Ideas of opening a fruit and vegetable shop

[Big boss]

Hi
I have been pondering on the idea of opening a shop selling fruit and vegetables in my town.Since this is a total change of what I do for my day job,i would like to hear from other forum users on good pointers on getting started and what outlay costs are involved.Is it also profitable and what kind of margins are their to be made?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Antonio

 

[timjking]

This isn't too much help but.. you will need a very strong USP to persuade people not to just pick them up when they are at the supermarket

 

[Billmccallum]

http://bartonandredman.com/ are reputed to be the biggest wholesalers in Manchester, visit them and check out the pricing.

Then pop into Tesco, Asda, Sainburys, Morrisons, Alda, Lidl and Netto and check out their pricing...plus visit you local street markets.

Work out if you think its worthwhle.

 

[Lee Jones Jnr]

Opening a greengrocers? Hmmmm a tricky proposition unless you are intending to open in the 1950s?
Like all businesses it is workable given the right approach.
Direct deliveries are increasingly popular, I use Boxfresh Organics
http://www.boxfreshorganics.co.uk/

Maybe something like that would work?

 

[amanda1112]

Supermarkets tend to undercut butchers and greengrocers. Its unfortunate because lots of small businesses struggle because of this. People like the idea of going to their local butchers etc because its a personal service. However, people also like to save money and one stop shopping is more convenient and supermarkets are cheaper. Over the years I have seen so many greengrocers and butchers shops close because of this. Its a shame as the giants have the power. They buy fruit and veg in bulk from overseas and at low prices too.

 

[Lee Jones Jnr]

Supermarkets tend to undercut butchers and greengrocers. Its unfortunate because lots of small businesses struggle because of this. People like the idea of going to their local butchers etc because its a personal service. However, people also like to save money and one stop shopping is more convenient and supermarkets are cheaper. Over the years I have seen so many greengrocers and butchers shops close because of this. Its a shame as the giants have the power. They buy fruit and veg in bulk from overseas and at low prices too.

Hmmmm.
Never seen a good quality butchers go under.

 

[TheBlogshop]

As long as you research your market and your competitors properly, there's no reason why it couldn't be a success.

What I would recommend with a greengrocers, however, is that you're as confident as you can be that you're going to get enough trade to stay afloat - I don't think it would be difficult convincing people that your fruit or veg is of a better quality than a supermarket's, but it's convincing them that it's good enough to visit your shop rather than buy it at the supermarket, especially if it's out of their way and they'd have to pay for extra petrol and parking.

I buy most of our fruit and vegetables at the supermarket, even though I know of a handful of different greengrocers I could use - it's simply the fact that they're out of my way and nine times out of 10, I don't have the time to visit them, even though I'd love to and I'd happily pay more for better quality produce.

 

[Deleted member 61074]

Try to stock as much local produce as possible, and be competitive pricewise. Do boxes and investigate supplying local restaurants takeaways etc.

I make the extra trip to my local greengrocer, some things are cheaper some are more expensive. But one thing the local greengrocer doesnt do is prepack, eg I don't want 3 peppers (red, green, orange) I hate green peppers!

 

[Faevilangel]

There is a need for green grocers IMHO as the supermarket stuff is crap, we have had 2 green grocers open in our tiny town centre in the last 12 months and both are always busy, we have a large Tesco and a Waitrose but people prefer to buy in the green grocer.

 

[OptiRick]

There is a need for green grocers IMHO as the supermarket stuff is crap, we have had 2 green grocers open in our tiny town centre in the last 12 months and both are always busy, we have a large Tesco and a Waitrose but people prefer to buy in the green grocer.

That's refreshing to hear.

The opinion I hear the most is that people can't be arsed going into more than one store for their shopping so would rather have a load of bland, mass produced crap as long as they can shove it all in one basket.

Good luck to the OP if you go ahead with it. If it was in my town I would shop with you.

