Back Up

[TelesMedia]

Hi All,

Perhaps someone can answer this for me.

Our IT company have set us up with an online backup attached to our server. When i ask them to prove they have everything backed-up they want to be able to access the server and PCs. My thoughts are if the server was stolen then surely they can access the back up without the need of going into the server?

This has come about as i asked for emails i purposely deleted on 1 pc to be reinstalled but he wants to access that PC to do it. My argument is surely he shouldnt need to access it - for example if it was stolen he couldnt. Also we are not given access to anything which again if he disappeared i cant get to our data.

Anyone who can clear up would be great.

Thanks

 

[Alcom IT]

You're absolutely correct. A properly instated cloud backup system will allow you to access the backups and restore what you need without access to the computer itself. Exactly for the reason you state, what if the machine dies or is stolen?

There definitely should be a portal you can access as the client too. Most cloud backup systems have an IT Guy login to manage all their clients in one place and a client login where you can manage your own backups without seeing other clients backups.

In their defence though, often it's faster and easier just to find the file in the Recycle Bin or email from the Deleted Items folder. Our techs will often try that first and then restore the main backup if that fails.

Perhaps they are just trying that first?

My advice, talk to your IT company and express your concerns. Often it's just their procedure and a misunderstanding. Give them a sensible time scale to reply - maybe a day or two. If they don't supply you with what you need to feel safe then maybe it's time to consider switching IT companies.

 

[forevergroup]

The 3-2-1 backup rule recommended by Veeam is as follows:

Three copies of your data
Two onsite
One offsite

It doesn’t sound like they have offsite/cloud backup if they need to check on-site.

Or, they are using a local-centric backup solution (like Macrium) and then replicating the backups to cheap cloud storage.

How do they know if backups fail? Sounds like they could fail for weeks and no one would know (unless they log in to check daily by hand).

The equally big problem with this scenario is likely to be, even if completed backups have successfully been taken offsite, is actually recovery.

We saw an IT environment where the ‘IT company’ (their website developer) were quoting Livedrive to hold the offsite backups. But with users reporting very slow transfer speeds with Livedrive…. If it takes weeks to recover the data in a disaster scenario, what’s the point?

There is little point addressing the problem with the incumbent IT provider, because you’ve already observed the shortcomings of the solution they have elected to put in place and alarm bells have duly rung.

All I can say is, all of the backup solutions we use offer both local-and-cloud backup and are managed and visible from the cloud - not on-site. Likewise, we specialise in co-managed environments working alongside internal IT staff and sometimes full IT teams, so I can also confirm that it is very much possible to provide visibility and backup completion alerts to end customers.

I hate to say it but if you feel that is any possibility in this day and age that your IT provider has left you without cloud/offsite backup or they may be using a cobbled together solution with on-premises backup and third-party online storage, then it may be worth getting an audit from a third party IT provider. There may be other IT/security issues with your environment also.

 

[gpietersz]

I suggest you get them (or someone else) to do offsite backups to a service where you own the account. That makes you independent of them if they let you down or you have a dispute with them.

It will also mean you can see what is backed up.

I am not sure about PCs (at least not Windows ones), but for servers I would sign up with a service like Backblaze B2 (good pricing) or rsync.net (very good, but a bit expensive) and get them to backup there, and make sure you have enough files to see what has been backed up.

Just to be clear, those are two services I like. I am not saying there is anything wrong with others, or even DIY at another location.

 

[Nico Albrecht]

Nothing in your question makes sense ( what has email hosting to do with your server ) I doubt you running an on site email server here based on your question.

Also, I'm surprised some on here even entertain this kind of question without having a full understand of the full setup.

To restore a couple deleted emails in a live system this would definitely require local access to the machine as both email local + cloud data base would need to be merged or the cloud copy needs to be extracted for the missing emails and added into a live system without removing or loosing newer emails.

What seems like a simple task is actually not that easy to do.

I would always start the cloud restore from a local machine back to it first. Everything else would be a nightmare to do and much more costly.

But without even having any information about the IT infrastructure such as who hosts the emails and what email client is being used this is pure guess work.

I would be more concerned if the cloud backup could be pushed out back to the computer without even confirming such action on the PC itself.

 

[clyde123]

I ended up going back to the original post and re-reading.
You asked "emails i purposely deleted on 1 pc to be reinstalled". Surely that requires access to that PC to send the data back to it?
Maybe I'm mis reading the problem.

I upvoted @gpietersz for the suggestion of using Backblaze B2. Not expensive. You could well have a backup account on there, and both you and your support company could have the password for access.

Finally, again on re-reading, I'm wondering what sort of proof you're looking for that everything is backed up. Are you able to clarify a bit about what you want to see?

 

[forevergroup]

Surely that requires access to that PC to send the data back to it?
Maybe I'm mis reading the problem.

I'm wondering what sort of proof you're looking for that everything is backed up.

Backups for Microsoft 365 for example, are cloud-to-cloud, so restoring the data to the original cloud environment would also restore to synchronised devices e.g. PC, Webmail, and mobile.

Cloud backup solutions will also display record of completed backups and some may also send email confirmation on completion.

Attempting a recovery will also display and verify what data has actually been backed up.

The sad truth is, I’ve seen some awful backup solutions from third party IT providers we’ve inherited (I’m sure Abe @ Alcom has too) so if OP has concerns he really should have an independent review. The consequences are just too severe.

As above, OP really needs to seek professional advice from an independent provider. I’m sure there are other companies local to him that will take a look for free. It will take five minutes for them to assess if the solution is ‘fit for purpose’ or not.

 

[gpietersz]

But without even having any information about the IT infrastructure such as who hosts the emails and what email client is being used this is pure guess work.

You are enitrely right. The answers the rest of us have given make assumpations or are very generic.

 

[TelesMedia]

Nothing in your question makes sense ( what has email hosting to do with your server ) I doubt you running an on site email server here based on your question.

Also, I'm surprised some on here even entertain this kind of question without having a full understand of the full setup.

To restore a couple deleted emails in a live system this would definitely require local access to the machine as both email local + cloud data base would need to be merged or the cloud copy needs to be extracted for the missing emails and added into a live system without removing or loosing newer emails.

What seems like a simple task is actually not that easy to do.

I would always start the cloud restore from a local machine back to it first. Everything else would be a nightmare to do and much more costly.

But without even having any information about the IT infrastructure such as who hosts the emails and what email client is being used this is pure guess work.

I would be more concerned if the cloud backup could be pushed out back to the computer without even confirming such action on the PC itself.

Nico, everyone else seemed to understand and the answers they provided me with are relevant to what i have asked. Thanks anyway.

 

[TelesMedia]

Thanks all - some great answers there for me to move forward with and i will check out backblaze.

 

[AW-UK]

You should be able to say to whoever runs / controls your backup "I need to recover <insert path here>/document123.docx" for example and they give you either by putting in a temp folder on the server or via email that document from the last backup, or "I need to recover the finance folder from Tom Smith's email account" and they send you that folder or put it into your email folders for you, in some cases they can attach a folder as a shared folder to your email account, depends on the backup system etc. Only if they are trying to recover files from an individual PC should they need to access it, as for email, if it is IMAP based then it is all server unless you download them specifically they can't be recovered from the users PC.