Accounts filing software

[Gill Courage]

I am up against an end-of-the-month deadline for CT filing. I have always done my own filing (had an accountant prep the accounts) but now I find I cannot because we have some currency transactions this year. Can anyone recommend some software to do this? I won't bore you with the story of why I am so late with this but it involves illness and death and I am pretty frazzled right now. I've had a quote of £900 to do the filing for me but I have already paid for the accounts to be prepared and we made a loss this year, so I'm trying to keep exes to a minimum.

 

[Gill Courage]

And now, having spoken to a software provider I don't understand the restrtiction.......all my numbers are in GBP. Everything is converted at the HMRC "rate of the month" and no actual currency numbers are going to be reported to HMRC.

 

[Daybooks]

I presume it is the accounts production software you are referring to and not the bookkeeping software. Either way you are right in that you enter all figures in sterling. Some bookkeeping software will allow you to enter the transaction in a foreign currency and convert to sterling - but nevertheless you could still enter all in sterling. The output accounts that you want to generate to pass into any accounts production software would be in sterling at this time.

It sounds like whoever you are speaking to isn’t understanding your requirement. You seem to be trying to solve a problem that doesn’t exist.

If not please explain in more detail.

 

[Tables Force]

I am up against an end-of-the-month deadline for CT filing. I have always done my own filing (had an accountant prep the accounts) but now I find I cannot because we have some currency transactions this year. Can anyone recommend some software to do this? I won't bore you with the story of why I am so late with this but it involves illness and death and I am pretty frazzled right now. I've had a quote of £900 to do the filing for me but I have already paid for the accounts to be prepared and we made a loss this year, so I'm trying to keep exes to a minimum.

Why not ask whoever prepared the accounts to just press the button to do the filing?

[Not really sure why you would pay someone to prepare them, but not file - the bulk of the work is in preparing the accounts, not in the filing].

 

[Gill Courage]

The HMRC website says that, if you receive payments in currency, you cannot use their native online filing. My bookkeeping software has sterling figures for every currency transaction and the final accounts are, of course, all in GBP. The only thing I can think is that the online system has no facility to accept currency gains or losses.
My accountant is not UK based. Until a couple of years ago I was offshore as well. But this company is English. Since the business was the same it has been easier to use the accountant who knew me, my bookkeeping and our business. He cannot file with HMRC. I have done that myself for the last few years since my UK based accountant died.

 

[Daybooks]

Let’s be very specific. Is it a UK registered company that you want to file a set of accounts with HMRC along with a Corporation Tax Return (CT600)?

If so, what specifically is stopping you from entering all GBP figures into the return?

As you say there are no currency figures to report and indeed there are no boxes on the CT600 to enter such currency amounts or report currency exchanges - profit or losses.

You cannot submit the return using foreign currency but you are not. You convert them to GBP which you have done. Am still of the view that you are trying to resolve a problem that does not exist.

Simply try it.

 

[Newchodge]

When you start the process of filling in the form there is a list of exclusions - you cannot use this software if .... included in that is the foreign currency exclusion.

 

[MyAccountantOnline]

I am up against an end-of-the-month deadline for CT filing. I have always done my own filing (had an accountant prep the accounts) but now I find I cannot because we have some currency transactions this year. Can anyone recommend some software to do this? I won't bore you with the story of why I am so late with this but it involves illness and death and I am pretty frazzled right now. I've had a quote of £900 to do the filing for me but I have already paid for the accounts to be prepared and we made a loss this year, so I'm trying to keep exes to a minimum.

Not used TaxCalc myself for a long time but may be worth a look.

 

[Daybooks]

When you start the process of filling in the form there is a list of exclusions - you cannot use this software if .... included in that is the foreign currency exclusion.

Foreign currency is not and should not be put in as return values. Any amounts that originated as foreign currency have long since been converted to sterling.

You cannot for example enter $1.25 on the return but you will already be entering £1 for example. Following your logic if you ever bought anything in non sterling then you could never file.

The problem is probably perception; not real.

 

[Gill Courage]

Foreign currency is not and should not be put in as return values. Any amounts that originated as foreign currency have long since been converted to sterling.

You cannot for example enter $1.25 on the return but you will already be entering £1 for example. Following your logic if you ever bought anything in non sterling then you could never file.

The problem is probably perception; not real.

When you start the process of filling in the form there is a list of exclusions - you cannot use this software if .... included in that is the foreign currency exclusion.