 

[Matt1959]

I think people just want decent produce. Crunchy apples, fresh tomatos and peppers etc not the hit and miss junk from supermarkets. I love apples but I dont bother with them too much as one day they're lovely and crunchy the next purchase they are like cotton wool.

My opinion of independants rightly or wrongly would be that buying a crate of apples at the wholesalers that are cheaper because they are near sell by date is too good a chance to pass up as profit rules everything these days...

If as a fruit and veg seller, you can guarantee your produce is in tip top condition every day then surely people will flock to you and price will be secondary..

 

[OptiRick]

I think people just want decent produce.

I know it's not fruit/veg but,

I was in Lidl the other day, I was looking in a freezer for some garlic bread (it's the future) and the couple next to me were getting animated about a twin pack of cottage pies for £2.

At the risk of sounding like a snob, which I am far from,
I expect it depends on where you are based and what type of people live there. Our town seems capable of supporting any number of kebab shops but there is only one greengrocer and that doubles as a florist.

 

[AndyBlue]

I suggest you try and get some catering business (Pubs/Small hotels etc) to supplement any retail income. a) It will help your produce to move through so not left with product going off, b) Provide a steady income c) Allow you to negotiate better prices at the wholesale markets to provide higher margins. My parents used to own a greengrocers before having to close it so just be prepared for long hours and cold weather, but I do think as others have said with a USP there is definetely a market.

 

[GeorgeStrait]

Ignore the doom merchants, greengrocers are still in abundance. Not in your large towns though, but very many market towns still have a butchers, bakers and greengrocers.

So providing your not planning on setting up in the middle of Manchester you stand every chance of making it a success.

 

[jane p]

Supermarkets tend to undercut butchers and greengrocers. Its unfortunate because lots of small businesses struggle because of this. People like the idea of going to their local butchers etc because its a personal service. However, people also like to save money and one stop shopping is more convenient and supermarkets are cheaper. Over the years I have seen so many greengrocers and butchers shops close because of this. Its a shame as the giants have the power. They buy fruit and veg in bulk from overseas and at low prices too.

this is a myth. Supermarkets are generally more expensive on meat.

 

[jane p]

Hmmmm.
Never seen a good quality butchers go under.

What he said especially if they offer a niche as well that the supermarkets dont do like free marination ha.

 

[Big boss]

Thanks for all the positive feedback,and I have taken it all on board.I know supermarkets are one of my strongest competitors as their aggressive pricing squeezes the small retailers out.The idea of getting local pubs,restaurants and various other concerns would give me the extra turnover,and I think by adding other lines like a deli counter or general grocery items and good customer service would give me a little edge-I hope...
Many thanks

 

[matt seymour]

I think the success or failure of this will depend almost 100% on the location. In many towns the High Street is dying a slow and painful death and very few food stores of any kind are present on them anymore.

On the other hand, some small High Streets are doing very well. If you know the area well, you should be able to make an informed decision. Think about the kind of shops that have come and gone over the past few years, the ones that were there for years and then disappeared without trace or the ones that opened and were gone again in the blink of an eye. What shops vanished when Tesco, Asda, Sainsburys or Morrisons opened up their big out of town store nearby?

One thing I wouldn't do is open a greengrocers (or any shop for that matter) in an area I was unfamiliar with or knew nothing about. With the way things are at the moment it's a massive risk even with good local knowledge.

Personally, I wouldn't even consider what you are suggesting at the moment.

If you go for it, my only suggestion is source all your produce locally if possible and make a big deal of that fact. Maybe try and go for the old fashioned approach. Have your produce in pretty little wicker baskets rather than cardboard boxes etc etc, a little bell that rings when the shop door opens and closes and all that kind of thing. People like all that. Maybe even go to your local Womens Institute or a centre for old people and ask them to make some of their home made jams and chutneys to sell in your shop? Don't try and compete with the supermarket's - offer them an alternative, something different.

 

[Demagix]

Ideas for a fruit and veg shop?

Selling fruit and veg? I know it sounds 'cocky', but I'm serious!

