Manchester Attack

[STDFR33]

It seems that terrorism in Europe has hit a new low by targeting children and young teens.

I went to bed after reading on the BBC website that it was believed to have been a speaker that had exploded.
Seeing the news this morning has made me feel sick to my stomach.

Seeing the pictures of young kids walking through Manchester absolutely terrified is heartbreaking. I can't imagine what they've been through, and are still going through - not to mention the family and friends of the victims.

Thinking out loud, it makes me wonder if 'up North' is now a target after so much resources have been pumped into London.

 

[Clodbuster]

Are Enoch Powell's predictions of "Rivers of Blood" coming home to roost ?

 

[Ian J]

Thinking out loud, it makes me wonder if 'up North' is now a target after so much resources have been pumped into London.

The Midlands with it's huge Muslim population must also be a favourite to be targeted as whenever terrorist arrests are made there are invariably a few from Birmingham and these brainwashed sickos don't care if they kill their own as well as everyone else.

I took my son to the Birmingham Arena just two weeks ago and it's frightening to think that it could have been us.

 

[sirearl]

Well if you drop 3 bombs an hour on someone they are likely to get a tad p1ssed with you.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/09/america-dropped-26171-bombs-2016-obama-legacy

 

[Root 66 Woodshop]

I'm not into violence, I understand to a degree why fanatics do what they do, I get it... it's the actions that I don't get... but this is a new low... to target children at a concert is absolutely despicable.

I think it's about high time the Government and the armies of the world stop pussyfooting around, stop tiptoeing around and start being what they're paid to be... defences across the world.

In all seriousness, if one creature such as mankind cannot live side by side without the need to kill, maim or simply treat each other with respect then we don't deserve to be on this planet.

I am ashamed to be human.

 

[TotalWebSolutions]

I was there in '96 as a 16 year old shopping with my mum having traveled from Rossendale. I now live just outside the city. Reading all the reports last night I 'hoped' it was just a terrible accident (gas explosion or similar) but deep down I knew it was going to be deliberate. Thoughts go out to all those affected either directly or indirectly.

 

[STDFR33]

Well if you drop 3 bombs an hour on someone they are likely to get a tad p1ssed with you.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/09/america-dropped-26171-bombs-2016-obama-legacy

Utter sh1te. A lot of these terrorists have been radicalised here, and have never set foot outside of the UK.

There is no justification for targeting kids.

 

[Kat Haylock]

I am ashamed to be human.

It's an utterly sickening, senseless act of violence and having grown up going to gigs at Manchester Arena it really hits close to home. However, in times like this I find it comforting to look at how humanity acts, rather than the individual human - look at the thousands of people offering free beds, free taxis, support and kindness. There's far more good than bad.

 

[Ian J]

A lot of these terrorists have been radicalised here,

Why do we refer to it as being radicalised. Surely the correct term is "brainwashed"

 

[The Byre]

The vapid, asinine, superficial, repetitive and at times laughable coverage in the media and across television in particular, as a feeding frenzy of insipid journalists spout their usual putrid platitudes, as nauseous 'anchormen' wearing makeup, sitting in virtual studios in front of giant back-projection screens, pretending to look concerned as the same piece of stolen agency footage is shown for the twelfth time - that is what sickens me.

The brilliant Labi Siffre summed it up perfectly, back in the 70s, with his song (that he sadly never recorded) 'The Entertainment Value of a Plane Crash'.

Back then, we had to get out the old Arriflex cameras and develop 16mm film, but now everybody is at it. If somebody is in need today, if a child dies, a bomb blows a hospital to smithereens or just people are starving to death because all supplies of food and water have been destroyed by a war that we financed and equipped - do we help them? Do we feed them? Do we stop the war and stop manufacturing arms on a colossal scale?

No, we get out the iPhone and strap a GoPro to our heads! Hey! I've got Reuters, the AP and the UPI on speed-dial!

 

[Nochexman]

I...in times like this I find it comforting to look at how humanity acts, rather than the individual human - look at the thousands of people offering free beds, free taxis, support and kindness. There's far more good than bad.

Absolutely agree with you Kat.

 

[bovine]

I heard thisquote a while back, and it rings true for situations like this ... "There was something else my mother did that I’ve always remembered: “Always look for the helpers,” she’d tell me. “There’s always someone who is trying to help.” I did, and I came to see that the world is full of doctors and nurses, police and firemen, volunteers, neighbours and friends who are ready to jump in to help when things go wrong."

Its a terrible thing, particularly targeting a show like this. Its mostly going to be young girls at this thing, with their parents/guardians. There are still many many people who dont know what has happened to their children/loved ones.

 

[Root 66 Woodshop]

Sorry, but with all due respect, all of the Doctors, nurses, police, Firemen, Ambulance men etc etc are just doing their job... Yes 1000's of them probably deserve more respect than they're actually given but honestly, they've taken on that job role - that's their calling, yet strike because they feel that they're not paid enough.. really? ...

