Security

Sussesxguy34 · Jun 8, 2011

Hi

I am looking to start a security business which supplies mobile patrols and key holding to businesses.

I want to try an idea and wanted people's thoughts on it.

My idea is to half the customers costs for mobile patrols. For example, if the customer paid £10,000 a year for security, I would offer to do it for £5000, but the difference would be that the customer would have to pay the £5000 up front for the year. This would be with a safety clause in the contract which would make me refund any mobile patrols that were missed.

As I have low overheads and I would be doing the patrols, I think this would work well for some.

What do you think?

CompactCleaning · Jun 9, 2011

Sounds pretty decent, but the thing is how many people would like to pay for the full year? Say that they don't like your service or no longer require security? or the business goes bust?

Also you say you would be doing the patrols would it be only you?

vvaannmmaann · Jun 9, 2011

But you won't be able to cut your overheads by 50% will you?
Your guards won't take a 50% cut in wages.
The guy doing it for £10k is probably only breaking even.

Atilla · Jun 9, 2011

What a silly idea.

You've clearly not researched the market...or considered how you would gain new contracts and/or expand.

Have you not considered why people have Security Guards/patrols?

Sussesxguy34 · Jun 9, 2011

Hi

What overheads have I got:

A) Insurance

B) Fuel

C) Car costs

D) Paying a Second driver who would share the business with me

E) Equipment

I have already got the vehicle so no need to buy one.

So how I see it, if I ran a business and I could cut my costs by 50%, and I could have a contract which gives me back money if the company doe not perform then i would take it.

And yes getting contracts is a bug bear.

Podge · Jun 9, 2011

A contract offering to refund is worthless if you go bust and have no money.

Pete31 · Jun 9, 2011

why don't you just offer to match the competitors less 10% then spread the cost on a monthly basis.

Forgive me for saying so, but when a company offers half the standard rate, and wants the cash up front, id walk away, sounds a little to much like a scam to me...i'm not saying you are scamming, just that to a customer it can sound like a scam!

when you say, cut your costs by 50%, how can you do that to a business you havent started yet, or do you mean run at 50% of the cost of other firms?

BustersDogs · Jun 9, 2011

"This would be with a safety clause in the contract which would make me refund any mobile patrols that were missed."

This bit would worry me being in the contract! Sounds like you are saying there are likely to be missed patrols so not to worry you get your money back. I would prefer to pay more and know I will get what I am paying for. After all, if didn't *need* the patrols I wouldn't pay for them. I do worry when people try to undercut other people/companies offering the same service, if everyone else is charging around £10k I would wonder why and how you were so cheap.

It happens a lot in dog walking - most people around here charge £10-12 per walk, so when someone pops up and are charging a fiver, what the hell are they doing to be able to afford to work for that little?!

Atilla · Jun 9, 2011

Sussesxguy34 said:
Hi

What overheads have I got:

A) Insurance

B) Fuel

C) Car costs

D) Paying a Second driver who would share the business with me

E) Equipment

I have already got the vehicle so no need to buy one.

So how I see it, if I ran a business and I could cut my costs by 50%, and I could have a contract which gives me back money if the company doe not perform then i would take it.

And yes getting contracts is a bug bear.

And still completely missing the point as to why a Security service may be required.

Sussesxguy34 · Jun 9, 2011

Basically its no good me starting yet another security company and charging similar prices to everyone else because customers which have already security in place are not going to be interested in me.

The only way I can hope to compete is to offer something different. I also had an idea about winning contracts and then selling them to security companies. I know security companies are crying out for customers, so if I came along with a contract worth £20,000 a year then im sure I could get a good some of money out of the security companies.

Other than that I cant see starting a standard security company will be successfull as there are too many out there competeing for business.

TheGuru2010 · Jun 9, 2011

So your whole business model is based on been cheap????

Doesn't sound to clever to me - Have you thought why these companies charge what they do?

In all honesty it this sounds like a chat in the pub business

Consistency · Jun 9, 2011

Firstly - how low can you go? This is just undercutting established businesses and other businesses that have worked hard. It is sleazy but I understand it, a lot do work that way, but halving the cost is severe.

Secondly - if you are only interested in those that do not have any security in place then you are not halving their cost at all because there is no cost. What you are doing is giving an "economy or value range" of services.

Some businesses who do not have security already, may go for it.

Running a security business is not near as easy as you make it sound. It really is not that easy at all.

lockyer · Jun 15, 2011

Have you considered the cost of SIA membership and training? The cost of Efficacy cover (failure to perform)?

Cheap isn't a USP. It's worrying

greenguru · Jun 15, 2011

i think that a yearly contract would be difficult to get people to sign up to. You could maybe give people the option of being able to do that and see how many bite.

Consistency · Jun 18, 2011

There is the love of the industry that should be considered. It is no wonder that the security industry has a bad name. There are too many coming in thinking it is easy money, then getting one over on their clients after taking contracts off other companies, and then leaving that client high and dry and the other companies without their previous contract. The client then feels more insecure and us security companies that are left are then having to try harder to keep our reputation.

This is one of the reasons the business world is in the mess that it is in. I think it is important to love the industry we are in.

TotallySport · Jun 18, 2011

By mobile patrols do you mean you drive round in a van, to different locations andcheck, then move to the next location? Do people still use these, we wouldn't be in the location we are if if thats what was offered.

I don't think getting security contracts is hard, keeping them on the other hand is, our landlord wouldn't give a 12 month contract and money upfront to anyone, past experience says thats a greater risk than not having any security.

Consistency · Jun 18, 2011

For us as a company we do both, Mobile patrols is going from site to site and making checks either at arranged times or at any times. Manned guarding is remaining on site and staying there.

