Employee Problem - What Would You Do?

[japancool]

I strongly believe you should be more clear on what is expected and put policies and procedures in place so there is no room for a misunderstanding in the future

Would he need a policy to say the employee should not take money from the till?

 

[Bob Morgan]

. . . Staff are kindly requested not to bring 'Swag Bags' to work!

 

[IanSuth]

Its a good point on the CCTV issue back in the day I have seen several cases go completely paired shaped when in court due to the police (of all people) not following the correct procedures when requesting CCTV footage from retailers.

On HR policies agree again follow the rule book, one of the last cases I was involved with, fortunately I was only available to take minutes of the disciplinary procedures at that time and although I criticised the board on their handling (to no avail) they ended up in a tribunal and even though this person was guilty of said crime the board members who had to attend the hearting were made to look pretty stupid due to not following proper policies cost then £110k .......

So yes best to make sure you do it right

Newbury rugby club few years back - if i remember rightly

Bar manager found to have a drug habit so cctv was checked

Bar manager caught on camera removing money from safe

when it all got to court the club were unable to confirm how much was missing and so his defence was "i took it out as a loan and put it back later", Judge ordered the Jury to acquit on that charge (not several others) as if they couldnt say what if any money was missing how could the guy be beyond all reasonable doubt guilty. He lambasted the club for their appalling lack of procedures and financial management

 

[IanSuth]

Would he need a policy to say the employee should not take money from the till?

When i worked in retail we had to leave ALL personal cash in lockers in the staff room, we were told in no uncertain terms that anyone found with cash on them on the shop floor it was an act of gross misconduct. That would cover not taking cash from till i guess

 

[ohwhatnow]

I think at this stage you are jumping the gun. Maybe the customer trying to pay on his phone didn't know how to or had run out of battery and your employee thought it a gesture of good will, albeit misplaced?
At the moment you have evidence of one forgetful moment in relation to non payment of a snack and drink. If it's a regular occurrence you'll capture it on camera in a couple of days and feel a whole lot better about any action you take.

I don't mean to add to your concerns but something you've said rings alarm bells and that's, 'He has been with us for about a year and has always been absolutely great; he often comes in early and does a lot of things above and beyond what is expected.'
My working life started in food retail where petty theft by staff, even eating broken packets of biscuits, was a sackable offence. The real villains though, were smart, often starting early and working late to cover their tracks, making sure they were the one's cashing up the till, tallying the books. In one case the highly thought of butchery manager was tucking sirloin steaks in his socks and taping them to his ankles. He always worked later than normal, offering to lock up as the coast was clear.

me too, worked as a petrol station cashier 35+ years ago when they used to deduct losses from your wage packet!!!
there was was long term employee, considered himself the supervisor, always lurking around turning up to shift early and offering to help the area manager by doing the stock sheets /cashing up. turned out he was helping himself to car batteries/parts etc and doctoring the other cashiers shift sheets so the differences showed up on their sheets - what a bast**d.
there was even one poor lad who only survived a week and ended up owing the company money on leaving as his wages didn't cover the losses ?
how they ever got away with that practice was disgusting - glad it was outlawed.

 

[japancool]

how they ever got away with that practice was disgusting - glad it was outlawed.

Well, that's more or less what Royal Mail did with all those sub-postmasters.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

In the supermarket a merchandiser/delivery driver scam came to light where carbon paper between the order pad sheets was separated by a hard plastic card. The top sheet would have what you thought you'd got, the one below would, apart from the signature, remain blank until the driver filled it in. Head office had no procedures in place to check the store copy against the invoice so paid happily.

 

[PaulSmt]

At first try to talk if it repeats then fire him/her.

 

[Jass T]

I am friends with 2 brothers who have both done well in business. Both have very different personalities and attitude to risk and the way they run their businesses.
One is very flamboyant and likes to enjoy his money and freedom the money earns him. He tends to buy a new business, work hard for a few months himself in the business and then have systems and people managing and running the businesses on a day to day basis.
The second one is the total opposite, frugal and careful with his money. Tends to be a bit of a workaholic and works in his business on a day to day level, not trusting other people to run it for him.
I have seen both handle theft by employers in a totally different manner. The flamboyant one , knows staff are stealing but he never really sacked anybody because of it. He makes employees aware he knows about their dishonesty in joking and subtle comments without directly accusing anymore. He understands that has long has the business is making good money and the small thefts don’t turn big and start making huge hits in the bottom line, then he’s willing to tolerate them for the freedom it allows him from being in the business daily.
The other brother is the total opposite again firing and investigating people who were making good money for the business and his business suffered by their sackings.
The more tolerant brother has managed to expand his business empire many times the size of the more strict one. He allowed that freedom of time to go and seek more opportunities out there, which he would have missed being tied down by one of his businesses.
Am not saying which brothers approach is right for you. Do you value your freedom from the business more or a red line no theft policy.?

