Accounting Software? - Construction CIS? VAT?

[Gareth83]

Hi

New start up as Ltd Company, looking for an accounting software package that deals with both CIS, VAT and ideally PAYE for just myself but not essential.

I have been using freeagent for last month but it just doesn't handle CIS very well, bank account doesn't link properly. Simply not impressed.

I was thinking quickbooks essentials but wondering what else is out there? All my work is subcontractor based so ease of CIS is a big factor.

Thanks

 

[Somos Accounting]

Whilst I cannot vouch for Quickbooks (as I don’t use),
I’d recommend you have a look at Xero.

It will deal with PAYE, VAT and the CIS elements you need.

As a subcontractor you shouldn’t need the extra “CIS” module (will be an extra cost from Mar 20) either as the standard CIS features will calculate deductions withheld.

You shouldn’t have a problem either with bank feeds, and you can set up rules to make reconciling the bank easy.

They offer a free 30 day trial too, but worth checking in with your accountant (if you have one) if they recommend/work with it and to make sure it’s all set up correctly.

Hope this helps.

 

[Gareth83]

Many thanks, my accountant uses and recommends quickbooks but I like to use alternatives to mainstream, I have set up a trial of quickbooks but it seems very sluggish and quite clunky.

Freeagent was simpler to use and seemed more user friendly.

Waht about accountsportal or quickfile which seem recommended on here?

 

[Somos Accounting]

Many thanks, my accountant uses and recommends quickbooks but I like to use alternatives to mainstream, I have set up a trial of quickbooks but it seems very sluggish and quite clunky.

Freeagent was simpler to use and seemed more user friendl

Waht about accountsportal or quickfile which seem recommended on here?

I don't use Quickbooks for that reason and hence chose to work with Xero. I also work with FreeAgent and agree this is simple to use and user-friendly but does differ to the functionality of Xero/others.

Some accountants will work with a range, some recommend only one piece of software. For me, it's having a choice but not too many different options, as you can't possibly know each one really well.

Can't vouch for those either I'm afraid, as I don't use, but a lot of accountants and users recommend. I guess it's down to personal preference, what works for your business and the cost. I see AccountsPortal offer a free trial and QuickFile is free for the smallest businesses. Take a demo and see what they're like.

Personally, I advise my clients based on their specific business needs but encourage them to get set up on a trial and do some training, to make sure it's a good fit for them.

 

[Gareth83]

As an update, we've now been trading for almost 6 months and have already turned over 6 figures. As we are both acting as contractor and a sub-contractor Freegaent simply doesn't handle CIS in this scenario at all. The work around they have is fine if you're either a contractor or sub-contractor but if you're both like us then it is terrible

I have spoken with Freeagent several times and they have said I need to simply use another service and then do journal entries.... Not sure if that just complexes matter even further?

My accountant has recommended Moneysoft or bite the bullet and get an all in system like Quickbooks

I have downloaded trial version of Moneysoft which looks simple but not sure if it's just doubling up work.

Any up to date recommendations or tips?

 

[justintime]

Moneysoft is fine for handling subcontractor payments and calculating cis suffered but you will need another program to handle the accounting side.

Clearbooks may be a suitable option. They have a CIS module built in so may be worth looking at and combine the CIS and accounting functions.

https://www.clearbooks.co.uk/construction-industry-scheme/

I've never used it myself, as I use Moneysoft and VT+ for a similar client. VT+ will handle what you're doing quite well but you will need Moneysoft or similar CIS module as well.

 

[Gareth83]

Looks interesting although a lot more expensive than freeagent which I am using albeit it doesn't do CIS but does do payroll

Moneysoft with Freeagent could be a good option. Any idea how I would combine them both without duplicating things?

 

[justintime]

I haven't used Freeagent but you would do all your CIS calcs in Moneysoft then use Freeagent to do the accounting transactions (does require a bit of bookkeeping knowledge though)

Having said that I have just looked at Freeagent help and it does handle CIS on both sides.. Is it the case you can either be a contractor to your subbies or a subcontractor to your main contractor, but not both?

If so I would choose to be the contractor so that you can use Freeagent to handle the subbies, and simply set your main contractor as a customer. When the contractor pays you you will be 20% short and all you need to do is raise a credit note coded to creditors tax and NI. That way you won't need Moneysoft.

This will create a surplus in the Creditors/NI but that's fine. When you claim your CIS rebate code it to there.

 

[Gareth83]

It does handle CIS but not very well from what I've seen:

If I use it as my company being the sub-contractor and my customer is the contractor then it's fine as it seems to be pulling through the deductions via RTI across to HMRC when I run payroll and at a glance I can see the amount deducted easily on the balance sheet in the report section. I guess I need to be checking the contractor is actually paying this to HMRC, how does one do this?

If I use it as my company being the contractor and that my suppliers are the sub-contractors the the guide here explains how to do it:

This sounds straightforward but I then have to go on HMRC website, submit everything manually on there as there is no way to export a summary in Freeagent so takes ages particularly when a subbie may have 7 or 8 invoices for the month. I then have to transfer everything over to an excel template to create CIS deduction statements.... One for each subbie, every month. This is taking up more time than it should

I also don't think Freeagent caters for just being a contractor for terms of CIS:

So I think the best way logically is to:

1. Use Freeagent to create invoices to my customer ie. the contractor - this then gives me the option to add CIS amount to labour etc. and will then get pulled through via HMRC. Do I then need to check the contractor are actually paying this deduction? If so how?

2. Use Moneysoft to handle CIS for subcontractors. at least this will send information to HMRC, I can run reports for the subbies to give statements etc. at the click of a button etc etc.

My main question is do I then still enter the subbie invoice into Freeagent also or do I export from Moneysoft or something? Or are they kept separate? Basically how do you inetgrate them without duplicating? perhaps this is one where paying extra for Quickbooks or Xero to do everything would be better.....

 

[Scalloway]

From my recollection of Moneysoft you would need to enter the invoice separately in each system.

 

[Gareth83]

Yeah that's fine

I guess in moneysoft though, all I'm doing is entering the details to generate the deduction amounts and feed the hmrc? It's not going to be like accounting package where I need to record payments in here also and check they match etc etc. I'm just using moneysoft to simply calculate and send amount to hmrc

As freeagent would manage a bill as follows :

1. Bill paid direct from bank account
2. CIS deduction element paid from a 'fictitious NI/PAYE' account

When the amount is actually paid to HMRC, I guess I just net that off

I'll check with freeagent if that works as their 'workaround article' just simply duplicates everything and no way to check figures balance etc

Having