't make it your bread and butter) If you're in a niche market, great, even easier to beat the bigger companies, establish yourself a market leader in knowledge, show potential customers why they should come to you and not Primark, what sets you apart from them? You just need to focus on your strong points and strengthen where you're weak.

Internet fraud is increasing.

Agreed, all you can do here is put steps in place to minimize your risk, we use a third party checker that evaluates the transaction and gives it a score. Not much else you can do.

Bedroom sellers with no concept of proper profit margins abound.

These generally fall as fast as they pop up, if they don't know their margins, they either go bankrupt or work for pittance and burn out.

I can't really see many positives on the horizon. Seriously thinking of packing it in and finding something new to do....

If its no fun anymore then don't play the game. But if you found fun in the challenge and the excitement from selling online, you just need to understand the rules changed for the same game and change your approach. Think of new ways to get to your market and dominate and maybe don't look so much at Google, try Bing or similar. Yes Bing's market share is considerably smaller but with more and more Windows 8 machines going out pre-installed IE and bing as the default search you're still going to get something. Its better to have 20% of something then 100% of nothing. No one can make the decision for you to pack it in I guess but I, like you, had enough of the bedroom sellers and especially eBay sellers who are making 20p each sale and thats of all the staff work minimum wage and the send the parcels in 2nd hand Tesco's bags but over time I found these people faded out and our customers came back.

Good luck.
 
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Excellent and useful post thanks

Deniser - you might just need a holiday and a break - but then the trouble with the internet is that it just does not stop - it is like rust - 24/7

And sometimes it is just time to move on

And sometimes you need some luck - imagine if you were an online bookseller forget it - gone

But a little niche doing XYZ - then you might still be happily ticking away
 
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This is the #1 problem for me. Companies that set up and have no costs. I met one of my competitors a few weeks ago and he's quite happy shipping over the weekends to make a few extra quid for holidays, etc.

Which is just outrageous. How can anyone compete when they're happy to sell on eBay and make a few quid per purchase? The profit margins are a joke these days; I was looking on eBay today and I'd break even selling stock at the ridiculous prices they're charging.

And that is just business - your competitor is getting what they want out of the business and very happily so - it just stops you getting what you want.

It is not "outrageous" anymore than if we think about old corner shops and supermarkets
 
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cjd

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    But all this was totally predictable wasn't it? After all, if thousands of people can sell stuff from their bedrooms what you have is a perfect market where prices reduce to their marginal cost or supply - that's 101 economics. What was the plan when this inevitably happened?

    I would have been looking for something that made me different in a way that the bedroom boys couldn't easily copy or specialise is an obscure niche. I've watched people like Silly Jokes over the years do all that with a lot of admiration.
     
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    I agree with you - but not many have seen all the directions nor the speed at which the internet has gone and was going into - if it helps think of the music industry and with all those smart brains or the book industry and did someone mention e-readers

    Sometimes we start selling and doing what we know and need to bring in the income right now and that becomes the focus for our efforts and we cannot always see as far down the line looking forwards as when looking back
     
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    cjd

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    I agree with you - but not many have seen all the directions nor the speed at which the internet has gone and was going into - if it helps think of the music industry and with all those smart brains or the book industry and did someone mention e-readers

    Mostly it's because they can't and/or won't change, not because they can't see what's coming. It was obvious to them 20 years ago - I know because I was there. Normally it's the outsider that forces the change, the incumbent just hopes that it's all going to carry on regardless. They really did, it was fascinating to watch. I was amazed that it took 10 years before it started to happen though.

    Sometimes we start selling and doing what we know and need to bring in the income right now and that becomes the focus for our efforts and we cannot always see as far down the line looking forwards as when looking back

    That's obviously true but you're complaining about the weather which is futile isn't it?
     