If a business owner or Landlord was to pay up front, it would be indeed a risk and is not something we would ask for, even at a discount. We invoice monthly.

MASSEY · Jun 19, 2011

I used to know some one who did manned guarding. He used to just sit there drinking pilsner all day.

Consistency · Jun 19, 2011

That would be an employee who could not care about his job or just wants to take the pee. It is these that need sacking with immediate effect but of course employment law gets in the way.

Thankfully I can say we do not have that in out company. Though manned guarding can be tedious, the drinking on duty is possibly from boredom but they need to remain alert. The consequences for that company should a burglary or something else take place while they are peed up can be horrendous for the company as well as the security company.

MASSEY · Jun 19, 2011

Consistency said:
That would be an employee who could not care about his job or just wants to take the pee. It is these that need sacking with immediate effect but of course employment law gets in the way.

Thankfully I can say we do not have that in out company. Though manned guarding can be tedious, the drinking on duty is possibly from boredom but they need to remain alert. The consequences for that company should a burglary or something else take place while they are peed up can be horrendous for the company as well as the security company.

Yes he never did his job properly at all. Always asleep on the job and drunk. Cracking work if you can get it

.

Consistency · Jun 19, 2011

A problem for companies like ours if they are lone workers is proving it. Trust is so so important and it is wrong that for the trusted ones they have to put up with routine checks and "tests" for want of a better word so as not to discriminate against the ones who we know may well be tempted to take the rise.

Consistency · Jun 19, 2011

And here is another problem faced by security companies, the walking out of staff who do not realise or care about the seriousness of their actions but still want their wages and are entitled to them.

http://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?p=1665757#post1665757

TotallySport · Jun 19, 2011

Consistency said:
And here is another problem faced by security companies, the walking out of staff who do not realise or care about the seriousness of their actions but still want their wages and are entitled to them.

http://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?p=1665757#post1665757

This i do disagree with, your statment isn't the whole truth, if it was your partner would you have stayed? The rest of my reply is in the other thread

Consistency · Jun 19, 2011

If I was in that situation and it was my partner, I would have tried to do right by both my employer, my partner and the attendees of the site.

Would he have left like this if he was in another job situation? Not all jobs would allow the choice and this is where the freedom gets abused. Would he have walked out if he was a bus driver and just left the bus in the street?

Of course the question was going to come, what would I do in that situation - well in answer to that, I would have been ringing and ringing until I got an answer. If after ringing 10 times or so, yes, that many I may have gone but would have tried and tried.

The girlfriend being pregnant and had miscarriages before HE should have organised an emergency plan when taking and agreeing to do the job. I would have!

TotallySport · Jun 19, 2011

Consistency said:
If I was in that situation and it was my partner, I would have tried to do right by both my employer, my partner and the attendees of the site.

Would he have left like this if he was in another job situation? Not all jobs would allow the choice and this is where the freedom gets abused. Would he have walked out if he was a bus driver and just left the bus in the street?

Of course the question was going to come, what would I do in that situation - well in answer to that, I would have been ringing and ringing until I got an answer. If after ringing 10 times or so, yes, that many I may have gone but would have tried and tried.

The girlfriend being pregnant and had miscarriages before HE should have organised an emergency plan when taking and agreeing to do the job. I would have!

He did have an emergency plan, he left and supported his family, yes he could have done more for the employer, but his family is for life (i hope) and the work as far as the employee was concern was casual, there are very few jobs you couldn't have just walk out of, he could have told veryone to get off the bus, drove back to the depot and gone to his wife. Anyway I think we have both made out points and I will leave it there.

Consistency · Jun 19, 2011

In respect of this thread and the other one that is linked, I do not think security employees realise the consequences of their actions. They have so many perks but they cannot see it. How many jobs really, aside from office jobs allow an employee to take personal calls on their phone at any time? There are many that have to keep their phone in their locker.

Walking out of a job of this nature can have very serious consequences. Some security contracts are VERY strict. For example, if we are contracted to provide manned guarding 24 hours. We agree to that contract and we invoice monthly.

We as a fair company pay staff all the hours they have worked. One member of staff walks out leaving the site with less security as contracted. There is a clause in there to say they can withold payment due to our breaking of contract. There is also a clause to say that we will pay compensation. These can easily run into totals such as £80,000. I do have one in front of me. Excuses will not get us out of that.

So the reality is, and a very real possibility, That company loses the contract, there are redundancies with each employee having to be paid a weeks notice pay minimum, those employees are then without work and are innocent, the company has paid wages but will not themselves get paid, so the security company takes the hit on this, they also have to find the compensation if it goes that far - and why because ONE person walked out without due care and attention and STILL wants to be paid.

In the case of event work, the compensation may not apply but there are people who check to see if the security staff are in attendance as paid for as this is required for their lincencing criteria. This could even mean that very festival being given the no-go for future years.

Staff walking out is more serious than that member of staff can often care to imagine.

Podge · Jun 19, 2011

Isn't the onus then on the employer to ensure cover is available in these eventualities?

TotallySport · Jun 19, 2011

I agree the OP hasn't done the best, but the employer has taken on casual staff, for a casual role, they haven't don't and are not in the line as fare as we know for of security work, and the the employee is a casual worker, being paid £6 an hour.

I understand what your saying, but IMO from what has been said the OP isn't doing one of those jobs and if he was, the employer employing a casual person, not from the security industry gets what they deserve, in those conditions this should be employee a security professional, with the qualifications, experience, and pay to match.

I think we have both made cases for each, without knowing. a whole lot more of the situation we are not going to make any formal definative conclusions, so I wish the OP well and his wife, but I am bugging out.

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