I understand the results from my bookkeeping software and they are all in Sterling (I use Quickbooks Desktop) but I need to understand the reason for the HMRC exclusion in order to make a decision on which software I can buy/use to make the submission.

 

[Newchodge]

Foreign currency is not and should not be put in as return values. Any amounts that originated as foreign currency have long since been converted to sterling.

You cannot for example enter $1.25 on the return but you will already be entering £1 for example. Following your logic if you ever bought anything in non sterling then you could never file.

The problem is probably perception; not real.

It does not say that you enter foreign currency. It states categorically that you should not use that software if there have been foreign currency transactions.

 

[Daybooks]

It does not say that you enter foreign currency. It states categorically that you should not use that software if there have been foreign currency transactions.

​

Tell us if you need to report any of these in your accounts​

We need to know about any:

• foreign currency transactions - where the company was paid, or the company paid someone else, in a currency other than pounds
• adjustments for something you reported in a previous year
• financial instruments - a contract or binding agreement to buy or sell something
• costs of restructuring - for example, costs of closing down a division of your organisation

I presume you are referring to the above?

In my view you do not want to report any of these foreign currency transactions in any currency other than pounds. You are reporting those foreign currency transactions in pounds.

Your accounts are prepared and presented in sterling regardless of any underlying non sterling value.

This exclusion would apply if you wanted to report those foreign currencies in any currency other than sterling. I cannot think of any reason why you would want to. The reason why you would need to use other software is so that software can convert those foreign currency into sterling pounds for the purpose of the tax return.

 

[Gill Courage]

​

Tell us if you need to report any of these in your accounts​

We need to know about any:

• foreign currency transactions - where the company was paid, or the company paid someone else, in a currency other than pounds
• adjustments for something you reported in a previous year
• financial instruments - a contract or binding agreement to buy or sell something
• costs of restructuring - for example, costs of closing down a division of your organisation

I presume you are referring to the above?

In my view you do not want to report any of these foreign currency transactions in any currency other than pounds. You are reporting those foreign currency transactions in pounds.

Your accounts are prepared and presented in sterling regardless of any underlying non sterling value.

This exclusion would apply if you wanted to report those foreign currencies in any currency other than sterling. I cannot think of any reason why you would want to. The reason why you would need to use other software is so that software can convert those foreign currency into sterling pounds for the purpose of the tax return.

Now you're being far too sensible. We are talking about a government department here...........I know how my accounts work; I have been dealing with multicurrency for 40 years and filed accounts are always in Sterling - they have to be.
Anyway - I am trying Ftax. They have offered a refund if I am unable to file using their software. Very reasonable.

 

[Daybooks]

Now you're being far too sensible. We are talking about a government department here...........I know how my accounts work; I have been dealing with multicurrency for 40 years and filed accounts are always in Sterling - they have to be.
Anyway - I am trying Ftax. They have offered a refund if I am unable to file using their software. Very reasonable.

The guidance is not saying you cannot file using their system because you have foreign currency. It is saying you cannot use it if you wanted to report those foreign currency in for example those foreign currencies. Which you do not.

You are and have been doing it correct. You don’t need any different software (well not possibly until after March 2026). It is in my view a simple misreading of the exclusion into something that it does not mean.

Use their online system while you can and good luck.

 

[DontAsk]

Did you actually receive foreign currency? Do you have bank accounts in any currencies other than GBP.

All of my foreign currency payments are converted by PayPal or Wise, etc., before they even hit my GBP account.

Pragmatically, I would say Daybooks is correct here.

 

[DontAsk]

Additionally, if rates move between invoice and payment dates, I handle it as a discount or a surcharge rather than currency gains/losses. Accountant has been happy with this for 10+ years.

 

[Gill Courage]

Did you actually receive foreign currency? Do you have bank accounts in any currencies other than GBP.

All of my foreign currency payments are converted by PayPal or Wise, etc., before they even hit my GBP account.

Pragmatically, I would say Daybooks is correct here.

Yes. We have accounts in USD and USD credit cards. I hold cash until it is advantageous to do the exchange.

 

[Newchodge]

The guidance is not saying you cannot file using their system because you have foreign currency. It is saying you cannot use it if you wanted to report those foreign currency in for example those foreign currencies. Which you do not.

You are and have been doing it correct. You don’t need any different software (well not possibly until after March 2026). It is in my view a simple misreading of the exclusion into something that it does not mean.