 

[Bob Morgan]

I am friends with 2 brothers who have both done well in business. Both have very different personalities and attitude to risk and the way they run their businesses.
One is very flamboyant and likes to enjoy his money and freedom the money earns him. He tends to buy a new business, work hard for a few months himself in the business and then have systems and people managing and running the businesses on a day to day basis.
The second one is the total opposite, frugal and careful with his money. Tends to be a bit of a workaholic and works in his business on a day to day level, not trusting other people to run it for him.
I have seen both handle theft by employers in a totally different manner. The flamboyant one , knows staff are stealing but he never really sacked anybody because of it. He makes employees aware he knows about their dishonesty in joking and subtle comments without directly accusing anymore. He understands that has long has the business is making good money and the small thefts don’t turn big and start making huge hits in the bottom line, then he’s willing to tolerate them for the freedom it allows him from being in the business daily.
The other brother is the total opposite again firing and investigating people who were making good money for the business and his business suffered by their sackings.
The more tolerant brother has managed to expand his business empire many times the size of the more strict one. He allowed that freedom of time to go and seek more opportunities out there, which he would have missed being tied down by one of his businesses.
Am not saying which brothers approach is right for you. Do you value your freedom from the business more or a red line no theft policy.?

"Sales Assistant/Thief Required - Apply Within!"

 

[Gecko001]

The employee's behaviour might be down to a culture of petty pilfering at his previous workplaces. So perhaps confronting the employee and saying to them that that is the type of thing that people might have done at places you worked at previously, but you do not do it here.

 

[MBE2017]

The employee's behaviour might be down to a culture of petty pilfering at his previous workplaces. So perhaps confronting the employee and saying to them that that is the type of thing that people might have done at places you worked at previously, but you do not do it here.

On what planet does anyone think a grown adult does not understand what theft is? Who in their right mind actually believes a shop worker believes it is ok to give away goods? So many people looking to make excuses for people.

I found a new branch I was asked to become manager of in the past had a problem with employees thieving, my owner suggested I sack them gradually to allow for recruitment, training etc. I argued as new people came on board the bad apples would turn them bad as well, he finally agreed with myself.

At the time the owner believed he had £68k of stock stolen in the previous year, I thought it a lot higher. After sacking 11 staff in an afternoon, out of a workforce of 13, I found over the next two months he had lost over £300k that I could identify, I managed to get £100k back, saving the branch and jobs.

All the losses, from credit accounts and theft came out of the staff bonuses, we still got bonuses that year, but it meant I was working 80hr weeks for a couple of months. Sometimes you just have to go through some pain to get the gain.

Hopefully this is a case of small pilfering, but I would never trust or work with this person myself.

 

[Gecko001]

MBE2017. I do not mind you having a go at members of the forum like myself who have been around since the days of the old forum. I know what to expect. My post was a suggestion to help the OP deal with a situation. The OP has not come back to the thrread. I do not blame them, judging by the sarky comments from posters about the OP's management style and the rants about being soft on thieving.

 

[Jass T]

"Sales Assistant/Thief Required - Apply Within!"

Like I said , he went onto be mote successful than everyone else in our circle if friends growing up. All the rest, myself included took a more conventional approach to theft by staff.
Not saying he didn't fire people for stealing, but his approach of dropping subtle hints to staff about their indiscretions, certainly kept them on thier toes.
Considering how much freedom the OP gets away from the business and the inconvenience it would create to fire him. He has to do whats right for him.

 

[Richard Dastardly]

It needs to be addressed in some way, even if it's indirectly. These things escalate if not addressed and people steal more. Most people steal from their employer - it's just a fact of life, so I would tolerate it to some degree when I had my own business - because I knew I had done similar to my old employers too!! Stealing office stationery - that kind of thing. I wouldn't do it now, but back then I did. So I was extra vigilant when I had my own biz but accepted it went on to some degree - you need the systems in place to mitigate anything large or significant. Someone stole some A4 paper or the odd bunch of envelopes, or put personal mail in the company post - so what.

