Can anyone help me start up?

[Panky123]

Ok so I'm a 22 year old with no real experience in business fields or the field I wish to start a business in, so not a great start tbh
However, none the less I would like to give this a go

My idea...
I wish to purchase gaming machines (slots) and place them into pubs and clubs around my area, so I'm not thinking millions 'yet' just starting off with maybe 10-15 machines...

Reading up on gaming commissions site, I got slightly confused with the amount of licences that are need with the gambling community... I figured out that the category I need is C. Need an operating licence and perhaps maybe a personal management licence, as I won't actually have or need a premises of my own I'm hoping that's all I need
With this licence will I be able to place my machines into a pub without any other problems or costs?

With this I'm guessing with the licences annually will cost roughly 5k then cost of machines, am I correct in thinking this is all I need?

Thank you for your help

 

[Billmccallum]

Have you looked at the requirements for operating gaming machines????

Take a look here http://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/pdf/LCCP consolidated version - December 2011.pdf

 

[Panky123]

I did try to read this and others like it but for 44 pages of things I don't understand with constant different acts of 05 etc. kinda loses me abit, like I said I'm a complete novice so would love someone to dumb all these random laws, licences etc. down to me... I'm starting to get to grips with the different categories and licences then I click on another link and another 50+ pages pop up lol this is crazy for a business that's worth less than 10 grand lol

 

[Paul_Rosser]

I did try to read this and others like it but for 44 pages of things I don't understand with constant different acts of 05 etc. kinda loses me abit, like I said I'm a complete novice so would love someone to dumb all these random laws, licences etc. down to me... I'm starting to get to grips with the different categories and licences then I click on another link and another 50+ pages pop up lol this is crazy for a business that's worth less than 10 grand lol

Maybe you need to look at a different idea then as the laws and licences are very complex.

Or change the idea from fruit machines to retro video games.

 

[Billmccallum]

I did try to read this and others like it but for 44 pages of things I don't understand with constant different acts of 05 etc. kinda loses me abit, like I said I'm a complete novice so would love someone to dumb all these random laws, licences etc. down to me... I'm starting to get to grips with the different categories and licences then I click on another link and another 50+ pages pop up lol this is crazy for a business that's worth less than 10 grand lol

Running a gaming business will cost a great deal more than £10K, if that's your plan, takes Paul's advice.

 

[Fitness Bug]

Unfortunately you will have no joy with this, Unless it is a free house, All "tied" pubs have deals with certain companies to supply and service the machines.
So unless you can get into the many breweries who actually own the pubs then im afraid your out of luck.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news mate but thats the way it is, The same companies supply the juke box, gaming machines and pool tables, The brewery get a cut the landlord/tenant gets a tiny cut and the rest goes back to the supplier

Sorry

 

[Panky123]

Kiddiwinks - I have looked into the competition etc. and contracts with them and the pubs always run out sooner or later... Some of the pubs I've looked into don't even have pool tables, juke box or even a fruity...

Billmc - could you explain how it will cost more than 10k? Iv looked at the operating licence that will cost 4k annually, then the cost of a few machines... I don't understand how it will cost much more

This whole thread was purely out of curiosity... I havnt pushed money into any direction yet, I have looked at licences etc. I'm just asking people that may know more about this line or work for advice...
Me being a soldier I'm quite passionate about drinking and gambling lol and making money and I thought this would be fun

 

[businessfunding]

Kiddiwinks - I have looked into the competition etc. and contracts with them and the pubs always run out sooner or later... Some of the pubs I've looked into don't even have pool tables, juke box or even a fruity...

Billmc - could you explain how it will cost more than 10k? Iv looked at the operating licence that will cost 4k annually, then the cost of a few machines... I don't understand how it will cost much more

This whole thread was purely out of curiosity... I havnt pushed money into any direction yet, I have looked at licences etc. I'm just asking people that may know more about this line or work for advice...
Me being a soldier I'm quite passionate about drinking and gambling lol and making money and I thought this would be fun

The big question would be do they want a pool table, gaming machine or fruity? Many don't because it isn't the environment they wish to create.

