Ed Miliband

[kate1]

He was on the news this morning and stated "I cant get into the minds of these people" Sorry, so why is he in his job?

 

[vvaannmmaann]

Who could get into their minds?

 

[quikshop]

He was on the news this morning and stated "I cant get into the minds of these people" Sorry, so why is he in his job?

It's not what he really thinks, he's repeating what he's been told to say by his spin-DJ

We can all get into the minds of these people, they're not complicated sorts who are misunderstood. They are the dross of society, the foaming under-class who are unable or to bone-idle to better their own lives.

Is it biased selective TV reporting or a cold hard fact that the majority of rioters in London are of West Indian and in Birmingham of Asian descent? Or are we not allowed to talk about such things

 

[kate1]

Just thought it was a rather silly thing to say. I believe there are layers and layers, knock on effects of things that has caused this. I was hoping he might mention something about discipline in schools (I know this isnt the only thing, but things need to be tackled at source and not a knee jerk reaction. Need to be proactive rather than reactive.

 

[Jeff FV]

I saw him on the news last night utter inane comments such as "I think it is right that substantially more police officers be put on the streets" [source] He deserves a "Sybil Fawltey Award for stating the bleedin' obvious." But then he, like far too many of our politicians, have done nothing but be politicians.

I was hoping he might mention something about discipline in schools (I know this isnt the only thing, but things need to be tackled at source and not a knee jerk reaction. Need to be proactive rather than reactive.

As a teacher, I am normally leaping up and down when people start blaming the schools, but you are right. We have breed a generation who have learnt that they can pretty much get away with anything and that sanctions will soon be undermined.

At one school I was quoted, verbatim, a passage from the UN charter on children's rights by a 12 year old when I picked him up for a minor offence. He had been taught this 'legalise' and told to use it by his father. This was not in a deprived inner city school, but a school with an affluent intake in the leafy suburbs. The boy was certainly not deprived, had all the latest gadgets and wanted for nothing, except, perhaps clear boundaries laid down by his parents.

I know many good teachers who now 'let things go' as they feel it unlikely that they will be supported by higher ups. OK, these might be minor indiscretions, but the problem with this is, is that it leads to bigger & bigger indiscretions.

Jeff

 

[kate1]

Not the teachers fault at all, their hands are tied.

 

[quikshop]

Not the teachers fault at all, their hands are tied.

I disagree, some teachers are just awful at their job. A minority of teachers I know, but they exist in sufficient numbers to cause real damage to a child's future.

Instead of these incompetents being sacked / disciplined they are protected by their Union overlords who get them moved to a different school where they can mess up all over again.

 

[kate1]

Theres good and bad in all industry sectors. But ultimately the teachers hands are tied.

I would like to see the government shaken up to be honest, MP expenses (stealing) Bankers - we need to do something about that really. Stealing is stealing, MP's just have what they have done packaged differently, along with the large bankers bonus. So are MP's just as bad as the looters, or any better? Maybe they are following by example

 

[papverpoppies]

I saw him on the news last night utter inane comments such as "I think it is right that substantially more police officers be put on the streets" [source] He deserves a "Sybil Fawltey Award for stating the bleedin' obvious." But then he, like far too many of our politicians, have done nothing but be politicians.



As a teacher, I am normally leaping up and down when people start blaming the schools, but you are right. We have breed a generation who have learnt that they can pretty much get away with anything and that sanctions will soon be undermined.

At one school I was quoted, verbatim, a passage from the UN charter on children's rights by a 12 year old when I picked him up for a minor offence. He had been taught this 'legalise' and told to use it by his father. This was not in a deprived inner city school, but a school with an affluent intake in the leafy suburbs. The boy was certainly not deprived, had all the latest gadgets and wanted for nothing, except, perhaps clear boundaries laid down by his parents.

I know many good teachers who now 'let things go' as they feel it unlikely that they will be supported by higher ups. OK, these might be minor indiscretions, but the problem with this is, is that it leads to bigger & bigger indiscretions.

Jeff

According to the minister for education (who's name escapes me):| on BBC 1 news this morning, teachers are going to be issued with new guidelines as of Sept in which they can now discipline children.

Sorry, mate, but it is a too little too late........the horse has already bolted.

