contacting contractors about subcontracting!!

[GLASSFRAME]

Hi to all, this is my first post and was wondering if anybody can give me some advice?
I`ve been in the glass and glazing industry for over 20 years now, and after a period of unemployment i decided to take the plunge and go self employed as a sole trader.

i`ve recently had my website finished, and ive done all the usual things regarding gaining authority by google etc..

However one main part of my business i would like to get into is sub-contracting for larger building companies etc, and subsequently quoting for tenders..
I wrote all personal letters to over 35 companies i had dealt with in the past,( when i was employed) and addressed it to the senior estimater.

I recieced one reply!! just a standard letter about sub-contracting H&E

After i got a personal business email address and sent some emails to try and test the water, but not a single reply!!

My question is, how do i go about approaching companies regarding sub-contracting, email, letter and to whom?

I know i would save these companies large amounts of money as i do things differently, but i can`t get in with any..

any advice or help?

thanks, Martin.

 

[roofing solutions]

Im actually in the same boat mate and found emails and letters to be pretty useless!!! Names and phone numbers are what you need. Can you call the people you know directly and ask them to pass your number on to the right people?? Ive also been told that we need to speak to the procurement manager as thats who deals with new suppliers initially, but i suppose business's will give there employees different titles. Good luck, let me know how you get on.
Aaron

 

[joiner]

Hi mate, I am subby joiner with 15 yrs experience and am just starting up as a contractor. As a relative newby (to contracting) I hope you don't mind me saying that probably you need to think longer term with regard to your marketing, send out emails and letters to your target customers maybe every other month or so, give them a bell every now and again etc etc etc and let them know your out there, longer term this will breed familarity with you and your business (even if only via letter/email etc at first/second/third try)... some time in the futrure they may need a roofer and you've got a good chance it'll be you they probably call.

As for whom to contact, well obviously that a good and vital question with regard to your marketing, as you say diffrent companies will have different people in charge of the hiring and firing. Alot of the big boy building companies will simply leave it to the site manager to hire and fire, others will have some sort of personnel department etc etc. If in doubt give um a bell and ask who's in charge of ask.

 

[joiner]

should read 'ask who's in charge of hiring/firing' ..and sorry I mean glazer not roofer!

 

[Matthew_28]

Hello Glassframe,

I like the website, but not too keen on the use of all capitals in the body text.

Fortunately I have experience of working for a main contractor in the roles you mention - estimator, project manager, and quantity surveyor. Who to contact seems to vary given the size and structure of the main contractor e.g. whether the business is departmentalised. For example, during a former employment I worked for a small family run business with turnover circa £3 million per annum, where I was all three - the estimator, project manager, and quantity surveyor, so the person to contact in that instance would have been me.

Site managers can be a useful point of contact but the person you want to reach is the one who signs the purchase order, generally this would be the project manager (sometimes referred to as contracts manager) or the quantity surveyor. Depending on the company the estimator will usually hand over the project (internally) once the contract has been awarded to the management team e.g. project manager, QS, project engineer etc. Don't get me wrong estimators are still a good contact if you can get in early enough to integrate into the pricing cycle, Architects would be better though if you can get in at design stage, and get specified or named as a nominated subcontractor then even better. Unless the company is relatively small estimators don't tend to follow on into the project, their role tends to stop at the contract award.

Some companies also have a procurement manager or chief buyer/buyer etc. In larger companies you find these people, they tend to live and pay their wage by negotiating discounts with suppliers and contractors, so these people will be asking for the discount, generally followed by the quantity surveyor imposing the 60 days payment terms and £k's per week liquidated ascertained damages (LADs), only joking - but these type of things can often be negotiated and should be considered when bartering with the buying department.

I have tried to list below a few of the traits common to each position, this is only in my experience of course, this will vary from business to business.

Estimators - pricing and sales, preparing budgets, sending out initial supplier and subcontractor enquiries, submitting tender proposals
Project Manager - client and design team liaison, coordination of details and trades alongside the site manager, construction programme/planning
Quantity Surveyor - commercial, contractual, valuations, and financials (the banker). This is the person you will be chasing in 12 months for your retention.

Hope this helps. Sorry for baffling on, I could probably write a book on the topic of construction and project management.

Regards

Matt

 

[Estimator]

I wish you luck, Glassframe, it's a hard time to be starting a business in construction.
As I have worked as an estimator for some big companies, I will tell you what the process was for me.
Every week your post would include several letters of introduction from new subbies wanting to go on the list. We would dutifully file them, copy them to Buying dept, and put their details on the computer. I expect at the moment, such letters are now flooding in to every contractor faster than ever, given the state of the construction industry.
For most of them that would be it, don't expect a letter saying thanks, it won't happen.
The ones of interest would be trades where we struggled to get quotes for specialist stuff . Often the 'fast track' to get an enquiry from us was the wording in the letter such as 'we are currently working for xxx Ltd (our direct competitors) - that would get our attention, we had to get hold of that price to see what the competition were doing.
Above all we would look for established companies, especially for a trade like yours where warranties might be an issue. But then again, we already knew the established companies.
Chicken and egg I know. You need a track record for doing similar jobs, before you can get one! You need to be established to establish yourself!
So let's say that you manage to get an enquiry from the estimating department, you price it rock bottom keen and they win the job? Quotes are then passed through to the Buyer or QS, it differs with companies who places the subby orders, some just ask their buyer to look after the materials.
Now the QS/Buyer will have his own thoughts about who he wants to get the job, he maybe doesn't want to risk a new firm making a cock up and delaying the contract. On top of this, his usual subbies will be having a second bite, and slashing their prices to keep in with him. You'll probably not know what is going on, only that your calls aren't being answered.
So you have many hurdles to get over to get established as a subcontractor, this might be a depressing tale, but that is the way it works.

