Accountant advice needed for locum doctor.

[Moejoe]

Hello all,

My I first say i've been reading up on this forum for the past few weeks and have found it an excellent resource to getting my head around setting up a Ltd company in my quest to work as a locum doctor for the next year.I do have a few questions as the emphasis always seems to be on starting right from the get go.

My wife and I are moving over to the UK, it will my first time working there while she worked for two years in the past, we will both be working as locum doctors. To ease the transition of our family, i'll be moving over myself initially and they will catch up in November.

1. I have read lots on the setup of a Ltd company with a director and your spouse being a paid secretary of the company, however both of us will be working as locums, what is the optimum arrangement in terms of what type of company to set up, share structure and dividends/salary.
   
2. With regards to share structure it would seem beneficial to spread the wealth, is their any limitation to who can be a share holder; I have two young daughters , can i list them as share holders?
   
3. Since my wife will not be physically residing with me in the UK for the next couple of months it will probably be simpler for me to set up alone (or is it?), should I start off with a ltd company 'alone' or should i settle for something like an umbrella solution for the time being, will this affect our future setup in anyway?
   
4. Finally, most accountants seemed to be geared towards IT contractors, i've had a look at the website of Association of independent specialist medical accountants , is there much benefit of going for one of these guys with our 'simple' operation (were not exactly a GP practice) or are all the rules similar with all contractual work, is it the case that any contractor accountant will do? My biggest headache is trying to pick a proactive accountant who is there for you, not interested in huge accountancy firms that don't know you exist, would love a personal one on one service with the same person.

Thank you for reading through my lengthly post, and I'd appreciate your views on these issues.

Moe

 

[AccountancyStudent]

which area will you be living in?
have you asked the firms which will be helping you get locum work for advice? (or will you try not doing it via an agency?)

 

[Moejoe]

which area will you be living in?
have you asked the firms which will be helping you get locum work for advice? (or will you try not doing it via an agency?)

Probably the outskirts of London, maybe milton keynes, St Albans, or Essex.

All they do is recommend a firm for accountancy issues

 

[Bob]

Probably the outskirts of London, maybe milton keynes, St Albans, or Essex.

All they do is recommend a firm for accountancy issues

I would certainly speak to someone from AISMA initially. You can find a local one here

 

[Moejoe]

I would certainly speak to someone from AISMA initially. You can find a local one

Thanks, will contact a few of them from the site

 

[Dawn Lane]

Hello all,

My I first say i've been reading up on this forum for the past few weeks and have found it an excellent resource to getting my head around setting up a Ltd company in my quest to work as a locum doctor for the next year.I do have a few questions as the emphasis always seems to be on starting right from the get go.

My wife and I are moving over to the UK, it will my first time working there while she worked for two years in the past, we will both be working as locum doctors. To ease the transition of our family, i'll be moving over myself initially and they will catch up in November.

1. I have read lots on the setup of a Ltd company with a director and your spouse being a paid secretary of the company, however both of us will be working as locums, what is the optimum arrangement in terms of what type of company to set up, share structure and dividends/salary.
   
2. With regards to share structure it would seem beneficial to spread the wealth, is their any limitation to who can be a share holder; I have two young daughters , can i list them as share holders?
   
3. Since my wife will not be physically residing with me in the UK for the next couple of months it will probably be simpler for me to set up alone (or is it?), should I start off with a ltd company 'alone' or should i settle for something like an umbrella solution for the time being, will this affect our future setup in anyway?
   
4. Finally, most accountants seemed to be geared towards IT contractors, i've had a look at the website of Association of independent specialist medical accountants , is there much benefit of going for one of these guys with our 'simple' operation (were not exactly a GP practice) or are all the rules similar with all contractual work, is it the case that any contractor accountant will do? My biggest headache is trying to pick a proactive accountant who is there for you, not interested in huge accountancy firms that don't know you exist, would love a personal one on one service with the same person.

Thank you for reading through my lengthly post, and I'd appreciate your views on these issues.

Moe

I work as a Virtual Assistant with a client who runs an agency for locum doctors (providing GP services to the Armed Forces).

As far as I am aware, the majority of our doctors are not set up as limited companies but work as self-employed sole traders. If you would like some info/discuss with one of our doctors what they do/how they are set up, pm me with your email address and I can ask one of them to contact you to discuss.

Dawn

 

[Homshaw]

As far as I am aware, the majority of our doctors are not set up as limited companies but work as self-employed sole traders.

Dawn

Most agencies insist on you being a limited company the reason being it puts the IR35 risk on to you. If you are a sole trader it rests with them.

You will probably need to set up a Limited Company or go PAYE to get work. I would look at the PCG website to understand the issues.

 

[MrPAYE]

Most agencies insist on you being a limited company the reason being it puts the IR35 risk on to you. If you are a sole trader it rests with them.

You will probably need to set up a Limited Company or go PAYE to get work. I would look at the PCG website to understand the issues.

Agree with this. One thing though, there are specific issues to consider with locums around IR35 and I doubt very much that the PCG website will be of much use given that 99% of it is aimed at IT consultants.