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    rhian100

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    its good you brought up this subject as i think you're right and it is a bit of a struggle.
    the reason i think its become so difficult to sell online is mainly because of the amount of competition..i don't just mean amazon or ebay tho that is where everyone goes first; i mean there are so many hundreds of stores selling everything that the online market is flooded and its just luck if someone doesn't click away from your site and goes to carry on browsing for something similar or the same thing cheaper on ebay, from china. I still don't understand how they can charge 99 p for some goods, like semi-decent watches and kitchen stuff, that must cost at least that in wages, even in the 3rd world.. i know that sounds depressing but i sense that is the case.. does anyone think thats how it is, as it feels like the truth of internet selling to me. The other think i'm really wanting to do is start a real, bricks and mortar stall again; but very small and a short lease (tho not easy to find- even harder now the landlords are all saying the recession deals are over!) I wanted to start a real shop called 'not on the internet' as that shop called 'not on the high street' was another kick in the teeth for the existence of real brick and mortar shops, which is a shame as we all know.. i feel a bit down about selling tonite but you're right , it is not what people think anymore.
     
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    Jeff FV

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    I wanted to start a real shop called 'not on the internet' as that shop called 'not on the high street' was another kick in the teeth for the existence of real brick and mortar shops, which is a shame as we all know..

    I, and hundreds of others who have benefited from it, do not think that Not on the High Street 'is a shame'. It has provided a way for many, many designer makers (of quality products) find a way to market and to make a decent living through their skills.
     
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    rhian100

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    yeah etsy is good as well but this discussion was about how difficult online selling can be which leads onto the fact that all retail is difficult especially bricks and mortar retail due to the overwhelming saturation of the internet retail market; in that context - the fact that internet shopping,as everyone knows, has wrecked the high street, then it obviously is a shame. which was my point.
     
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    It is not just online selling that is difficult it is all business and that is the nature of business and i would say more so in the modern world

    I have a pretty simple attitude to it all which boils down - if something is easy in business then more people will keep on going into it until it becomes tough - you can sometimes be ahead and get an easy money spell (innovation or luck) - you can sometimes find a niche (thinking or luck) - but eventually the competition will come along until it is tough again

    And to be able to continue when it becomes tough you need to be running your business in a "better" way than the competition
     
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    deniser

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    I don't sell abroad so can't help there.
    I liked your post - and we already do all that you have suggested - but the above made me laugh out loud. It was a joke wasn't it?

    It actually the new replacement legislation to the Distance Selling Regs which is coming into force on 13 June that has triggered my latest outburst :)
     
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    deniser

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    Excellent and useful post thanks

    Deniser - you might just need a holiday and a break - but then the trouble with the internet is that it just does not stop - it is like rust - 24/7

    And sometimes it is just time to move on

    And sometimes you need some luck - imagine if you were an online bookseller forget it - gone

    But a little niche doing XYZ - then you might still be happily ticking away
    Yes, definitely need a holiday!

    I do have a happy little niche which continues to do well so I have no grounds for complaint really. I just don't think the next ten years will be as easy as the last.
     
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    Chris34

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    I have a pretty simple attitude to it all which boils down - if something is easy in business then more people will keep on going into it until it becomes tough - you can sometimes be ahead and get an easy money spell (innovation or luck) - you can sometimes find a niche (thinking or luck) - but eventually the competition will come along until it is tough again

    And to be able to continue when it becomes tough you need to be running your business in a "better" way than the competition

    I think that's a very good way of looking at it. The only thing I would add to that though is that sometimes running your business in a better way to the competition is not enough to make the business viable.

    The hard part is justifying when the business goes from being viable to being a temporary period of change where it might be viable but in a smaller state / profitability and then to the outlook being a permanent change making the business unviable.

    I mean take Vinyl records for instance. The manufacturers of them probably ditched the businesses in the early to late 90's. Now they have come back into fashion and the machines used to make them are hard to come by, so anybody who still has all the equipment would be making money at it in todays market. So anybody who kept the business going would have been first in the queue for the uptake in demand.