It shouldn't make people feel any better because they're there to help... it should be quite simply they're there because they're needed... but honestly, they shouldn't be needed... Folk that join the army or police force do so out of something that they want to do... they want to perform this kind of service for whatever reason it maybe don't get me wrong I commend these folks... But "WE" the public shouldn't be needed! This kind of genocide should not be happening in today's world... we're meant to be moving on from being the barbaric creature to being a technologically advanced sentient being... yet some people out their consider it perfectly fine to kill children who are completely innocent... simply because...

They hit me first.

Pardon my french... but seriously... ******s!

 

[Newchodge]

A local taxi firm here in the north east, Blueline has put out a message that they will send free taxis to collect anyone in Manchester, affected by this who needs to return to the north east. There are two types of humanity.

 

[Ian J]

Sorry, but with all due respect, all of the Doctors, nurses, police, Firemen, Ambulance men etc etc are just doing their job... Yes 1000's of them probably deserve more respect than they're actually given but honestly, they've taken on that job role - that's their calling,

My wife is a nurse and she is paid to nurse people for 40 hours a week. Nurses aren't paid to jump into their cars and race to the scene to see if they could help like many seemed to do last night

 

[garyk]

I think it's about high time the Government and the armies of the world stop pussyfooting around, stop tiptoeing around and start being what they're paid to be... defences across the world.

And therein lies the issue.

And to top it off you have a terrorist sympathizer running for PM???

You couldn't make this s**t up.

 

[bovine]

I dont think many people took on a job to go and clear up/help victims after an attack. To run towards an incident, when you dont know what else is going to happen, because you have the skills to help should be commended. Even if you dont have the skills to help, but can comfort people who are potentially mortally wounded then that should also be commended. I remember stories from the tube bombings years ago about people who sat with victims and held them as they passed away. The families can take some small comfort from knowing their loved ones didnt die completely alone in the dark. (I do agree about striking, but thats not an issue for today!)

We all have to deal with this, we all have to be vigilant and we all have to look out for each other.

Starting to see on social media now confirmation of deaths for some of the pictures that have been circulating. The last one I saw was an eight year old girl. Probably had her best day ever, then this.....

We should also remember those who are working day in and day out behind the scenes to prevent this type of thing happening. Who knows how many have been prevented.

 

[Clodbuster]

I read that the perp was "Known to the police"

We had a trampoline removed from the local park because "someone may get injured" - well - time to incarcerate all known suspects because "someone may get injured"

 

[sirearl]

And therein lies the issue.

And to top it off you have a terrorist sympathizer running for PM???

You couldn't make this s**t up.

You certainly could if you are in the media.

 

[Paul Norman]

You certainly could if you are in the media.

As indeed, they appear to have done.

A terrible crime has happened. A lot of people have been badly effected.

And on social media we are still throwing made up posturing about.

I do not have a slick answer as to how to prevent a random act of utter evil by a bad person. I wish I did.

 

[sirearl]

I suspect the Manchester bomb was not a single individuals doing.

But a result of cause and effect.

https://www.iraqbodycount.org/database/recent/1/

 

[TotalWebSolutions]

"I suspect the Manchester bomb was not a single individuals doing"

Warranties executed at two separate addresses in South Manchester today with at least one arrest so it seems like 'he' may have been assisted in some way, yes.

 

[MBE2017]

No easy answers.

Not excusing this act in anyway, but I can see why some members of the human race seeing the West dropping thousands of bombs, often on civilians in foreign lands many consider to be their brothers and sisters, wish to strike back.

You cannot stop these acts, only reduce them. Whilst we as a country meddle elsewhere we will always be a possible target, and probably remain a target even if we do stop meddling.

 

[Newchodge]

No easy answers and no excuses, but it is time that we had a government that understood that our foreign policy has consequences for ourselves as well as for others. Bombing other countries, or supplying the means for others to bomb other countries is not a neutral act.

 

[simon field]

What a bunch of cowards, say something real FFS!

Some men in planes thousands of feet up in the sky drop bombs on people down below,in the night, in countries they've been sent to by 'those in the know'. They even show little clips on the news so we can all see how good they are at it (that's if one watches tv). Innocent people get killed and hurt - men, women,children. Is it cowardly to do that?

The end result of any act of killing is dead people - it's a terrible, terrible shame but it doesn't make it ok to do it in the name of a different, more superior god and say 'yeah but we didn't mean do it!'

 

[Mr D]

No easy answers and no excuses, but it is time that we had a government that understood that our foreign policy has consequences for ourselves as well as for others. Bombing other countries, or supplying the means for others to bomb other countries is not a neutral act.

