Just Stop Oil - employee involvement...

[Lucan Unlordly]

An employee who on his day off had been spotted on TV gluing himself to the highway is alleged to be one of those climbing the gantries on the M25. The company, a large distributor of cleaning products, workwear etc., has been severely effected by the disruption and fellow employees are refusing to communicate with this individual. Given his position as a lower level line manager he is pilloried by junior staff and senior management alike.

Under employment law, he's been working there for well over 2 years, it seems that nothing can be done but it's damaging to workforce moral, not least because this chap benefits from overtime every time the roads get blocked.

Can he be booted out?

 

[HFE Signs]

This is a very difficult one, the only two points you can explore are:

1) 'fellow employees are refusing to communicate with this individual.'
2) 'damaging to workforce moral'.

If both of these points are investigated and turn out to be not his fault, you could be stuck

Go through his employment contract carefully and see if any of his actions are in breech, even then you have to follow the proceedure correctly.

 

[Financial-Modeller]

Did his activity result in an arrest?

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

This is a very difficult one, the only two points you can explore are:

1) 'fellow employees are refusing to communicate with this individual.'
2) 'damaging to workforce moral'.

If both of these points are investigated and turn out to be not his fault, you could be stuck

Go through his employment contract carefully and see if any of his actions are in breech, even then you have to follow the proceedure correctly.

This is not my company, me, it's a situation relayed by a rep for a company that supplies the distributor with things like Hi-Viz vests that are made in some of the top pollution generating countries out there.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Did his activity result in an arrest?

I don't know...

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

Sack him .Little t×÷t!
Too irresponsible to be in any employment

 

[Bob Morgan]

Sack him .Little t×÷t!
Too irresponsible to be in any employment

, . . apart from PM, Home Secretary, Chancellor, Health Minister . . . Now those jobs do require exceptional levels of irresponsibility!

 

[Bob Morgan]

An employee who on his day off had been spotted on TV gluing himself to the highway is alleged to be one of those climbing the gantries on the M25. The company, a large distributor of cleaning products, workwear etc., has been severely effected by the disruption and fellow employees are refusing to communicate with this individual. Given his position as a lower level line manager he is pilloried by junior staff and senior management alike.

Under employment law, he's been working there for well over 2 years, it seems that nothing can be done but it's damaging to workforce moral, not least because this chap benefits from overtime every time the roads get blocked.

Can he be booted out?

I would give it a very personal touch - Have Big Ron and Razors deliver his termination letter!

 

[Deleted member 335660]

He is doing this in his time off, so in principle it’s nothing to do with the company.

Clearly the staff do not like his beliefs, but that should not be a cause for his dismissal.

If this chap benefits from overtime, then presumably the others do, so why is this a problem for them? Or is it really a problem for you ?

As others have indicated you need to find work related items that may give you cause for concern.

 

[JEREMY HAWKE]

He is doing this in his time off, so in principle it’s nothing to do with the company.

Clearly the staff do not like his beliefs, but that should not be a cause for his dismissal.

If this chap benefits from overtime, then presumably the others do, so why is this a problem for them? Or is it really a problem for you ?

As others have indicated you need to find work related items that may give you cause for concern.

He is bringing the company into disrepute so sack him!

 

[WaveJumper]

This is the lesson for all companies big or small, have a cast iron contract and a staff handbook in place clearly laying out everything which you would expect from an individual, which may then cover the scenario above and perhaps derogatory comments on social media platforms which effect the company.

 

[Newchodge]

He is bringing the company into disrepute so sack him!

Only if people outside the company are aware of his behaviour.

 

[Bob Morgan]

This is the lesson for all companies big or small, have a cast iron contract and a staff handbook in place clearly laying out everything which you would expect from an individual, which may then cover the scenario above and perhaps derogatory comments on social media platforms which effect the company.

Would that include Keel-Hauling as a penalty?

 

[Fagin2021]

'I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.' Evelyn Beatrice Hall.

 

[japancool]

Can't the fact that he has taken part in something that has caused the company a material loss be a reason?

 

[Newchodge]

Can't the fact that he has taken part in something that has caused the company a material loss be a reason?