All this twaddle about values, and making parents responsible for their children, how he is going to make that work....we have countless parents who grew up 'in a free for all, what's yours is mine' society, because of successive Government interfering along with their inadequacies about family life.

It also struck whilst he was rabbiting on, that not only have many people lost their business due to the riots, but they are faced with further expense and insult. Basically they will paying the fines, from their own pockets when all these 'layabouts' come to court -as their fines will come out of the public purse.

So, in what respect does that teach them a lesson?

The only people who will suffer long term damage here, are the shop owners, and the innocent people who got hurt in all of this.

Pops ~xx~

 

[kate1]

Yep another knee jerk reaction. But wasnt it a Nanny state when Labour were in power and now the coalition - have to pick up the pieces.

BTW Im not any staunch politics, either way - but just observing what I see.

 

[papverpoppies]

Yep another knee jerk reaction. But wasnt it a Nanny state when Labour were in power and now the coalition - have to pick up the pieces.

BTW Im not any staunch politics, either way - but just observing what I see.

Because that is ALL they have - empty words.

The truth is they know there is nothing at all they can do, we have the society we have today because of them.

It does not matter what party is in power they have ALL sold this Country down the swanny time and time again.

They have ruined our work force, sold off anything that was making money, leaving countless people out of work and living on state benefits.

There is NO real punishment for crime, OK prison takes away your freedom, but that is about all, there is nothing you cannot get in prison that you cannot get on the outside (in fact there is probably more)!

The schools allow kids that cannot read or write to enter adult society totally ill equipped (but then again, with no jobs - what does that matter)!

We are a third world country, that is broke, but propping up half of the rest of the world....and still we allow more and more people in, and send more and more aid out.

The Minister for education I wonder if he has ever sat in a inner school city classroom. Would he like to administer that discipline he was speaking about today, on any of the kids, they would probably string him up.

MP's are out of touch, they do not live on the breadline like many families, live in the poor areas, or have any real understanding how people are feeling.

We are are broken Country, and to be honest I cannot see how we are ever going to be in a position to fix it.
Changing Government every 4 years is not the answer, we just kick out one inept bunch - to be replaced by another.

Pops ~xx~

 

[Parthelan]

So, in what respect does that teach them a lesson?~

I think theres been a link to an article posted already where some kids interviewed said they were doing it to show the authorities they would do what they liked when they liked.

I heard someone on the radio this morning saying theyd keep looting till they were caught and they didnt care because what could the authorities do to them.....

... normal lessons dont work on a mentality like that....

 

[papverpoppies]

I think theres been a link to an article posted already where some kids interviewed said they were doing it to show they authorities they would do what they liked when they liked.

I heard someone on the radio this morning saying theyd keep looting till they were caught and they didnt care because what could the authorities do to them.....

... normal lessons dont work on a mentality like that....

Kids today are not afraid of the law......(well that type of kid) of which there are countless!

I just thank my lucky stars I live where I do, sorry if that sounds 'selfish' but that, I'm afraid, is the only protection we have -living away from these troubled spots.
Because the Police sure as hell cannot do it.

Pops ~xx~

 

[kate1]

Pops spot on.

No the government is not in touch with the real world,

Below was an email I received from a friend, and I thought he was quite correct

Wealthy people should not run anything apart from their own businesses, like Richard Branson, Duncan Ballantyne, Allan Sugar. People like Osborn and Cameron and the other 400 are wealthy through their inheritance and nothing else.

I must admit I agree with him

 

[IE152]

Kate,

Isn't the whole point of a democracy that we should be represented by the people who we elect, rather than people who have less than a certain amount in the bank? Where do you draw the line - should it be someone with assets of greater than £1million? £500,000? £50,000?

Maybe people who run a business should be excluded, since they are almost all loaded?

I'm very interested in your / your friends figure about 400 MPs being wealthy through 'their inheritance and nothing else'. I would love to see some justification for that figure.....

 

[kate1]

IE, its only an email that I got sent, dont know where the figures come from. Maybe I would just like to see somebody who really really really does understand what goes on in the real world, as oppose to having being bought up with wealth. MP's are stealing however you package it. Inflated salaries, I live in Derby - so what happens to all these folks and their jobs because of the contract being sent to Germany. Its all in all an uneven spread of wealth. Just annoys me, they are talking about looting, and most of them have done exactly the same thing

 

[IE152]

I don't think you can equate an MP with a looter.