Pool tables are particularly contentious because they take up space and can cause trouble (or to quote one publican 'not only do they encourage fights but they also arm the opponents')

For start-up costs think licences, insurance, transport, marketing and of course machines and stock of spares. You might get away with older technology in some free houses (or, as someone suggested retro table-top machines) but they will still pitch in over 1.,000 each and you will need a fair few out there to get a living.

 

[Billmccallum]

Billmc - could you explain how it will cost more than 10k? Iv looked at the operating licence that will cost 4k annually, then the cost of a few machines... I don't understand how it will cost much more

As already stated, a good machine will cost you £1000 each at a minimum, to make any money you will need at least 10 machines = £10,000.

Its a good guess that you dont have the technical skills to fix them, so a contract with a repair company will set you back a few £000's.

Add the cost of the licence and an income and the total bare minimum will be round £20,000, that's being optomistic, realistically probably more than £50K, thats before you make any money.

I appreciate its just an idea now, but be realistic in your goals, if you cant get near £50K, forget it, if you can't afford to lose that £50K dont even think about it.

 

[vvaannmmaann]

These people want £60k for a gaming machine business.
http://www.rightbiz.co.uk/buy_business/for_sale/86843_west_midlands.html
They are claiming an annual turn-over in the region of £100,000 per annum with a Gross Profit of £78,000 and Adjusted Net Profit £52,000.

 

[Panky123]

As already stated, a good machine will cost you £1000 each at a minimum, to make any money you will need at least 10 machines = £10,000.

Its a good guess that you dont have the technical skills to fix them, so a contract with a repair company will set you back a few £000's.

Add the cost of the licence and an income and the total bare minimum will be round £20,000, that's being optomistic, realistically probably more than £50K, thats before you make any money.

I appreciate its just an idea now, but be realistic in your goals, if you cant get near £50K, forget it, if you can't afford to lose that £50K dont even think about it.

massively appreciating the feedback you guys are throwing at me, and i appologise for maybe being a little bit thick

with that company that van man put up saying the business is worth 60k, that means the company is an already well built company with a number of machines and copntracts in the bank, also they are stating that they do pool tables and juke boxes...
this kinda shows me that i could possibly take off 2 thirds of the prices compared to the kinda of thing im wanting to get into, as im planning on purely fruit machines, i wont be using it as a pure business, more of a hobby/learning experience of the business market so a massive profit isnt exactly what im looking for, braking even or a slight profit would be grand, as the cost of knowledge is limitless...

i didnt really think of the concept of insurance or the contract of a repairman etc. abit naive of me yes.

however with my goal maybe the small town that i live in, i think i could possibly get it all started for not as much as you guys may think...

also with the £1,000 per machine, is it ilegal then to buy second hand machines say from ebay for a third of the price? iv seen second hand deal or no deal machines for £3-400 or am i being naive again?

but again thank you all for your patience helping me through this, your comments are teaching me than just purely reading up on the web

 

[Paul_Rosser]

also with the £1,000 per machine, is it ilegal then to buy second hand machines say from ebay for a third of the price? iv seen second hand deal or no deal machines for £3-400 or am i being naive again?

Yes you are, the machines sold on Ebay are either old so no pub will want them or faulty which will cost a lot to repair.

You also need to factor into your business plan who is going to look after the machines ? What happens if one develops a fault so keeps paying out jackpots etc ?

No venue is going to want a machine which doesn't work so you will need some sort of support network.

 

[simon field]

Panky, this must all be coming across a bit harsh mate, but it's only realism.

I cannot over-emphasize the importance of research, and lots of it. This is a fantastic forum for just that, but unfortunately I have to agree with the other posters on here, this is a non-starter - I'm sorry but it's either all sewn up or they don't want it in their pub.

Don't give up though, just adjust your plan

 

[Paul_Rosser]

If you really still think it's a good idea, then the first thing to do before you buy anything is to speak with pub landlords and see if they would like a fruit machine, or if they already have one.

That will at least give you some idea as to the marketplace you will be trying to sell into.