I had a cleaner once lying about her hours which cctv picked up. I waited for her invoice that month and I just called her out on it that she hadn't done the hours she was invoicing for. She'd been at it for God knows how long before I got the cctv installed. She quit the week after!!

You could just say I saw you took xyz and gave xyz away for free - please replace them and don't do it again. And let it unfold from there.

 

[Richard Dastardly]

On reflection regarding my comment above; I think there's 2 distinct issues - stealing for himself, and giving stuff away for free to people he doesn't even know.

For me I think giving stuff away for free is much worse because he is showing contempt for the business - he basically doesn't care. So you thinking he is a great employee is misguided because to me that behaviour is a reveal of his true feelings.

Nicking a sweet or drink for himself needs to be addressed as above; even giving the odd thing to friends... - but your bigger problem is that you have an employee who doesn't care what money your business is making (and is in fact actively losing you money out of contempt for you) - and he doesn't draw the line between money made in the shop, and money going into his his wages.

 

[Fagin2021]

I'm beginning to feel a bit sorry for the thieving rascal whose only omission was to stick two fingers up at the CCTV camera and go 'ah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah'.

 

[Kamo1985]

Yes I have been thinking this myself and they do have responsibility to cash up. And unbelievably we just watched some more footage of yesterday and they gave away a second item to a different customer. This is within one day. I don't think I can go much further into detail on what I am going to do or what I have seen but I will be there before them to investigate all of this this morning.

Imo, don't panic, quickly adjust the business so that you can fire anyone at will on the spot.

This seems like a business challenge rather than an individual moron taking the mick. It's better to find a structural solution which fit with your personal commitments.

 

[MBE2017]

MBE2017. I do not mind you having a go at members of the forum like myself who have been around since the days of the old forum. I know what to expect. My post was a suggestion to help the OP deal with a situation. The OP has not come back to the thrread. I do not blame them, judging by the sarky comments from posters about the OP's management style and the rants about being soft on thieving.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, you, myself and everyone else. The OP can choose whose advice to follow, my post was my suggestion just as yours was your thoughts.

 

[stuartthfc11]

I own a convenience store and allow my employee to get a drink or even make a sandwich on shift. She works really hard and for £1 or so a shift wholesale cost, it is money well spent. I just ask them to write down what they have so I can cost it, then mark it down as losses. Obviously, I monitor this through CCTV.

Your staff member may have had bad blood sugar levels for example! Maybe he had no money and was hungry! Whatever the reason the number one rule of business is to look after your assets! This guy is an asset to you and worth more than a drink and a snack!

In terms of him giving away products, there could be many explanations! The Internet might have been down and he couldn't take payment for example. In which case he did it out of goodwill!

Speak with him and by all means investigate BUT do it with an open mind. Ensure he knows the rules! The fact you said he might quit suggests you have not appreciated him which lies at your door - all assets need to be loved and maintained, even Humans!

 

[Bob Morgan]

I own a convenience store and allow my employee to get a drink or even make a sandwich on shift. She works really hard and for £1 or so a shift wholesale cost, it is money well spent. I just ask them to write down what they have so I can cost it, then mark it down as losses. Obviously, I monitor this through CCTV.

Your staff member may have had bad blood sugar levels for example! Maybe he had no money and was hungry! Whatever the reason the number one rule of business is to look after your assets! This guy is an asset to you and worth more than a drink and a snack!

In terms of him giving away products, there could be many explanations! The Internet might have been down and he couldn't take payment for example. In which case he did it out of goodwill!

Speak with him and by all means investigate BUT do it with an open mind. Ensure he knows the rules! The fact you said he might quit suggests you have not appreciated him which lies at your door - all assets need to be loved and maintained, even Humans!

We must be Tough on Crime! - And even tougher on the Victims of Crime!

 

[WaveJumper]

Would be nice to have an update

 

[Evelynbrown]

It is better to discuss this thing with him or make it clear not to do gain if you think he is hardworking and you want to give second chance to him. If he still doing this kind of behavior then you need to find new staff for your shop.