Use their online system while you can and good luck.

Your quote does not say hat you claim here it says. What is the source of your quote, please?

 

[Daybooks]

Your quote does not say hat you claim here it says. What is the source of your quote, please?

It was suggested that once you start the online form completing (CT600) you are presented with exclusions that prevent filing of accounts this way if you have foreign currency.

On the basis that I thought this to be illogical I looked to see why this statement was being made, as I do not use generally this online method of input.

The extract I gave is simply what I found in that process. The source is therefore this rather than any thing specific, subject to legislation below. I believe the confusion may arise from the bullet point:

• foreign currency transactions - where the company was paid, or the company paid someone else, in a currency other than pounds

In context this is saying you cannot present a non sterling currency value in a non sterling currency, e.g. US dollars in US dollars. It is not saying you cannot present any accounts which have currencies other than sterling.

Notwithstanding, HMRC guidance is largely irrelevant unless it offers better terms than the legislation. The Corporation Tax Act 2010 S5(1) states that the computation must be in sterling and S6-9 require other company accounts that may not have been prepared in sterling to be prepared in sterling for the purposes of the tax calculation.

Companies Act requires accounts to be prepared in accordance with Generally Accepted Accounting Practices (GAAP) and HMRC require those accounts required by statute. This essentially requires the foreign currency to be converted to sterling at a spot or a period average rate.

Thus such an HMRC exclusion would be nonsensical. The limitation is that the online system cannot convert, but even this is largely irrelevant as figures would have been converted. But the exclusion does not exist.

 

[Newchodge]

In context this is saying you cannot present a non sterling currency value in a non sterling currency, e.g. US dollars in US dollars.

No. It is saying that you cannot use the software if you have any foreign currency transactions. It is not talking about how the data is entered, "where the company was paid ...... in a currency other than pounds" is plain English.

 

[Daybooks]

I must beg to differ.

The context is clear: “Do you need to report it on the tax return?”

It is in bold at the beginning of the guide to the online form.

Tell us if you need to report any of these in your accounts​

The law has already stated that it must be in sterling. It then gives four bullet points of which if applied to this need of reporting would ultimately mean you could not use their system. The first point is if you have foreign currency that you are wanting to report in any other currency than sterling.

We need to know about any:

• foreign currency transactions - where the company was paid, or the company paid someone else, in a currency other than pounds

“Foreign” is in lowercase because it follows on from the colon above. The second comma gives a significant pause. There is no full stop because it is part of a list.

I read this as “foreign currency transactions - where the company was paid, or the company paid someone else” need to be identified if you wish to report them (the context we are operating in) in a currency other than pounds”

This is consistent with the law. HMRC don’t make the law and have a Charter not to cause tax payers unnecessary expense in meeting their compliance obligations.

If the exclusion was intended to mean you cannot use the system if you have foreign transactions then the statement would not need to include the reference back to “in a currency other than pounds” as it would be superfluous to requirements - thus:

foreign currency transactions - where the company was paid, or the company paid someone else.

But importantly being out of context and needing to be stated elsewhere.

Acknowledging HMRC are not the brightest of organisations and are generally oblivious to their own HMRC Charter, what benefit do you think the exclusion you are reading into this achieves?

 

[Newchodge]

he law has already stated that it must be in sterling. It then gives four bullet points of which if applied to this need of reporting would ultimately mean you could not use their system. The first point is if you have foreign currency that you are wanting to report in any other currency than sterling.

Is that in the guidance or is it your interpretation?

I fully accept that the exclusion seems to be a nonsense, but that does not stop it being there.

 

[Daybooks]

Is that in the guidance or is it your interpretation?

I fully accept that the exclusion seems to be a nonsense, but that does not stop it being there.

Such an exclusion would be nonsense if it existed; but it does not.

Statements to the contrary have been made without giving a source. The extracts I have referred to several times comes from the HMRC website at the time of completing an online return. It is as I have tried to indicate before the possible source of confusion.

The exclusion that you say it makes, namely being unable to use if you have any foreign currency, simply is not there. The bullet point does not say what I believe you think it says.

Where I have stated the law I have also given the specific Act. In every aspect I believe both the law and the guidance makes it clear as to the requirements; the result being that you can use their online system if you have foreign currency transactions. Yes, it is my interpretation of both the law and guidance from which I have made an informed decision.