Just by doing a quick search you get tons of results on firms offering just this service and giving a 50/50 split with venues, or renting them a machine for very little where they take care of all the servicing, emptying etc.

 

[simon field]

I can see a time coming when it's just wither-spoons, or other big chains, with just a few good-food pubs and the odd survivor here and there from the old-school type of boozer I really can.

Clubs I have no idea about as I am 43!

Edit to add - my point being it's a dying market.

 

[Paul_Rosser]

I can see a time coming when it's just wither-spoons, or other big chains, with just a few good-food pubs and the odd survivor here and there from the old-school type of boozer I really can.

Clubs I have no idea about as I am 43!

Edit to add - my point being it's a dying market.

Depends on where you in, in busy places thats true but in country locations the local boozer doesn't do enough trade for the chains to want a piece of the action.

Where we live now there are 6 pubs, all independents ranging from the proper old school boozer up to the more a resturant with a bar kind.

 

[simon field]

Depends on where you in, in busy places thats true but in country locations the local boozer doesn't do enough trade for the chains to want a piece of the action.

Where we live now there are 6 pubs, all independents ranging from the proper old school boozer up to the more a resturant with a bar kind.

Right, come on family, we're moving to Essex!

I live on the outskirts of a medium sized town, with I'd guess 30 pubs within a 3 mile radius. The vast majority of them contain between 2 and 10 people most weeknights and I don't know how they can possibly do enough trade at the weekends to sustain that for long, especially since the aforementioned witheryspoons has set up pitch right in the middle of town (it's heaving in there)

It's almost as if some landlords just do it as a hobby :|

 

[Paul_Rosser]

Right, come on family, we're moving to Essex!

I live on the outskirts of a medium sized town, with I'd guess 30 pubs within a 3 mile radius. The vast majority of them contain between 2 and 10 people most weeknights and I don't know how they can possibly do enough trade at the weekends to sustain that for long, especially since the aforementioned witheryspoons has set up pitch right in the middle of town (it's heaving in there)

It's almost as if some landlords just do it as a hobby :|

We just moved from central London so it's quite nice change.

You do wonder how some pubs keep going, I guess for a lot the food trade pays much better than booze as the mark ups are a lot higher.

Personally I have nothing against Wetherspoons, however when I used to live in surrey they opened a pub near to 5 others, everyone went there as they were the cheapest. The 5 others closed down and Wetherspoons have now put their prices right up.

 

[simon field]

We just moved from central London so it's quite nice change.

You do wonder how some pubs keep going, I guess for a lot the food trade pays much better than booze as the mark ups are a lot higher.

Personally I have nothing against Wetherspoons, however when I used to live in surrey they opened a pub near to 5 others, everyone went there as they were the cheapest. The 5 others closed down and Wetherspoons have now put their prices right up.

Brilliant business, but soulless pubs.

 

[Panky123]

If you really still think it's a good idea, then the first thing to do before you buy anything is to speak with pub landlords and see if they would like a fruit machine, or if they already have one.

That will at least give you some idea as to the marketplace you will be trying to sell into.

Just by doing a quick search you get tons of results on firms offering just this service and giving a 50/50 split with venues, or renting them a machine for very little where they take care of all the servicing, emptying etc.

Like I said before this is all in the research phase, and if gained a lot more info than I asked for from this forum 'good thing not bad'

I have still got to go round the pubs etc. round my town for some in house research, but with my town I got 2 clubs and a weather spoons, which I won't even bother going near, but there are 14 local old school pubs within a 2 mile radius and being in east Anglian, so many village pubs etc its unreal...
I've spoken to 2 of my friends that own the pubs and they said when the contract is up for renewal in November they would be happy to sort me out, but 2 pubs isn't quite enough to brake even with all the costs otherwise so more on the ground research is definitely needed...

ATM I'm just learning what it is about owning a business and laws, licences etc. needed.

 

[simon field]

Where in East Anglia are you?

 

[Panky123]

Where in East Anglia are you?

Suffolk so plenty of village pubs lol

 

[Panky123]

I have been told by my friend while we were talking about this idea and he said about being taxed on each machine... He said that tax is £2,500 per machine per year? Is this true??