Most small fruit and veg shops don't supply quality products, just excuses of what they should be selling.

As for being profitable, I suppose it all depends on how good you're customer service is, the products (quality), and whether the price is right. And also (of course) and threats (competitors).

 

[Philip Hoyle]

Make sure that you're an expert in fruit & veg. Research the market, research your products, You need to know the difference between a golden delicious and a granny smith. I know this sounds obvious, but far too many people try to run a business without having the rudimentary knowledge of their product. It's far more than buying at £x and selling at £y.

You need to build up a customer base as repeat custom is essential. You need to give your customers a reason for coming back. Price isn't a viable reason, so you need something else, which can be your exceptional product knowledge, offering help and advice, having the widest possible range of fruit & veg, i.e. several varieties of each item, plus a few unusual/exotic items. Offer sample tasters to encourage customers to try something new. You have to really engage with your customers - build up a rapport etc.

It goes without saying that you need fresh produce - don't try to sell stuff past its best and never run out of things - quite a hard balance to strike but is easier once you've got a critical mass of customers and diverse customers such as local cafes and restaurants even if you've got to heavily discount to get the contracts - you need to be able to turnover the stock quickly. Expect very heavy losses in the early days as you're building up the customer base.

As already said above, location will be the key. I really wouldn't bother trying to open in the City Centre, especially if it's pedestrianised or has limited parking or congestion. There's a reason why there are so few food shops on the main shopping streets - it's because the shoppers there don't want to buy food. You need a market town, or a parade of shops on a major road, somewhere where customers can park easily so that they can hop in and out quickly and easily (not have to drag a heavy bag across town and up the stairs to the multi story!). Close to a primary school would be good - we have a butchers nears ours and it's usually queued up at 4pm with mothers buying meat for tea after they've picked up their kids. But it does need to be with other shops, such as a post office, newsagents, Spar, butchers, etc., so that people can pop into buy fruit after they've bought their paper or posted a letter. I'd really be looking away from town centres - look at market towns, larger villages (especially those with main roads through them) but make sure that customers can park outside relatively easily, i.e. a small shared car park, or a forecourt, or on-street parking or whatever. Whatever people may have you believe, most people still use their cars extensively and want to be able to park and shop quickly and easily. You're never going to get people to lug a heavy bag of spuds on a number 14 bus if they don't have to, so not being car-friendly is a reason for people not to shop with you.

 

[jhardy2008]

i think for this first you need to contact with local fruit and vegetables wholesale suppliers. And then you can search a center place of market for your shop.

 

[Ding]

I wouldn't advise a fruit and veg shop selling to the public. I live in a market town where one doesn't exist. It's either the supermarkets or the open market in the town square.
There used to be dozens of stalls, and one owner I knew made a million. Now there are only a couple left trading. They are cheaper than supermarkets, but when parking at £3 ph is taken into consideration, not worth it.

I would aim to sell to the catering trade. No rent or rates. No heavy start up costs. A van to pick up from the wholesaler and deliver, leaflets and cards, and you're away.
You won't have the wastage problems, as your orders will be phoned into you, or better, you ring them.
You don't need to be as knowledgeable, as the head chef will know what he wants.

The most important things are top quality produce and reliability. Menus being planned in advance, won't allow for something being missed from the delivery.

There is a market for this, and most premises would give you a try. You'd be surprised at the rubbish that turns up and how it sends the kitchen into a stress zone.

The best thing about b2b is if it all went belly up, you wouldn't be responsible for a shop lease.

 

[GeorgeStrait]

I wouldn't advise a fruit and veg shop selling to the public. I live in a market town where one doesn't exist. It's either the supermarkets or the open market in the town square.
There used to be dozens of stalls, and one owner I knew made a million. Now there are only a couple left trading. They are cheaper than supermarkets, but when parking at £3 ph is taken into consideration, not worth it.

