Beware of the Dog!

[deniser]

I haven't quite decided how to deal with this yet (will get the advice of Consumer Direct) but has anyone had a situation where the postman left a package in someone's garden, their own dog then chewed it and the customer is asking for compensation from the sender?

 

[roydmoorian]

Tell them to claim on their own insurance and use the money to buy another item from you...

 

[antp__]

Not quite, however I did order high value computer equipment once and the DHL driver decided to leave it on my doorstep. Not only could it have been taken, but it rained. And the rain was torrential. Luckily nothing was damaged, how I do not know as the boxes were ruined. Compensation given? None.

I did phone to complain and ask why they didn't leave it next door or even take it back to the local depot as they usually do. They had no idea why the driver did what he did an apparently gave him a 'disciplinary'. However i'll eat my hat if that actually happened.

I know this doesn't really help your situation, however thought I would give my input.

 

[deniser]

Thanks for this. Buyer has tried to file a claim with RM but they say only the sender can claim. We use contract post so have no rights to compensation. It looks as though I will have to replace the goods. Grrr.

 

[roydmoorian]

Tell the buyer to take the value out of his dog's wages

 

[Novevan]

I think it is not your fail.
The postman and his company should take this responsibility.

 

[Bill1954]

We had something similar last year whena courier left an expensive motherboard in the recycle bin while we were out. He left a note telling us where it was, but, what he didn't know was that the recycle bin was due to be emptied that day and the parcel was gone!
The retailer sent us a replacement without question and claimed on the couriers insurrance.

 

[Novevan]

We had something similar last year whena courier left an expensive motherboard in the recycle bin while we were out. He left a note telling us where it was, but, what he didn't know was that the recycle bin was due to be emptied that day and the parcel was gone!
The retailer sent us a replacement without question and claimed on the couriers insurrance.

Correct, it is the couriers' fail. They should compensate it.

 

[deniser]

The RM won't pay any compensation.

 

[japancool]

I imagine the sticking point would be whether the customer asked for it to be left there, and whether or not the parcel was in their possession when the dog chewed it.

 

[roydmoorian]

I wonder if the customer has been warned about his/her dog by Royal Mail before?

http://www.royalmailgroup.com/customers/customer-commitment/preventing-dog-attacks


Top tips for dog owners

Even the most lovable dog can be a danger to postal staff. Dogs are territorial by nature and if they feel they need to protect their family, they can become unpredictable.


Here are some ideas to help your postmen and women deliver your mail in safety:

• Ensure your dog is out of the way before the postman or woman arrives. Place your pet in the back garden or a faraway room.
• If you have a back garden, please close off the access, in case your dog could get round to the front when the postman calls.
• Dog attacks can happen when you’ve opened the door to sign for an item. Please keep your dog in another room before answering the door and make sure children don’t open the door, as dogs can push by them and attack.
• Give your dog some food or a toy to occupy them while your mail is being delivered.
• Wait 10 minutes after your mail has arrived to let your pet back into your hallway. Keep everything as calm and low-key as possible.
• If your dog likes to attack your mail consider installing a wire letter receptacle. It will protect your post, and your postman’s fingers.
• If it’s not practical for you to keep your dog away from a postman delivering your mail, please consider fitting a secure mailbox on the edge of your property
• Please make sure your dog is microchipped, wearing a collar and that both sets of details are kept up to date.

As far as compenstaing the customer for the behavior of his own dog ..Tell him to go swivel (politely but firmly, of course)

If you still feel like replacing the item then make sure you use a signed for service next time...

 

[antp__]

It's a real tough one this and i'd like to keep an eye on how you end up dealing with it if you dont mind keeping us up to date.

I take it you didn't leave any special instructions on where to leave it? It may be worth them phoning their local depot to find out who was delivering that day.

You wouldn't expect a paper boy to deliver your paper and be able to storm down the shop and have another free one because your dog ruined the first.

 

[JamieM]

If it was me I would replace it. It's unfortunate and annoying but at the end of the day it's your responsibility to ensure the order is delivered safely to the customer and in this case it wasn't.

 

[antp__]

If it was me I would replace it. It's unfortunate and annoying but at the end of the day it's your responsibility to ensure the order is delivered safely to the customer and in this case it wasn't.

Again though, it's a difficult one because it could have been delivered safely. Without the item being sent signed for, if it's left the RM it's delivered. It isn't the sellers fault the postman left it somewhere nor should he have known they had a dog that liked to chew up their post. The item, as far as we are concerned was left in a place on their property, undamaged. The customer has then obviously said their dog has destroyed the goods and wish for compensation.

The customer could have said the item was delivered damaged, which would be a different matter. But for them to say their dog has chewed it up is surely a different matter altogether?

 

[kulture]

The basic fact is that the retailer has to compensate. They failed in their contract with the buyer. They failed to deliver the order in good condition.The Royal Mail was their chosen agent and the buyer has no contract with the Royal Mail.

 

[roydmoorian]

You did everything in your power to deliver the item successfully to your customer's premises. If the customer's child had destroyed the item would you replace it ? No of course not. It is probably not worth going to court over but a judge would find in your favour.

