Web Design

[FionaBusiness]

Hello. Has anyone ever used Vanilla Storm or Visual Soft for building their e-commerce site?

 

[InternetMarketingPlatinum]

No let me know how you get on please if you choose to use either of them.

 

[Vision2]

first one has 2008 in copyright footer just to give ya aheads up

 

[InternetMarketingPlatinum]

Oh right they're web design companies, sorry I assumed they were e-commerce builds. We'll quote you if you want?

 

[InternetMarketingPlatinum]

By the way, Visual Soft's website looks great doesn't it?

 

[Poppy Design]

no but I like some of their websites on Vanilla Storm!

 

[sanjiv]

No I haven't. Have you have a quotation from them?

 

[pool guy]

i use a company called MI-STORE they are good and you can fined them on line!!

 

[FionaBusiness]

I'll definitely let you know if I go with them.

Hmmm yeah, I noticed the 2008 thing too for Vanilla Storm, which I thought was really bad, but the sites they have produced look great and many of them are in the jewellery market like me.

The Visual Soft stuff also looks amazing. I'm just not sure. It's a pity noone has actually dealt with either.

How much would you expect to pay for a bespoke site?

 

[InternetMarketingPlatinum]

I'll definitely let you know if I go with them.

Hmmm yeah, I noticed the 2008 thing too for Vanilla Storm, which I thought was really bad, but the sites they have produced look great and many of them are in the jewellery market like me.

The Visual Soft stuff also looks amazing. I'm just not sure. It's a pity noone has actually dealt with either.

How much would you expect to pay for a bespoke site?

Depends if you also require EPOS integration? Around £6000 to £10000 as a guide. Arrange a meeting with both, they should provide a free web design consultation.

 

[Vision2]

I'll definitely let you know if I go with them.

Hmmm yeah, I noticed the 2008 thing too for Vanilla Storm, which I thought was really bad, but the sites they have produced look great and many of them are in the jewellery market like me.

The Visual Soft stuff also looks amazing. I'm just not sure. It's a pity noone has actually dealt with either.

How much would you expect to pay for a bespoke site?

bespoke can mean a lot of things, depends on the spec. But expect it to start at 8k+ at least.

Or use a system like Magento, couple grand.

If you want to dump more cashflow into it, Magento also offers a Enterprise version with a annual cost, development cost is much highier obviously.

Enterprise, expect to pay 8k+
Magento Community Edition, expect to pay 1200 - 6k

All boils down to what you are after, the product setup, what payment gateways you are after, level of other work such as SEO, or bringing on a SEO company to deal with that.

You need to write out a full spec before anyone could possibly give you some sort of ballpark figure.

just dont forget you need cashflow there in addition for marketing etc. People always forget to bring that into the equation!

 

[FionaBusiness]

Thanks guys, that's really helpful!

I'm thinking investing in a bespoke site is a bit like investing in a whole new/separate business. Real expansion. Which is what I'm after.

 

[Vision2]

Thanks guys, that's really helpful!

I'm thinking investing in a bespoke site is a bit like investing in a whole new/separate business. Real expansion. Which is what I'm after.

just bare in mind, bespoke stuff comes with on going cost for the expansion. Also to note is the development cycle, if you shift the site from that coder to another, they may have issues with improving it, and you may find it difficult to find an alternative company who can carry on with it without havign to rewrite everything.

Just somethign to keep in mind.

I would strongly advise Magento, it's a heavy weight system in my opinion and does everything most people want. If there is something that it can't do, it boils down to cashflow to create the modules/modifications.

Scalable as well, so keeps in sync for the future.

The benefits of Magento is it's constantly evolving, improving, bug fixing and has great people behind it, as well as a lot of high profile clients who utilise it.

Gap.co.uk for example is on magento. Plenty of others, have a mooch around

Also, don't forget, with any eCommerce site, continued investment is needed! don't just deploy and leave it to sit there without doing anything with it.

 

[Deleted member 69689]

Hi Fiona,

If you're interest I could also give you a quote.

You can check out my portfolio at: http://ikreativ.com

Cheers,
Scott.

 

[FionaBusiness]

Hi Fiona,

If you're interest I could also give you a quote.

You can check out my portfolio at: http://ikreativ.com

Cheers,
Scott.

Thanks Scott - do you do e-commerce? I'll have a look...

 

[Deleted member 69689]

Thanks Scott - do you do e-commerce? I'll have a look...

Yes I do. Either bespoke or out-of-the-box solutions customised to suit.

 

[FionaBusiness]

just bare in mind, bespoke stuff comes with on going cost for the expansion.

I would strongly advise Magento

Also, don't forget, with any eCommerce site, continued investment is needed! don't just deploy and leave it to sit there without doing anything with it.

Thanks for your help. I think Magento is American based - I'd rather go with a UK company if possible.

 

[Deleted member 69689]

Thanks for your help. I think Magento is American based - I'd rather go with a UK company if possible.