Yes, there are some who come from very priviledged backgrounds. But the idea that most come from some sort of inherited 'wealth', and that they are cut off from society is very wrong.

I'd suggest that most have a better idea of the 'real world' (whatever that is) than most of us on this board. Sit through an MPs surgery if you don't believe me, and then ask yourself if you would want to that for £65,000.

A very small number of MPs did breach the rules. And they are now where the looters are hopefully going to be soon - in prison.

 

[kate1]

so the difference between a looter and an MP is what its both stealing. £65K so what about creating jobs and cutting these salaries by half. Its all very very wrong,

IE so whats the difference between a looter and an MP putting in expenses? just interested to know, stealing money from the country in my ideas MP's/looters all in the same bracket.

Im not sure why you cant equate it looters MPs = robbing money from Britain

 

[IE152]

Fair point, cut MPs salary by half and use the money to 'create' jobs - I can see a load more pointless public sector positions being created.

Of course, it could also further deter good people seeking to become an MP - after all a salary of £30,000 is only about the average salary in London and with the dislocation to family life that being an MP involves.

But I still don't see how you can claim that they are "stealing money from the country". They are paid a salary for doing the job - why shouldn't they take that salary? They can get expenses for doing their job - why shouldn't they claim those expenses like everyone else?

 

[kate1]

no probs so its ok for MPs to steal money out of the pot? the MPs are ripping this country off something rotten expenses housing Ive got to have a residence in London. Get sodding rid of the lot of them, they are hypocrites we need an uprising against these corrupt MP's.

 

[An Oasis]

I don't think you can equate an MP with a looter.

Yes, there are some who come from very priviledged backgrounds. But the idea that most come from some sort of inherited 'wealth', and that they are cut off from society is very wrong.

I'd suggest that most have a better idea of the 'real world' (whatever that is) than most of us on this board. Sit through an MPs surgery if you don't believe me, and then ask yourself if you would want to that for £65,000.

A very small number of MPs did breach the rules. And they are now where the looters are hopefully going to be soon - in prison.

It's a new fantasy island wannabie. Welcome on board FIW don't read the MSM go to the other extreme and find the real world. Have you ever met an MP or listened to the utter drivel that 99% of them come out with? Real world are you taking the piss, you could shove the real world up their arses and they still would not know what is happening and worse they don't even care, it's all about them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Who do you think has managed to destroy the education, judicial, health sectors, the police, housing trusts...with their idiocies? I'll give you a clue there are over 1300 of them in the upper and lower house and if all of them fell in to a black hole we would notice an improvement in society the next day.

 

[Dot Cotton]

Way to go Oasis ... I love your rants

 

[Jeff FV]

Politicians and the political classes are too divorced from the society they represent. Too many of them left University (probably having studied PPE at Oxford), joined a think tank on graduating or became an MP's researcher, gained favour and then became an MP. They then believe that they can tell us how to run the country.

Take the Minister for Education (as he's been mentioned on this forum) Michael Gove. Does he have any experience of teaching? I don't think he does, yet he tells us what we must and musn't do. I still remember my first year as a teacher - I had a class of disaffected, bottom set year 11's (15 & 16 year olds) for double maths on a Friday afternoon. I'm still quite proud of the fact that one of the lads in that class got an E in Maths - his highest GCSE mark!

I'm now in my early forties, with experience in life, education, the RAF and setting up a small business, skills and knowledge that might be useful for an MP. But if I wanted to enter politics (and I categorically state now that I don't!) I wouldn't stand a chance as I haven't done my 'political apprentice.' We need MPs who have lived outside of politics, not the same bunch of clones.

Jeff

 

[An Oasis]

Way to go Oasis ... I love your rants

Thanks but they are not rants just pure fact...these people offer nothing to society and yet in their limited arrogance manage to cause utter chaos.

I have no idea why we have a civil service (as advisors) they are as inept as the politicians they serve/control...get rid of the lot they are worthless parasites.

 

[Gord]

Politicians and the political classes are too divorced from the society they represent. Too many of them left University (probably having studied PPE at Oxford), joined a think tank on graduating or became an MP's researcher, gained favour and then became an MP. They then believe that they can tell us how to run the country.