Just by existing we are a target.
Foreign policy does not help when it causes innocents to die and their families then perhaps quite justifiably want revenge.
In this case it appears the bomber was British.

We've had a few of them over the past few decades.

Perhaps if the young man had followed a different path.... we will never know.

 

[Mr D]

What a bunch of cowards, say something real FFS!

Some men in planes thousands of feet up in the sky drop bombs on people down below,in the night, in countries they've been sent to by 'those in the know'. They even show little clips on the news so we can all see how good they are at it (that's if one watches tv). Innocent people get killed and hurt - men, women,children. Is it cowardly to do that?

The end result of any act of killing is dead people - it's a terrible, terrible shame but it doesn't make it ok to do it in the name of a different, more superior god and say 'yeah but we didn't mean do it!'

We generally don't kill the brutal murderers, rapists, torturers. We kill the guy cleaning the toilets. We kill the woman shopping for fresh fruit. We kill the young adult applying for his first job. We kill a nurse busy delivering a baby. We kill a taxi driver who is looking for his next fare. We kill the child playing with a doll.
Bombing is easy, its bloodless (for the attackers, not the victims), its separating action and effect. Its also a darn sight cheaper than sending in troops by sea and land to attack military forces and those in the first sentence.

Do we have the political will to take action against ISIS? Unlikely. The cost is high, too high some would say. And they could well be right about the cost.

 

[sirearl]

Utter sh1te. A lot of these terrorists have been radicalised here, and have never set foot outside of the UK.

There is no justification for targeting kids.

So why do we do it?

Oh hold thats just collateral damage.

It's a tribal thing nothing to do with where one is born.

 

[STDFR33]

We generally don't kill the brutal murderers, rapists, torturers. We kill the guy cleaning the toilets. We kill the woman shopping for fresh fruit. We kill the young adult applying for his first job. We kill a nurse busy delivering a baby. We kill a taxi driver who is looking for his next fare. We kill the child playing with a doll.
Bombing is easy, its bloodless (for the attackers, not the victims), its separating action and effect. Its also a darn sight cheaper than sending in troops by sea and land to attack military forces and those in the first sentence.

Do we have the political will to take action against ISIS? Unlikely. The cost is high, too high some would say. And they could well be right about the cost.

We bomb because we are not fighting an army.

We are fighting an opposition that doesn't attempt follow the rules of war.

You have people in plain clothes that approach soldiers and then detonate a suicide vest.

You have them pretending to be farmers, and then the next minute they are pulling out an AK47 to fire on you.

But again, the suicide bomber in the Manchester attack was born here. He hasn't had experience of being bombed by coalition forces. The only experience he has had of a war torn country was when he travelled to receive terrorist training.
So I'm struggling to see the argument of 'well if we bomb his country, this is what is going to happen'. It's almost as fruit loopy as Jeremy Corbyn.

 

[Root 66 Woodshop]

That isn't what I've said and I'm pretty sure you know it Ian.

My wife is a nurse and she is paid to nurse people for 40 hours a week. Nurses aren't paid to jump into their cars and race to the scene to see if they could help like many seemed to do last night

I never said they were... but then again, neither were the 100's of people who offered their services... none of them trained for such a situation yet people offering to take people home, people offering food and shelter, the Lady from Manchester who took in 50 children... none of them are paid to act upon a terrorist act - but people did.

But, this is not what I'm saying, and I'm sure you know that. What I'm saying is that this kind of attack should not be happening in this country... An Asian chap on Facebook said it all, when he asked the question "What are muslims doing in this country if they're not here to contribute to this country?" He goes on to say that that the families of attackers to the country (he includes the Rapists from Rochdale in this speech) should be deported... 100's of people are replying to him "egging him on" saying that he's right... well I'm sorry but No! He's not right... The Government held open it's arms to everyone and anyone and said come here... we asked for this to happen because the Government proclaimed that the UK was a freeforall (not in so many words... but pretty much!) ...

I'm far from being Racist, before anyone even considers the above as a racist comment - I couldn't give a toss what colour anyone's skin is, nationality or religion... If you live in this country with one objective - to attack those that have housed you and fed you and your family then you deserve to be removed from this country... If on the other hand you are here contributing to the pot and living a good honest life then sure stay here!

To attack a child in any way whatsoever deserves the punishment to be as much as "legally" as possible.

 

[Ian J]

<snip>

To attack a child in any way whatsoever deserves the punishment to be as much as "legally" as possible.

But how do you punish somebody who has blown himself up

 

[Root 66 Woodshop]

What a bunch of cowards, say something real FFS!

Some men in planes thousands of feet up in the sky drop bombs on people down below,in the night, in countries they've been sent to by 'those in the know'. They even show little clips on the news so we can all see how good they are at it (that's if one watches tv). Innocent people get killed and hurt - men, women,children. Is it cowardly to do that?