You can by all means reach a different conclusion. We must therefore beg to differ; sadly your stance incurs unnecessary additional costs.

Happy new year!

 

[macScot]

Taxcalc is a good application, we use it for both our CT600 and SA100 Self Assessments, so I would have no hesitation to recommend them though we have never needed to contact their support team so cannot confirm how good they are. The CT600 does not really require and foreign currency postings as far as I am aware, any values reported would have to be translated to £GBP on the return.

We were in a similar position where we could no longer use the free online option for submitting both accounts and tax for a micro-entity because we started investing some of our company cash into financial assets (stock market) and were forced off that platform and found Taxcalc.com to be good for our needs as it allows us to file our CT600 as well as SA100 returns.
We have not really changed how we report the balance sheet and have included the financial assets as part of our fixed assets total.

If you are filing your accounts using FRS 105 (Micro-entities) then you do not need to submit a P&L, you only need to file a Balance Sheet (currently) and a very limited set of notes. You generally do not have to disclose the specific amount of FX gains or losses in the filing.

However saying that, I would think you still need to use correct HMRC published rates or actual bank rates depending on the transactions and correctly account for gains and losses as they would impact your profits and therefore your taxes.

Under FRS 102 (Small, Medium to Large Entities) you have more strict disclosure requirements and must include notes on the accounting policy for translating foreign currency items and how you treat the resulting gains or losses. You must disclose the total amount of exchange differences recognised in the P&L for the period (unless you are a "Small" entity using Section 1A, where this disclosure is encouraged but often technically optional unless it's necessary for a "true and fair view").

How currency gains and losses or revaluation of contracts in foreign currency are worked out or translated would vary depending on whether you are using FRS 102 or FRS 105, so you have to read up on this if you deal in foreign currency accounts, especially if you don't use an accountant.

For now you should be able to file your accounts directly with Companies House separately and then use a separate application for your CT600, however going forward Companies House will also require you to use software to submit the accounts, so you will need to find products that do the accounts production as well as the tax returns, or use an accountant who can do all 3 things (Accounts Product, Corporation Tax and Self Assessments)

 

[Gill Courage]

Taxcalc is a good application, we use it for both our CT600 and SA100 Self Assessments, so I would have no hesitation to recommend them though we have never needed to contact their support team so cannot confirm how good they are. The CT600 does not really require and foreign currency postings as far as I am aware, any values reported would have to be translated to £GBP on the return.

We were in a similar position where we could no longer use the free online option for submitting both accounts and tax for a micro-entity because we started investing some of our company cash into financial assets (stock market) and were forced off that platform and found Taxcalc.com to be good for our needs as it allows us to file our CT600 as well as SA100 returns.
We have not really changed how we report the balance sheet and have included the financial assets as part of our fixed assets total.

If you are filing your accounts using FRS 105 (Micro-entities) then you do not need to submit a P&L, you only need to file a Balance Sheet (currently) and a very limited set of notes. You generally do not have to disclose the specific amount of FX gains or losses in the filing.

However saying that, I would think you still need to use correct HMRC published rates or actual bank rates depending on the transactions and correctly account for gains and losses as they would impact your profits and therefore your taxes.

Under FRS 102 (Small, Medium to Large Entities) you have more strict disclosure requirements and must include notes on the accounting policy for translating foreign currency items and how you treat the resulting gains or losses. You must disclose the total amount of exchange differences recognised in the P&L for the period (unless you are a "Small" entity using Section 1A, where this disclosure is encouraged but often technically optional unless it's necessary for a "true and fair view").

How currency gains and losses or revaluation of contracts in foreign currency are worked out or translated would vary depending on whether you are using FRS 102 or FRS 105, so you have to read up on this if you deal in foreign currency accounts, especially if you don't use an accountant.

For now you should be able to file your accounts directly with Companies House separately and then use a separate application for your CT600, however going forward Companies House will also require you to use software to submit the accounts, so you will need to find products that do the accounts production as well as the tax returns, or use an accountant who can do all 3 things (Accounts Product, Corporation Tax and Self Assessments)

Thank you for spending the time to type all that. I have just (this minute) submitted my accounts with Ftax. I have been doing currency stuff for decades and always use the HMRC published rates unless there is an actual exchange done at a specific rate. Everything looks like it worked and I really don't see why I couldn't have done it through the HMRC website but that wouldn't work next year, so I might as well get used to a new way of doing things. With luck I will be retiring in a couple of years anyway.........