Possibly, but there may be an argument that it was not the intention.

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

He is doing this in his time off, so in principle it’s nothing to do with the company.

Clearly the staff do not like his beliefs, but that should not be a cause for his dismissal.

If this chap benefits from overtime, then presumably the others do, so why is this a problem for them? Or is it really a problem for you ?

As others have indicated you need to find work related items that may give you cause for concern.

I've already posted above, this isn't about me. I thought it a topic worthy of the 'Time Out' forum.

However, I doubt the staff care about his beliefs as much as the action he's taking which has a direct impact on his colleagues.

Re the overtime, there's two ways of looking at it. Those who had their weekends planned out may see it as an inconvenience?

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Only if people outside the company are aware of his behaviour.

I would imagine they would be as this guy holds some sort of role managing the processing and picking of orders.

'Where's my order John?' 'Sorry mate, it's been delayed because I was stuck up a gantry on Wednesday'..

 

[Mark T Jones]

Give them the chance to explain their stance

Understand the context - nearly all of those who are anti the protesters are talking about personal inconvenience whilst thuis person is thinking about the future if humanity

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Give them the chance to explain their stance

Understand the context - nearly all of those who are anti the protesters are talking about personal inconvenience whilst thuis person is thinking about the future if humanity

I've watched and listened to enough dialogue to understand that their stance does not stand up to questioning.

The personal inconvenience of getting to work to get paid to look after their family.
The personal inconvenience of missing hospital appointments that could save their life.
The personal inconvenience of running a business.

Let me know when your heading out for an important function, off springs wedding, funeral, bucket list holiday and I'll see if this guy can sling his car across your driveway for the future of humanity.

 

[WaveJumper]

Would that include Keel-Hauling as a penalty?

If it was a first offence I would go for walking the plank, however if they are part of the Stop Oil bunch if they survived the plank, they then get keel-hauled

 

[Newchodge]

I've watched and listened to enough dialogue to understand that their stance does not stand up to questioning.

The personal inconvenience of getting to work to get paid to look after their family.
The personal inconvenience of missing hospital appointments that could save their life.
The personal inconvenience of running a business.

Let me know when your heading out for an important function, off springs wedding, funeral, bucket list holiday and I'll see if this guy can sling his car across your driveway for the future of humanity.

There IS no future for humanity unless we start to listen to people like this.

 

[estwig]

Put superglue in his car door locks...........Payback!!!

 

[Bob Morgan]

Put superglue in his car door locks...........Payback!!!

Too 'Random!'

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

There IS no future for humanity unless we start to listen to people like this.

......and therein lies the problem. We do not listen to people who have zero consideration for others.

 

[japancool]

I assume this employee cycles to work every day?

 

[Newchodge]

......and therein lies the problem. We do not listen to people who have zero consideration for others.

Loads of people listened to Johnson.

We don't listen to people who want to tell us something we don't want to hear.

 

[simon field]

I assume this employee cycles to work every day?

Fair weather cyclist at best I reckon!

 

[Bob Morgan]

Fair weather cyclist at best I reckon!

. . . and very probably a quare!

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

Loads of people listened to Johnson.

We don't listen to people who want to tell us something we don't want to hear.

Thankyou for trying to deviate from the issue and make it political.

You are confusing the issues with the actions and assuming that because people don't support asses climbing gantries on the M25 and gluing themselves to roads that they are unaware and ill informed.

 

[Newchodge]

Thankyou for trying to deviate from the issue and make it political.

You are confusing the issues with the actions and assuming that because people don't support asses climbing gantries on the M25 and gluing themselves to roads that they are unaware and ill informed.

It is political.

If people acted on their awareness and their informed status, people would not need to climb gantries. Do you think they are doing it for fun?

 

[Lucan Unlordly]

It is political.

If people acted on their awareness and their informed status, people would not need to climb gantries. Do you think they are doing it for fun?

Political, yes but you singled out Boris

If people acted on their awareness we wouldn't have alcoholics, druggies,, speed limits, fast food shops tobacco, adultery, theft, knife crime, obesity, anorexia or any one of a thousand things that we humans know about but don't act on.