Hey Fiona,

Magento is actually just the ecommerce software, it would be yours, hosted on your server wherever that is.

 

[Vision2]

Thanks for your help. I think Magento is American based - I'd rather go with a UK company if possible.

It's a global system, www.gap.co.uk use it for example.

 

[Deleted member 69689]

Depending on what functionality you actually require, one of the off-the-shelf ecommerce solutions may actually be suitable.

I'm not talking about look and feel, any of the off-the-shelf solutions can be made to look however you want, and unless you really, really need a specific bespoke feature that the off-the-shelf solutions do not have you could save yourself quite a lot of money and still have a great website.

Just a thought.

 

[Deleted member 69689]

I like Magento, it's pretty good, but it can be a little bloated and have more features than most people need, but good nonetheless.

 

[Vision2]

I like Magento, it's pretty good, but it can be a little bloated and have more features than most people need, but good nonetheless.

scaled to fit pretty much any business, small / medium / large / crazy large, giving you the same tools that the big boys have at their disposal.

This can only be described as a good thing. Client can then utilise these tools more and more.

Also, the way Magento works is you can utilise the more complicated things further down the line, as you get more and more used to using the system.

in my opinion, a good system is one that doesn't restrict you from growth, scope, has the tools at hand to use or not to use. Ability to throw more time / effort at it to make a much more appealing site that acturally works as opposed to something that is what it is and that's basically it.

Good stuff!

 

[Deleted member 69689]

You also need to consider how you are going to take payments through the site too. Whether you're going to use a gateway like PayPal, Google Checkout and the like, or a more featured Gateway like a merchant facility from your bank.

Both have pros and cons, especially if you require instant automatic payments through a bank merchant facility such as HSBC.

Their API's can be a nightmare to integrate and would obviously cost more in development time. You'd also need to purchase an SSL certificate to do it this way in accordance with current PCI requirements.

Just things to think about.

 

[Deleted member 69689]

scaled to fit pretty much any business, small / medium / large / crazy large, giving you the same tools that the big boys have at their disposal.

This can only be described as a good thing. Client can then utilise these tools more and more.

Also, the way Magento works is you can utilise the more complicated things further down the line, as you get more and more used to using the system.

in my opinion, a good system is one that doesn't restrict you from growth, scope, has the tools at hand to use or not to use. Ability to throw more time / effort at it to make a much more appealing site that acturally works as opposed to something that is what it is and that's basically it.

Good stuff!

It can also be buggy, and fixing a buggy Magento install is not good at the best of times...

 

[Vision2]

It can also be buggy, and fixing a buggy Magento install is not good at the best of times...

Every system has it's bugs, using the latest version which is effectively beta would be crazy 1.3.x as opposed to 1.4.0 for sites at the moment and for the next 2 - 3 months until 1.4 hits the 1.4.1 marker. Same can be said for any system, or the very operating system you are currently using, everything has bugs in it. 1.4 has only been out for a few weeks or so.

As far as payment gateways goes, magento has all the usual suspects, HSBC / PayPal Express / PayPal Pro / Google Checkout etc as you mentioned above, various other also.

All businesses should have a SSL (Secure Certificate) setup, but this is a bugger all annual amount that all sites should endure.

Also to note, most peoples issues with Magento is not understanding its requirements, hosting and the people needed on board. This isn't a oscommerce system, it's a proper system for proper shops who want to do real business online.

Magento is a big boys toy

 

[Deleted member 69689]

Every system has it's bugs, using the latest version which is effectively beta would be crazy 1.3.x as opposed to 1.4.0 for sites at the moment and for the next 2 - 3 months until 1.4 hits the 1.4.1 marker. Same can be said for any system, or the very operating system you are currently using, everything has bugs in it. 1.4 has only been out for a few weeks or so.

As far as payment gateways goes, magento has all the usual suspects, HSBC / PayPal Express / PayPal Pro / Google Checkout etc as you mentioned above, various other also.

All businesses should have a SSL (Secure Certificate) setup, but this is a bugger all annual amount that all sites should endure.

Also to note, most peoples issues with Magento is not understanding its requirements, hosting and the people needed on board. This isn't a oscommerce system, it's a proper system for proper shops who want to do real business online.

Magento is a big boys toy

Yes, I know, I've built around 20 Magento stores.

 

[FionaBusiness]

Depending on what functionality you actually require, one of the off-the-shelf ecommerce solutions may actually be suitable.

I'm not talking about look and feel, any of the off-the-shelf solutions can be made to look however you want, and unless you really, really need a specific bespoke feature that the off-the-shelf solutions do not have you could save yourself quite a lot of money and still have a great website.

Just a thought.

Yes, when I was speaking to a company today they emphasized how great bespoke sites are and what they can do for a business but there was some discussion about a "pre-boxed" site. Mainly as a stepping stone towards something bespoke though.

Lots to think about...