I would aim to sell to the catering trade. No rent or rates. No heavy start up costs. A van to pick up from the wholesaler and deliver, leaflets and cards, and you're away.
You won't have the wastage problems, as your orders will be phoned into you, or better, you ring them.
You don't need to be as knowledgeable, as the head chef will know what he wants.

The most important things are top quality produce and reliability. Menus being planned in advance, won't allow for something being missed from the delivery.

There is a market for this, and most premises would give you a try. You'd be surprised at the rubbish that turns up and how it sends the kitchen into a stress zone.

The best thing about b2b is if it all went belly up, you wouldn't be responsible for a shop lease.

Yea, but the OP doesn't want to wholesale, they want to retail. It's two totally different businesses.

 

[Ding]

Yea, but the OP doesn't want to wholesale, they want to retail. It's two totally different businesses.

What I described isn't wholesaling, Wholesaling would be buying from the grower to sell onto a business.
Some who own shops also sell to trade. I simply think opening a shop is fraught with difficulties unless the OP knows the trade well.
This way, no great knowledge is required as he delivers what is ordered. Chef knows, wholesaler knows. Just take in the box and leave it with the invoice.
They could always open a retail business later, but why have all the overheads and the fickle public too?

 

[bowlingcharles]

Hi
I have been pondering on the idea of opening a shop selling fruit and vegetables in my town.Since this is a total change of what I do for my day job,i would like to hear from other forum users on good pointers on getting started and what outlay costs are involved.Is it also profitable and what kind of margins are their to be made?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Antonio

Hi selling fuit and vegetables is a good business because it's something to it. Just make sure the location of your shop will be a good market... And you have to determine how much fruits and vegetables can you sell in a day, that way you can avoid storing to much in your shop. I will you well and may your business grows

 

[bowlingcharles]

Try to determine if you have a good market, in that way you will have the idea how much fruit and vegetable you will store in your shop, since this are perishable. But that idea is brilliant to sell food and vegetable.

 

[I Love Spreadsheets]

This takes me back - My first ever job was working in a fruit and veg shop called the Veg Rack. I have often thought about going back to it. A few ideas;

1. A delivery service - As a rule people dont tend to trust supermarket online ordering when it comes to fresh produce (fruit, veg, meat etc) as they dont get to pick the freshest produce there. If you offered a delivery service that always delivered the freshest produce you are already ahead of the supermarkets.

2. Selling to other local businesses such as pubs, restaurants, hotels and venues is vital. There are not many green grocers who get by with out this. Maybe offering pre-prepared veg (ready pealed spuds, diced onions etc maybe a value added service you could provide if you invest in the equipment)

3. Most regular customers will buy the same set of fruit and veg every time they come in to your shop. Run a pre-order service so every Mrs Smith can come in and collect x, y & z without any hassle. If they dont collect when they should, simply put the stock back on the shelf.

Hope they help

 

[Bruvver]

A word of caution if you know nothing about the trade.

How often and how much to buy to stock your shop ?
How to care for an extremely perishable product.

I should think it would take years to learn the basics to maintain tip top goods at all times.

 

[Ding]

This takes me back - My first ever job was working in a fruit and veg shop called the Veg Rack. I have often thought about going back to it. A few ideas;

1. A delivery service - As a rule people dont tend to trust supermarket online ordering when it comes to fresh produce (fruit, veg, meat etc) as they dont get to pick the freshest produce there. If you offered a delivery service that always delivered the freshest produce you are already ahead of the supermarkets.

2. Selling to other local businesses such as pubs, restaurants, hotels and venues is vital. There are not many green grocers who get by with out this. Maybe offering pre-prepared veg (ready pealed spuds, diced onions etc maybe a value added service you could provide if you invest in the equipment)

3. Most regular customers will buy the same set of fruit and veg every time they come in to your shop. Run a pre-order service so every Mrs Smith can come in and collect x, y & z without any hassle. If they dont collect when they should, simply put the stock back on the shelf.