 

[Anonymouse72]

Thanks for this. Buyer has tried to file a claim with RM but they say only the sender can claim. We use contract post so have no rights to compensation. It looks as though I will have to replace the goods. Grrr.

Denise has already explained that she can't claim from RM as contract post & will replace.

so as Kulture already stated above.

 

[JamieM]

You did everything in your power to deliver the item successfully to your customer's premises. If the customer's child had destroyed the item would you replace it ? No of course not. It is probably not worth going to court over but a judge would find in your favour.

It really doesn't matter what happened to it, if it was a child, a dog, someone else's dog, the wind blew it away etc etc. If it wasn't safely delivered then it's Denise's responsibility. Ordinarily she could try to claim from Royal Mail but they don't offer compensation on her account services.

 

[antp__]

Had the customer said the item was delivered damaged I would treat this differently. However, as she said her dog chewed it up, I would go as far as saying up until this point it was delivered safely.

 

[JamieM]

Had the customer said the item was delivered damaged I would treat this differently. However, as she said her dog chewed it up, I would go as far as saying up until this point it was delivered safely.

Leaving a parcel in the garden is not delivering it safely.

Edit: It's Royal Mail's or the customers fault for maybe telling Royal Mail they can leave parcels outside, but that is irrelevant. It's still Denise's responsibility.

 

[Beautycoll Ltd]

Risk of damage to, or loss of, any goods will pass to the consumer when the goods are delivered to them.

Now the hard bit is deciding if RM leaving the parcel where they did can be classed as the item being delivered.

 

[antp__]

I would still argue the toss.

Denise did not leave special instructions to leave it in the garden (I'm hoping), so the postman and in turn Royal Mail have taken this upon themselves.

The item was delivered to the correct address and Let's say within estimated time scale. The customer did not declare it damaged, so as far as I would be concerned the item was delivered, albeit left in a safe location, undamaged. It was only when their dog got out, found it and chewed it up was it then brought to light to the seller. The buyer has openly admitted their dog ruined it. That would be enough for me.

Had it gone next door and their dog ruined it, it would then be down to your neighbour to replace it. Not the seller. Royal mail don't usually leave parcels outside as there is usually a close local depot, unless told otherwise. Or at least that is what mine do which is frustrating at times!

 

[Beautycoll Ltd]

The definition of "deliver" is "Bring and hand over (a letter, parcel or goods) to the proper recipient or address".

I'd still be pissed having to ship out a replacement and would argue that RM are at fault as they did not carry out their contract with the seller, The seller would still have to compensate the customer and claim losses from RM.

 

[antp__]

And it was delivered and 'left in a safe location' at the correct address.
I know... We can argue that it wasn't a safe location.

Who is to say the customer didn't pick it up, take it inside then the dog ruined it. They aren't going to go that far into it and there is no way of proving it either way.

My point here is the customer openly admitted it was their dogs fault. Not the delivery aspect of things? I know what they are saying, had it not been left in the garden the dog wouldn't have had it. So why not just claim the item damaged? Which then leads me to believe the customer had it in their possession before the dog ruined it. No proof either way I know.

Let's base it on the fact Denise has now sent a replacement. So let's change the scenario a little.

The item was small enough to fit through the letterbox. The buyer was out and again, the dog chewed it up. What now? The item wasn't handed over to the home owner.

 

[roydmoorian]

This, like many other delivery problems, could have been prevented by using a "signature only" service. But the sender made the trade off between cost and efficiency prompted by the price they believed that the seller was prepared to pay - was the buyer given the choice of a "signature only" service in the first instance ?

 

[beasty]

It is not delivered unless you specifically say LEAVE IN THE GARDEN

If you did not say this then leaving in the garden is not acceptable

The fault is with the carrier

RM are fkn useless to claim from, i never bother, too time consuming, then they want to send you 50quids worth of stamps!

If you spend a lot with them, i would tell them, business is going elsewhere, i spend x and i expect a call from someone with authority to do something

Abandoning a parcel is hardly delivery, is that 1st class service?
2ND CLASS? You just chuck them from the van as you roll down the road?


You might get 60 quids worth of stamps

No way the customer should lose here, he ordered, paid and it was left in a position where it was destroyed, yes it was his dog, could just as easily be a neighbours cat so the delivery was not adequate

 

[deniser]

I was just thinking that if the RM had put it through the letterbox and the dog had been inside the house, the parcel would have got chewed as well.

Anyway, it has been an interesting discussion thank you! The strange outcome was that the customer eventually said that it wasn't our fault - and was willing to accept the item as chewed! I was also willing to send a replacement or cover the repair costs but she hasn't asked for that.

You win some, you lose some!

 

[SamStones]

I did actually have this situation with a different courier a few years back. The customer returned home to find that their dog had chewed the item. On reviewing their cctv footage they found the delivery driver had dangled the item ober the gate and taunted the dog with it before dropping the item into the garden where the dog subsequently chewed it. In my case the buyer admitted it wasn't our fault but did say they would contact the delivery company themselves.