 

[Deleted member 69689]

Yes, when I was speaking to a company today they emphasized how great bespoke sites are and what they can do for a business but there was some discussion about a "pre-boxed" site. Mainly as a stepping stone towards something bespoke though.

Lots to think about...

Honestly Fiona, it really all depends on the functionality you require. If you don't require anything to elaborate then an off-the-shelf would work, and that doesn't mean you couldn't have a bespoke design incorporated into the off-the-shelf build.

If you need anymore help or info Fiona just pop me a PM or email.

Cheers,
Scott.

 

[Deleted member 69689]

Every system has it's bugs, using the latest version which is effectively beta would be crazy 1.3.x as opposed to 1.4.0 for sites at the moment and for the next 2 - 3 months until 1.4 hits the 1.4.1 marker. Same can be said for any system, or the very operating system you are currently using, everything has bugs in it. 1.4 has only been out for a few weeks or so.

As far as payment gateways goes, magento has all the usual suspects, HSBC / PayPal Express / PayPal Pro / Google Checkout etc as you mentioned above, various other also.

All businesses should have a SSL (Secure Certificate) setup, but this is a bugger all annual amount that all sites should endure.

Also to note, most peoples issues with Magento is not understanding its requirements, hosting and the people needed on board. This isn't a oscommerce system, it's a proper system for proper shops who want to do real business online.

Magento is a big boys toy

Also Vision, Magento can be a resource hog for larger stores (5000+ products) that run on shared hosting, I've found this a couple of times and had to get them moved onto dedicated servers.

 

[Vision2]

Also Vision, Magento can be a resource hog for larger stores (5000+ products) that run on shared hosting, I've found this a couple of times and had to get them moved onto dedicated servers.

yup, i have dedicated servers to host my clients sites on.

Shared / vps etc, doesn't cut it.

Needs dedicated / cloud.

You wouldnt skimp on hosting now through would you?

 

[Deleted member 69689]

yup, i have dedicated servers to host my clients sites on.

Shared / vps etc, doesn't cut it.

Needs dedicated / cloud.

You wouldnt skimp on hosting now through would you?

I'm a designer/developer, I leave hosting to hosting companies.

 

[MartCactus]

Also Vision, Magento can be a resource hog for larger stores (5000+ products) that run on shared hosting, I've found this a couple of times and had to get them moved onto dedicated servers.

5000 isn't really a large store. We've just built one using our .net software that has around 1 million products in it. Its running on pretty standard dedicated server, but using only a fraction of the resources. 5000 should be fine on shared hosting I'd imagine if its setup properly (don't know much about Magento but people speak highly of it).

 

[edmondscommerce]

In all honesty a site of this size would really work best on a VPS server.

It all depends how fast you want it to be - the more products you have the more things like search start to slow down..

interested to know how you manage site search on a store with a 7 figure SKU count?

I'm currently looking into things like Solr for this kind of requirement

 

[asraconsulting]

We can discuss , i think we can do this in more less than the price mentioned in this thread

thanks

 

[dotkix]

Fiona,is this the first time you have ever opened an online store??? if not,my advise to you would be to start small then work your way up.spending £8000 on a bespoke site is insane.To even make sales from such a site,you would need to spend even more on SEO,PPC and viral marketing.So it does not stop at £8000 or whatever you have been quoted.

Its nice to have a bespoke site with all the giggle bells and flashing lights,but if you cannot make sales from it its just not viable.

If you are a start up,it might be best to start really small and work it out from there.I have know many people and have dealt with many people who spend tens of thousands on a website with absolutely no results.

To start you off in the eCom world,I could let you have some space on my server and i will install osCommerce for you.You could use google checkout or paypal.If you have a RBS account or HSBC I can integrate it into your site...wait for it....

FOR FREE!!!

All you need to do is buy a domain and change the DNS to my server.Once your site starts making sales,then you can see in what direction you want to go in the online world.you can get a domain for £3.99 from heart internet and there many OSC designers out there that will customize the site the way you want it.i could even get you the people to do it.

Please,before you spend thousands on a website,plan it first with friends,family and colleges AND a professional in the field.make sure that it is 100% viable for you to start up a website and with you spending that amount of money PLUS the necessary ongoing cost.

Start small and see where it gets you.Remember that social networking and viral video marketing is virtually free,it can make you loads of money and send the right kind of traffic to your products.

Sorry for my rant,its just that io have seen way to many people invest in a website and loose it all.I even met one person who spent £380,000 on a website and he had a burn rate of £8,000 per month and it made her nothing back.

Please have a real think about your site goals before pouring your money into it.Web designers are more than happy to take your money so please get advice,and get advice on that advice and see where you end up.


Just my advice from experience. and my two cents.

 

[dotkix]

do u know any free website maker?

Wwhat type of site are you wanting to make?>

 

[jelly3]

both are good but Vanilla Storm! is best

Can you qualify that?
Why is it the best?