    Also on a different note, I don't like people using bedroom sellers as a scapegoat for their own businesses failing. There seems to be a lot of snobbery against them. I myself work from my bedroom, not because I have to but because I prefer it. And just before any of the snobs of you want to have a laugh and jump down my throat for my choice, I do rent an 1,800 sq ft unit that actually has an office in it with all the power, lighting and heating. So it is a choice.

    I personally question my own judgement sometimes if having the unit is a luxury that can be done without. Take for instance the example above where you had that guy despatching parcels at weekends and storing everything at home. Well if he is making money at it and is working in the week for somebody else then is it not he who has the right idea? He could be making more money in his total take home pay (including his employment) than the competitors who are hard at it all week. Maybe it's the ones (including myself) that work at online selling full time that need to take the reality check. Maybe the online selling is moving into a state where it's just part time pin money, or another way to look at it is an investment with guaranteed returns for a bit of work and very little risk on top of working a job that you don't want to do but are guaranteed money.

    I think it's only yourself that can be true to yourself but I believe most business owners are kidding themselves most of the time.

    I suppose the only test to your business should be the level of profit for the level of effort and investment. If you are not getting the profit and it doesn't look like it's going to get any better then you either need to get out or shift it to being a part time business and keep the good bits.

    Regards,


    Chris (interesting discussion, thanks everyone)
     
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    TheGeekestLink

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    It is not "outrageous" anymore than if we think about old corner shops and supermarkets

    While it's capitalism at its highest level, I think we'll all agree that the idea of bargain basement profit margins are outrageous. In the end the only person who wins is the consumer.

    Sadly, nothing can be done to stop it. I can't see wholesalers saying no to anyone - they'll sell to Tom, Dick and Harry without a thought to the consequences, while having their own retail websites as well!
     
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    Unfortunately it's an evolutionary process and nothing stays the same for ever. I am so old I can remember the days when my parents would purchase grocery supplies from independent grocers and then in the late 50's early 60's Tesco started to evolve with a small handful of small shops . . . and look where we are today . . . with the vast majority of us buying our food etc from a small handful of major supermarket chains.

    Sadly I think the same will eventually happen for everything that can be purchased on-line and only a few specialist on-line shops will be left as viable businesses - with the major on-line businesses dominating the on-line market.

    Try to take inspiration of the words of John D. Rockefeller "If you want to succeed you should strike out on new paths, rather than travel the worn paths of accepted success". (This and other similar quotations can be seen at www.brainyquote.com )
     
    Upvote 0

    TODonnell

    Free Member
    Sep 23, 2011
    1,405
    210
    London (UK)
    ...... Being you own producer with your own products is great fun and in my opinion the only way forward unless you want to be little more than a busy fool playing race to the bottom on prices and margins.

    I think this is the future. You now have to now compete on quality and let the rest undercut each other to oblivion.
     
    Upvote 0
    I am fortunate enough to have been in the ecommerce industry from the start (1998) and I have a very unique perspective. As a one-stop ecommerce solution we have helped many businesses over the years, some becoming market leaders in their field reaching turnovers in excess of a million GBP per month. Our business has had to develop and evolve over the years and have seen first hand the changes you describe.

    I am often asked by potential clients what they should sell online. Very often clients come to us with a handful of catalogues, keen to populate a site with a massive range of products. Many of these catalogue companies are offering them direct despatch, making it easy for yet another EBay or Amazon seller to get started.

    All to often these new sellers have little or no experience on or offline. They are tempted by what? The ease of entry. Rarely have they completed even a simple business plan or due diligence. Why are they attracted to Amazon and EBay? Because they don't really need to do anything. They don't need to manage the site or find the customers, they can sell products that would be almost impossible to sell on a stand alone site.

    So what is the problem? The cost of sale is high and the competition is fierce.
    So what is the answer? Build your own site and attract your own traffic. NO. Not so fast!

    Firstly you must understand the dynamics and what makes a product WORTH selling online. Here is not probably the best place to do the full analysis but a few pointers might help. What I am saying here applies to stand alone sites using your own domain.

    1. Do the keyword research BEFORE you build the site. To be successful almost all your sales will come from Google via PPC or organic search. We are talking more than 90% here. Understand now that there are three main keyword types.