 

[Matthew_28]

I wish you luck, Glassframe, it's a hard time to be starting a business in construction.
As I have worked as an estimator for some big companies, I will tell you what the process was for me.
Every week your post would include several letters of introduction from new subbies wanting to go on the list. We would dutifully file them, copy them to Buying dept, and put their details on the computer. I expect at the moment, such letters are now flooding in to every contractor faster than ever, given the state of the construction industry.
For most of them that would be it, don't expect a letter saying thanks, it won't happen.
The ones of interest would be trades where we struggled to get quotes for specialist stuff . Often the 'fast track' to get an enquiry from us was the wording in the letter such as 'we are currently working for xxx Ltd (our direct competitors) - that would get our attention, we had to get hold of that price to see what the competition were doing.
Above all we would look for established companies, especially for a trade like yours where warranties might be an issue. But then again, we already knew the established companies.
Chicken and egg I know. You need a track record for doing similar jobs, before you can get one! You need to be established to establish yourself!
So let's say that you manage to get an enquiry from the estimating department, you price it rock bottom keen and they win the job? Quotes are then passed through to the Buyer or QS, it differs with companies who places the subby orders, some just ask their buyer to look after the materials.
Now the QS/Buyer will have his own thoughts about who he wants to get the job, he maybe doesn't want to risk a new firm making a cock up and delaying the contract. On top of this, his usual subbies will be having a second bite, and slashing their prices to keep in with him. You'll probably not know what is going on, only that your calls aren't being answered.
So you have many hurdles to get over to get established as a subcontractor, this might be a depressing tale, but that is the way it works.

absolutely spot on.

 

[roofing solutions]

I know this isn't my thread but thanks alot guys thats really good stuff you've just given us there. I think ill promote the fact that im quailified in a certain single ply roofing system that not many people can install, maybe then that can lead to me being put forward for all of thier roofing work. Thanks again.

 

[Matthew_28]

I know this isn't my thread but thanks alot guys thats really good stuff you've just given us there. I think ill promote the fact that im quailified in a certain single ply roofing system that not many people can install, maybe then that can lead to me being put forward for all of thier roofing work. Thanks again.

good stuff, glad to be of assistance. sounds like you have yourself a USP (unique selling point). now try to promote and advertise the USP more to corner a share of that particular market, if you can turnover more work using the single ply membrane it's probably worthwhile focusing on this more and supplementing this income with slating, asphalt, lead works, and other roofing work (sorry if teaching you how to suck eggs! -I get a bit carried away sometimes). Cheers.

Regards

Matt

 

[Billmccallum]

Unless I missed something...one key person to contact in large building projects is the Architect...

I did some work with a large national charity and the building work was managed by the architect, who chose his preferred building contractors(people he had worked with and gave guaranteed pricing structures).

Although I (the project manager) could get the work done locally and cheaper, he insited on bringing a team from Manchester, but as the charity gave him control of the project nationally, I was not allowed to change things to match local conditions.

So there are opportunities from direct contact with architects.

 

[Matthew_28]

Unless I missed something...one key person to contact in large building projects is the Architect...

I did some work with a large national charity and the building work was managed by the architect, who chose his preferred building contractors(people he had worked with and gave guaranteed pricing structures).

Although I (the project manager) could get the work done locally and cheaper, he insited on bringing a team from Manchester, but as the charity gave him control of the project nationally, I was not allowed to change things to match local conditions.

So there are opportunities from direct contact with architects.

Definately. If you get in with the people who specify what products and systems will be used. Better if you can become a nominated or named contractor i.e. you're written into the specifications and named on all the tender documents, drawings etc.

 

[roofing solutions]

OK Tomorrow=Architects
Cheers

 

[GLASSFRAME]

Many thanks for all your replies, much appreciated!!

I guess its not what you know, but who you know!!

i`ll keep at it regarding the emails etc..

As i`m not really aiming at large building companies, i think i might have a go and write letters direstly to the M.D. ( WORTH A GO!! )
I will definelty mention that i was the person who worked on many specific projects on the past for them when i was employed..

As for my website, your right, i`d been think about changing the text myself..

Once again , cheers.. and good luck to roofing solutions..

Cheers, martin.

 

[kingsconstruction]

Glassframe - Give me a call on 07817 777 009 I know of 1700 glaziers that currently sub contract out & I know exactly what to say to them. Ive 20 years in the glass industry & worked for them all from the pilks to the greenburgs so call me & I'll even give you some contacts.

 

[benji19]

hi all this is my first blog i was hoping for some help an advice in a single ply roofer wit 8 years exp in tpo,pvc im fully qualified an a selfemployed subcontractor an thinking about starting my own business an want to get everythin in place before i go for tenders an small contracts their is alot of advice on hear that helps an was hoping for serious advice

kind reguards