But isn't the real issue, we continually elect them to run the country.
Don't see the point of complaining afterwards.

eg: brief history of Barnsley.

Tories win election (1992).
Barnsley votes Labour

Labour wins election(1997)
Barnsley votes Labour

Labour moves from union lapdogs & adopts many traditional Tory economic & social policies
Barnsley votes Labour

McBrown hijacks UK political system & spends all the cash in an attempt to get legitimately voted in.
Barnsley votes Labour

Labour MP jailed for theft/fraud forcing by-election(2011).Labour candidate parachuted from elsewhere
Barnsley votes Labour

Anyone spot the problem ?
Anyone spot that there is nothing to be gained by either main political parties by doing anything for Barnsley ? ( an example that applies to many areas of the country )
Getting elected as the Labour MP for Barnsley is a lucrative job for life. Makes no difference if you care about Barnsley or not, you just have to stay out of jail.

And the lemmings continue to vote them in.

 

Because that is ALL they have - empty words.

The truth is they know there is nothing at all they can do, we have the society we have today because of them.

It does not matter what party is in power they have ALL sold this Country down the swanny time and time again.

They have ruined our work force, sold off anything that was making money, leaving countless people out of work and living on state benefits.

There is NO real punishment for crime, OK prison takes away your freedom, but that is about all, there is nothing you cannot get in prison that you cannot get on the outside (in fact there is probably more)!

The schools allow kids that cannot read or write to enter adult society totally ill equipped (but then again, with no jobs - what does that matter)!

We are a third world country, that is broke, but propping up half of the rest of the world....and still we allow more and more people in, and send more and more aid out.

The Minister for education I wonder if he has ever sat in a inner school city classroom. Would he like to administer that discipline he was speaking about today, on any of the kids, they would probably string him up.

MP's are out of touch, they do not live on the breadline like many families, live in the poor areas, or have any real understanding how people are feeling.

We are are broken Country, and to be honest I cannot see how we are ever going to be in a position to fix it.
Changing Government every 4 years is not the answer, we just kick out one inept bunch - to be replaced by another.

Pops ~xx~

hit the nail square on the head pops

 

Politicians and the political classes are too divorced from the society they represent. Too many of them left University (probably having studied PPE at Oxford), joined a think tank on graduating or became an MP's researcher, gained favour and then became an MP. They then believe that they can tell us how to run the country.

Take the Minister for Education (as he's been mentioned on this forum) Michael Gove. Does he have any experience of teaching? I don't think he does, yet he tells us what we must and musn't do. I still remember my first year as a teacher - I had a class of disaffected, bottom set year 11's (15 & 16 year olds) for double maths on a Friday afternoon. I'm still quite proud of the fact that one of the lads in that class got an E in Maths - his highest GCSE mark!

I'm now in my early forties, with experience in life, education, the RAF and setting up a small business, skills and knowledge that might be useful for an MP. But if I wanted to enter politics (and I categorically state now that I don't!) I wouldn't stand a chance as I haven't done my 'political apprentice.' We need MPs who have lived outside of politics, not the same bunch of clones.

Jeff

too right mate at least half of the house has done the ppe how many of thease fools held down a job or run a business let alown lived on minimum wage,signed on ext ,a real shower of sh*te .
Why we bother too vote I dont know ,the problem is every time an election comes up we are sick too the back teeth of the scum in power that we all vent our spleens in the poling booth ,the result the same mob get in no matter who you vote for and then they claim they are the voice of the people !!!!!! stuff it we need too start our own riot .

 

[Team Leith Training]

to be honest, i did commence training as a teacher once my degree was over.

For the majority, i experienced rude, violent children with no respect or discipline. Teachers having little in their armoury to keep them in line. Kids not interested in what was being taught. With many of them so high on the crap they were fed at home or in the dinner room.

It was a professiona which frankly i was glad to leave. I would return to teaching for all the coffee in Brazil, far happier training adults.

What annoys me is, parents are blamed for unruly behaviour, but when corporal punishment is outlawed and some jumped up kid threatens you with the police if you do anything, while another dials 999. what defence is there? No this is not referring to myself, but to a relative of mine.