Hope they help

1. Yes.

2. Yes and No. Employing a commis or kitchen hand, why pay a premium for ready prepared? Besides, do you know the logistics in pre-prepped potatoes? There is a market for pre-prepared, see below.*

3.Unless OP takes payment from Mrs Smith ahead of her collection, they would be commiting financial suicide. Five Mrs Smiths a day and they are dead.

* Not telling, sometimes people have to figure it out themselves.

OP, if you want to retail, listen to others.

I am neither a caterer, nor a supplier, but have witnessed the whole process, from luxury spas to huge staff canteens, catering from management to workers. What is required is fresh produce, and a reliable service.

What I suggest is the easiest route.

In fact, I might do it myself.

ETA. I hope you're not an accountant, I love spreadsheets.

 

[deniser]

We only have one in the vicinity. It looks really busy all the time and has been there for ever.

But I found out recently they are struggling and wish they could close if they weren't tied in to their lease.

Worst thing is you have to get up a midnight to go to the markets and then spend the whole day in the shop ie. no time for sleep or a life.

Do not be deceived by how busy they look. Once you factor in rent, rates and staff, it's impossible to make money.

 

[I Love Spreadsheets]

1. Yes.

2. Yes and No. Employing a commis or kitchen hand, why pay a premium for ready prepared? Besides, do you know the logistics in pre-prepped potatoes? There is a market for pre-prepared, see below.*

3.Unless OP takes payment from Mrs Smith ahead of her collection, they would be commiting financial suicide. Five Mrs Smiths a day and they are dead.
.

2. Yes a lot of these people will employ people specifically to do this, but there are times when they have to cover sick leave, holidays and even busy periods where they simply don't have the people. A potato peeler machine can be had for less than £500 and all you do is put the spuds in one end and wait for the peeled ones to come out of the bottom. Not exactly going to add a massive premium but enables the OP to offer additional services. When selling to a hotel, if they know you can provide services like that and potentially get them out of a hole in the future, the sale is going to be a lot easier. I dare say a few chip shops would be interested in ready peeled spuds as well. It is a market to investigate though - There is a reason why places like Costco sell ready diced onions and other prepared veggies.

3. I have to disagree with you on that one. If Mrs Smith comes in every Tuesday to pick up a 5lb bag of spuds, a couple of pounds of carrots and some fruit, what expense is there in putting those aside for just 1 day. If she doesn't come in Tuesday for them, they go back in to stock Wednesday. All the OP would have wasted is a couple of minutes weighing them out. Looking at the big picture there is now a tie to keep Mrs Smith coming back every Tuesday. She doesn't have to come back every Tuesday but she is likely to feel obliged to come back.

The OP is competing against the likes of Tesco's and Asda's so these little touches will make them stand out as providing better services.

 

[I Love Spreadsheets]

We only have one in the vicinity. It looks really busy all the time and has been there for ever.

But I found out recently they are struggling and wish they could close if they weren't tied in to their lease.

Worst thing is you have to get up a midnight to go to the markets and then spend the whole day in the shop ie. no time for sleep or a life.

Do not be deceived by how busy they look. Once you factor in rent, rates and staff, it's impossible to make money.

Just because the one place you know doesnt make money it doesnt mean it is not possible to make money. Businesses of all kinds fail everyday, just because this one green grocer is failing it doesn't doom the whole industry.

In Cardiff we have fruit and veg stalls dotted around the main streets. They are the same size and layout as most bugger type trailers. Their pitches cost between £50k and £100k per year, plus rates. They are doing just fine and would take on more pitches if they could get them.

If the OP does his research and provides a good service he should be able to pull it off

 

[Ding]

We only have one in the vicinity. It looks really busy all the time and has been there for ever.

But I found out recently they are struggling and wish they could close if they weren't tied in to their lease.

Worst thing is you have to get up a midnight to go to the markets and then spend the whole day in the shop ie. no time for sleep or a life.

Do not be deceived by how busy they look. Once you factor in rent, rates and staff, it's impossible to make money.