 

[Moejoe]

I work as a Virtual Assistant with a client who runs an agency for locum doctors (providing GP services to the Armed Forces).

As far as I am aware, the majority of our doctors are not set up as limited companies but work as self-employed sole traders. If you would like some info/discuss with one of our doctors what they do/how they are set up, pm me with your email address and I can ask one of them to contact you to discuss.

Dawn

Dawn, thanks for offering the help, thats the first i've heard of doctors working as sole traders, PM sent with email

 

[Moejoe]

Agree with this. One thing though, there are specific issues to consider with locums around IR35 and I doubt very much that the PCG website will be of much use given that 99% of it is aimed at IT consultants.

Homshaw, thank you for drawing my attention to this important issue. I had a look at the website , useful, but like most contractor based websites (as MrPAYE mentioned) aimed at IT.

I don't wanna open up pandoras box here, but i'd hate to follow covention start up the company and have HMRC knockin at my door a few months later, does anybody here know if locums are hit by IR35?

 

[Homshaw]

I don't wanna open up pandoras box here, but i'd hate to follow covention start up the company and have HMRC knockin at my door a few months later, does anybody here know if locums are hit by IR35?

Locums are no different to anyone else and could be challenged under IR35. You need an IR35 compliant contract and a working method that suggests self-employment or you are taking a risk.

There are big benefits to your tax bill in working via a Limited Company but the big risks are being challenged on IR35 and income splitting

My clients are mainly Engineering Contractors. I would e-mail PCG and ask them if they have locum and what issues face them and how does PCG help them if at all

 

[MrPAYE]

I have experience in this area, both acting for the locums and the NHS.

It all depends on what the locum is doing and for whom whether IR35 is a real issue or not. The biggest problem is consultants doing operations.

I've not volunteered my services to date as I don't get involved in all the stuff you mentioned in your original post but if you need specific IR35 related advice, happy to discuss terms etc offline.

 

[Moejoe]

You need an IR35 compliant contract and a working method that suggests self-employment or you are taking a risk.

Interesting, so i know you can't get into specifics, but what are the general/ballpark guidlines to being IR 35 compliant in terms of contract and employment?

Thanks for the tip, will email the PCG website.

 

[MrPAYE]

Interesting, so i know you can't get into specifics, but what are the general/ballpark guidlines to being IR 35 compliant in terms of contract and employment?

Thanks for the tip, will email the PCG website.

I know this question was directed at Homshaw but nevertheless the main point you need to be absolutely clear about is whatever contract you have in place MUST accurately reflect how you actually do the work, i.e, if you devise a contract that is "IR35 compliant" but it's nothing like what happens in practice, HMRC will simply discard the contract when reviewing your IR35 position.

You need proper advice on this not hints and tips from a forum. I doubt whether PCG will have practical experience of locums and the specific work that they do and the specific areas where HMRC target, etc. Happy to be proved wrong though

 

[Moejoe]

I know this question was directed at Homshaw but nevertheless the main point you need to be absolutely clear about is whatever contract you have in place MUST accurately reflect how you actually do the work, i.e, if you devise a contract that is "IR35 compliant" but it's nothing like what happens in practice, HMRC will simply discard the contract when reviewing your IR35 position.

You need proper advice on this not hints and tips from a forum. I doubt whether PCG will have practical experience of locums and the specific work that they do and the specific areas where HMRC target, etc. Happy to be proved wrong though

Thanks Mr. PAYE, PM sent:redface:

 

[Homshaw]

The contract is just a starting point but if the contract isn't right it isn't a good start

I've read articles where people suggest you should not wear staff badges, use the staff car park or the canteen unless it is open to the public etc.
The list goes on and on.

In reality I've worked places where Contractors have had Career Development Reviews, gone to staff parties and been treated in a way which would put them in a poor position

The reason I encourage my clients to join PCG is the cost is reasonable. it provides legal support if challenged. It provdes a service where contracts can be vetted and if accepted as IR35 compliant can then be insured. I believe this is via Abbey Tax. If there is a better alternative which provides a better level of support I'd be interested to know about it. I have a number of Limited company contractors. None of them are in IT

The whole point is to put youself in a position where you not an easy target. The unacceptable bit of it is there are large sums of money at stake and the area is far from black and white which to me makes it unfair

Dave Cameron did undertake to look at the area but it's hard to predict what he will come up with

 

[mauricem]

Hello Colleagues

I am a locum doctor and have been a freelancer for the last five years. I think that the PCG website advice on "how to start up as a freelancer", says it all. I was lucky in that after finding myself in yet another minefield, the other year - a friend told me about PCG.

One call to their helpline can more than repay the membership fee.

It seems to me that every day more and more people are becoming freelancers and that the same issues & challenges face everyone re; the changing world of work. With regard to an Accountant maybe that is actually a personal choice ? is human rapport required ? or, are you happy with a computer screen interface. I suggest a few emails and phone calls might help you identify the firm for you.