Perhaps we should choose our poison and share our knowledge with the world by sitting on a gantry on the M1?

 

[simon field]

It’s the name puts many off.

Just stop oil? How? It’s needed to lubricate the machines to make the ‘environmentally friendly’ cars we have to make!

I don’t believe that these people live a life without oil, they just like attention.

 

[IanSuth]

I once had a guy offered a role to manage the infrastructure for a small ISP (back in the day small local ones existed), it was based in a large Uni city near me and had a large number of research orgs as customers.

Whilst doing references and checks they realised the guy they had offered also as a volunteer ran the website for an anti vivisection campaign group, they withdrew the offer as they felt him having access to the web hosting of several orgs who did animal experiments was just too risky. Despite offers from him to sign various extra contracts it just wasn't worth the potential hassle

 

[Bob Morgan]

I once had a guy offered a role to manage the infrastructure for a small ISP (back in the day small local ones existed), it was based in a large Uni city near me and had a large number of research orgs as customers.

Whilst doing references and checks they realised the guy they had offered also as a volunteer ran the website for an anti vivisection campaign group, they withdrew the offer as they felt him having access to the web hosting of several orgs who did animal experiments was just too risky. Despite offers from him to sign various extra contracts it just wasn't worth the potential hassle

Did they cut him up?

 

[Clodbuster]

It is political.

If people acted on their awareness and their informed status, people would not need to climb gantries. Do you think they are doing it for fun?

If they were convinced and principles on their objection meet the majority of the population they should be able to get into parliament and make the changes that they want - unfortunately I see some of them have stood on a Green ticket and not been elected (neither have the Greens) which tells me they do not have the backing of the electorate.
Personally I have a can of aerosol glue and red paint in my car but unfortunately have not had the occasion to spray them with it.

 

[Newchodge]

If people acted on their awareness we wouldn't have alcoholics, druggies,, speed limits, fast food shops tobacco, adultery, theft, knife crime, obesity, anorexia or any one of a thousand things that we humans know about but don't act on.

But we (as in society) do act on those things. For the most part we have regulation or we have medical support.
Thatcher raised serious concerns about the environment in 1989 https://www.margaretthatcher.org/document/107817

Since then neither the government nor society has done anything effective about it.

(Ye gods it comes to something when I am quoting Thatcher with approval).

 

[Fagin2021]

Civil disobedience is a long and honourable tradition in this country, with the perpetrators willing, even eager, to accept the consequences of their actions.

Of course, unlike suffragette Emily Davidson who died under the King’s horse at Epsom in 1913, Just Stop Oil protesters can rely on plod to stop the traffic, liberate them with solvent and cart them off safely to face a smack-on-the-wrist fine or community service order. Not exactly the ultimate sacrifice.

Having said that, most Just Stop Oil protestors are a long way from the revolutionary, anti-capitalist tree-huggers portrayed by some politicians and the popular press. Their only demand is that the Government stops the issue of new licences – yes, new licences – for the exploitation, development and production of fossil fuels.

Given the UK commitment to net zero by 2050 that’s hardly radical or unreasonable.

Like ‘Insulate Britain’, Just Stop Oil has an agenda that people who don’t think the environment crisis can be solved by taking your empties down the bottle-bank, would find quite sensible.

Naturally, if you think the rot set in when women and the poor were given the vote, you won’t agree. Harrumph, harrumph, harrumph.

 

[DontAsk]

I don’t believe that these people live a life without oil, they just like attention.

Like the one who has a penchent for 9000 mile flight to Asia for leisure.

Their only demand is that the Government stops the issue of new licences

Ah that explains it. It's perfectly OK to burn the oil from the old licenses

 

[japancool]

Having said that, most Just Stop Oil protestors are a long way from the revolutionary, anti-capitalist tree-huggers portrayed by some politicians and the popular press.

King Charles has been raising concerns about the environment for years, and he was portrayed as a loony tree-hugger.

On the other hand, the protestors are doing themselves and their cause no favours by doing this. They're just going to turn the public against them.