Applause for sense from deniser.

You can make money, but not as retail with the overheads etc. Seems like the OP has scarpered anyway.
Probably frightened off with talk of hard work.

 

[Hedgie]

I would seriously be careful about opening retail premises in ths climate and you would be well advised to do your market research before hand.

There is an element of truth in the pricing aspect in that the supermarkets can be cheaper for quite a lot of products. The plus side is in offering a free delivery service to your customers and giving the personal touch. You will win hands down on quality and service which as someone pointed out will take priority over price.

 

[I Love Spreadsheets]

Here is my theory as to why shops struggle and why we have seen so many big retail names fail recently.

The cost of leasing a retail unit is directly related to the amount of business you can expect to do in that unit. Units in busy high streets are naturally more expensive to lease than those in side streets - Its just basic supply and demand.

When the amount of business available drops, the cost of leases will follow (eventually), however most of these bigger companies have 10, 15 or longer leases. As a result these shop owners are paying lot higher leases than the property currently commands based on the amount of business available.

Hence Thorntons trying to off load shops and Allied Carpets saying they will just let 50 leases expire and wont renew them unless the lease cost is adjusted to reflect the current climate.

We should see the cost of retail units start to drop now (if they havent already), so retailers setting up now may be able to negotiate some bargains.

BTW - I dont think retail is dead by any stretch, it is just going through an evolutionary phase.

 

[deniser]

Just because the one place you know ff

It's not the one place I know, it's the one near to where I live and I used that particular shop as an example of a shop which everyone thinks is doing well because it has been there for a long time and always looks busy but actually isn't.

Having owned shops and being on the inside as opposed to only seeing the view that others get from the outside as a customer I know of of many greengrocers who are struggling.

The only one I know which is successful is only doing well because, behind the scenes, it has a massive wholesale operation supplying fruit and veg to hotels and restaurants.

 

[Ding]

Here is my theory as to why shops struggle and why we have seen so many big retail names fail recently.

The cost of leasing a retail unit is directly related to the amount of business you can expect to do in that unit. Units in busy high streets are naturally more expensive to lease than those in side streets - Its just basic supply and demand.

When the amount of business available drops, the cost of leases will follow (eventually), however most of these bigger companies have 10, 15 or longer leases. As a result these shop owners are paying lot higher leases than the property currently commands based on the amount of business available.

Hence Thorntons trying to off load shops and Allied Carpets saying they will just let 50 leases expire and wont renew them unless the lease cost is adjusted to reflect the current climate.

We should see the cost of retail units start to drop now (if they havent already), so retailers setting up now may be able to negotiate some bargains.

BTW - I dont think retail is dead by any stretch, it is just going through an evolutionary phase.

OT a little, but imo Thorntons did the dirty on their franchisees by selling the products through supermarkets and filling stations. They are now closing their own shops and leaving the franchised ones to struggle on.

 

[GeorgeStrait]

OT a little, but imo Thorntons did the dirty on their franchisees by selling the products through supermarkets and filling stations. They are now closing their own shops and leaving the franchised ones to struggle on.

Actually the products you buy in Thornton's stores isn't available anywhere else, and vice a versa.

 

[Lee Jones Jnr]

Actually the products you buy in Thornton's stores isn't available anywhere else, and vice a versa.

I hate it when people state 'facts' that aren't true.
Are you forgetting most motorway services, lots of petrol stations, most supermarkets, lots of greeting card shops etc? Or are we pretending that what you said is true to help illustrate your point?

 

[I Love Spreadsheets]

Got to agree Deniser it is not something I would tackle without a wholesale operation in the background. Hence my suggestion for pre-prepared veg for hotels etc. Without it you would really need to stand out head and shoulders above other retailers.

On Thorntons, the vast majority of what they sell is available in superstores and service stations etc. The range you see at each of these will depend on what ranges they have agreed to sell. However I have yet to see a non-Thorntons outlet do things like the customisation of easter eggs and other goods