    1. Keywords for browsing - "Tennis Rackets"
    2. Keywords for comparing - "Wilson Tennis Rackets"
    3. Keywords for buying - "Wilson Pro Staff Classic"

    It will come as no surprise that the potential traffic is greatest for type 1. and least for type 3.
    It must also be noted here that the conversion rate difference is significant. If you achieve a 3% conversion on 3. then expect a 2% on 2. and < 1% on 1. Why does this matter?

    It is becoming more difficult to rank at the top of page one on Google for generic terms and many long-tail-keywords generate little or no traffic. Google Shopping Ads and Standard AdWords can be lifesaver or a bank-breaker.

    There is more to PPC than is possible to cover here but be aware that the agenda of your SEO and PPC expert and Google personal assistants is very different to your own. You should care about only one thing ROI.

    What would you consider to be a great conversion rate?
    Well let me tell you what we have found.
    4% or above is where you should set your goal. Many sites only achieve 1% or less.

    So for every 100 visitors we want just 4 sales. Sounds easy doesn't it. Well its not. Most sites, especially the smaller ones cant even get 1 sale in 100 visitors.

    Even if you manage 4% conversion there are other important factors to take into account.

    1. Total Sale Value
    2. Potential Frequency
    2. Lifetime Value of a Customer

    Now you can do the math.

    If a click on Google costs just 35p and 100 clicks will yield 4 clients at best. That = £8.75
    But what if you only manage 1% conversion. Yes it is £35 per order.

    Sometimes this will not be a problem. If your average sales order is above £350 and your percentage profit is sufficient you could easily afford this. But in truth the average Internet order from a typical store is £125 or less. So unless you expect the customer to yield a high lifetime value, beware.

    So back to my original question. What sells best online?

    High value branded goods that have high search volume in a market that you can compete.

    For now that's all you get from me.

    If anyone here wants to elaborate on a particular product / brand or would like some more of my unique perspective, just ask.

    Simon
    Managing Director
    iShop Limited
     
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    UKSBD

    Moderator
  • Dec 30, 2005
    13,026
    1
    2,828
    Great post
    The problem is there are so many website designers, marketer, SEO companies, etc. who will just take money off people with no consideration as to whether they think it is a good business idea or not.

    Someone comes to them with a £20k redundancy package in their pocket and they will do them a £20k website.

    Even if they are just selling hand made cards more expensively than MoonPig.
     
    Upvote 0

    Chris Ashdown

    Free Member
  • Dec 7, 2003
    13,380
    3,001
    Norfolk
    Sorry but what a load of rubbish you all talk the end of the world is coming

    What you see on the internet is what has happened over the last 200 centuries or longer companies grow and die, shops open and a market it opened next door with lower prices

    People test a market or idea on Amazon or Ebay and make little money

    Whats new
     
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    S

    SwindonSteve

    Unfortunately it's an evolutionary process and nothing stays the same for ever. I am so old I can remember the days when my parents would purchase grocery supplies from independent grocers and then in the late 50's early 60's Tesco started to evolve with a small handful of small shops . . . and look where we are today . . . with the vast majority of us buying our food etc from a small handful of major supermarket chains.

    Sadly I think the same will eventually happen for everything that can be purchased on-line and only a few specialist on-line shops will be left as viable businesses - with the major on-line businesses dominating the on-line market.

    Try to take inspiration of the words of John D. Rockefeller "If you want to succeed you should strike out on new paths, rather than travel the worn paths of accepted success". (This and other similar quotations can be seen at www.brainyquote.com )

    I think you're very wrong.

    No doubt, retail is changing and it's heading online. That's a fact. Destination shopping will not disappear though.

    The changes I see coming are:

    1) retail floor space reduces.
    2) retail delivery speed increases.

    The day out destination shopping experience will continue. The General below average in store shopping experience will fade and die. The niche retailers with a quality online presence will flourish especially in the same day delivery and high quality service sectors.
     
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