The end result of any act of killing is dead people - it's a terrible, terrible shame but it doesn't make it ok to do it in the name of a different, more superior god and say 'yeah but we didn't mean do it!'

I totally agree... unfortunately this country is far too PC!

Can't say this, can't say that... for fear of retribution or being charged, sued etc...

You've said it as I see it... America last year as the previous post said dropped over 2000 bombs, roughly 3 a day...

Some jumped up little Korean dude threatening America with a nuke...

Some russian chap having his planes fly over the UK, his ships sailing close to our borders... all because a bully is a coward.

The entire world is pardon my french F****D UP! instead of getting on with our lives we're brought into futile wars against each other by the government bodies that run the world...

*Flops out his penis* Mine's bigger than yours boys!!

The end is near for some, because some people out there just can't cope with this utter crap anymore...

 

[Mr D]

We bomb because we are not fighting an army.

We are fighting an opposition that doesn't attempt follow the rules of war.

You have people in plain clothes that approach soldiers and then detonate a suicide vest.

You have them pretending to be farmers, and then the next minute they are pulling out an AK47 to fire on you.

But again, the suicide bomber in the Manchester attack was born here. He hasn't had experience of being bombed by coalition forces. The only experience he has had of a war torn country was when he travelled to receive terrorist training.
So I'm struggling to see the argument of 'well if we bomb his country, this is what is going to happen'. It's almost as fruit loopy as Jeremy Corbyn.

And because we bomb we kill those who are not involved. Innocents.
Children.

The cost of using troops instead, which can be more targeted, is high on both sides.
Don't recall seeing anything about 'if we bomb his country this is what is going to happen'.

 

[TotalWebSolutions]

I cannot believe that some people think the attack was 'staged' and many major attacks were staged (7/7, 9/11 etc) going back as far as the Kennedy assassination! They believe the Manchester bombing was a 'fake flag' staged attack with actors! I had friends who went to the concert who I have known from school and my brother's friend lost his niece (RIP). I am sure we all know someone (or someone who knows someone) who was present during one of these attacks. How much tinfoil must they be wearing??!

 

[STDFR33]

And because we bomb we kill those who are not involved. Innocents.
Children.

The cost of using troops instead, which can be more targeted, is high on both sides.
Don't recall seeing anything about 'if we bomb his country this is what is going to happen'.

Jesus Christ.

His country was England. He was born here. We didn't bomb his frigging country!

 

[Mr D]

Jesus Christ.

His country was England. He was born here. We didn't bomb his frigging country!

Has anyone said different?

However ISIS have apparently claimed credit. Do we blame ISIS or ignore any claims & links?

 

[MBE1]

We bomb because we are not fighting an army.

No, we bomb because it is easier and safer for us to do so.

We are fighting an opposition that doesn't attempt follow the rules of war.

There are no rules in war, except to win.

You have people in plain clothes that approach soldiers and then detonate a suicide vest.

You have them pretending to be farmers, and then the next minute they are pulling out an AK47 to fire on you.

When it is helping us we have no problem with such tactics, I'm sure ISIS would love to possess aircraft and missiles, thankfully they do not possess them as yet.

But again, the suicide bomber in the Manchester attack was born here. He hasn't had experience of being bombed by coalition forces. The only experience he has had of a war torn country was when he travelled to receive terrorist training.

He probably spoke the language, watched their tv stations, read their papers, followed their religion etc, even though he was born in England, his family have returned to Iraq.

So I'm struggling to see the argument of 'well if we bomb his country, this is what is going to happen'. It's almost as fruit loopy as Jeremy Corbyn.

I said this is an understandable result, that a few will wish to get revenge for acts against what they see as "their countrymen". Only a fool would believe that every immigrant in the UK, and their offspring, whether born here or abroad would not feel anger at thousands of inaccurate dropped bombs. Our politicians know this, we know this, stop pretending this is not a normal human emotion of anger. Thankfully only a few carry out and retalliation, but there will always be a few. As I said before, there are no easy answers.

I have never been compared to Corbyn before, but I see denying possible resentment and anger from the Wests actions to other countries be even more fruit loopy than accepting maybe some of this is brought on by our own actions, whether we realised it or not.

 

[Ian J]

I cannot believe that some people think the attack was 'staged' and many major attacks were staged (7/7, 9/11 etc) going back as far as the Kennedy assassination!

Why not. The world is full of idiots and the advent of social media has given them all a voice. Surely it's called Twitter for a good reason

 

[STDFR33]

@MBE1 have you not heard of the Geneva Convention? You'll find that there are rules to war.

 

[sirearl]

Jesus Christ.

His country was England. He was born here. We didn't bomb his frigging country!

Afraid we did.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...salman-abedi-named-manchester-suicide-bomber/

You seem to think that where you are born determines who you are.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_military_intervention_in_Libya