Customer Expectations - returns rant yet again !

[deniser]

I can't believe a customer just rang me and shouted down the phone that she had returned a garment by special delivery but her refund wasn't in her account the day we received the parcel.

I had to explain:
a. we didn't receive it the next day because delivery was attempted before we opened so we got it the next working day after the weekend
b. we process returns as soon as we can - in batches twice a week Tuesday and Friday - not the minute we get each parcel
c. even when we do process the return it still takes 3-5 working days for the money to reach the customer's account
d. by law we have 28 days to process a refund
e. we give priority to outgoing parcels

She carried on ranting and raving and said "why did I use special delivery then" as if we had asked her to! And I told her that the value of the contents was insured but it didn't guarantee that we would process it immediately.

I said that had she telephoned us saying she needed the money urgently we would have pulled the parcel out and done it straight away.

She then said "well I won't buy from you again" as if that's some kind of threat - would I really want a customer that only bought things to return them and then shouted at me?!

Just wondering what the rest of you do with returns - how fast do you process them on receiving them? I didn't think twice a week was unreasonable!

 

[sysops]

We process them the day they arrive, but you're right, it can take several days for the money to appear on their card statement (5-6 days is not uncommon - it varies between card providers).

The big retailers take a lot longer - 2-3 weeks is quite common.

 

[Mister B]

We process them, wherever possible, on the day that they arrive. In peak periods, this may stretch out to around 48 hours. That being said though, your customer has no right to speak to you like that. IMO, this is when being your own boss comes in to its own...you can politely tell her that her business is no longer welcome. Should you so wish. Mister B

 

[deniser]

I was very firm back - I had customers in the shop at the time and they were laughing........

 

[BrightIdeas]

Grrr.... !! Returns!!!

Well, still pretty new to this, but I do mine within 48 hours.

My return rate is currently 10%, but if I could lower it, it would make me happier!

 

[BrightIdeas]

BTW, that customer was obviously a bit stupid.

 

[downsouth]

Grrr.... !! Returns!!!

Well, still pretty new to this, but I do mine within 48 hours.

My return rate is currently 10%, but if I could lower it, it would make me happier!

Wow, seems very high to me

Any reasons given for the returns?

 

[sysops]

Wow, seems very high to me

You can't judge the ;eve; of returns without knowing what they sell. Return rates vary hugely depending on the nature of the product - some sectors have 10-20%, others 1-2%.

 

[BrightIdeas]

Exactly! We sell bridal accessories and wedding jewellery. Mid-to-higher end of the market. Our customers are very specific about what they're looking for because they perceive what they are buying as being very important. Even when good product images/descriptions are given, sometimes you just can't tell what it's going to look like with the rest of your attire until you actually try it on.

Like this morning, a customer bought two pairs of shoes with the view to returning one anyway.

That's fair enough and just something that we need to build into what we're doing - process wise and costing wise.

 

[downsouth]

Agreed, would like to know the product but to me something must be

a) wrong with the product, faulty design etc
b) perhaps the physical product does not meet the description advertised

 

[TheBrennands]

Hmmm, I hope I don't offend here, but my honest opinion is that while the customer is wrong to ring up shouting, your returns policy would make me pretty mad if I was a customer ......

You want customers to pay immediately when they place an order, and would not like it if customers were ordering and then saying 'well, I only pay for things twice a week so will do it on Friday' ..... returns should really be processed with the same speed that customers pay for their orders if you want to really give a good service.

I'm not sure why you would tell a customer you have 28 days by law to refund, as that would just get their back up, as would telling them that you give priority to sales rather than refunds ....... suggesting that once you have their money, any further service they receive will be a second rate one.

The way a business deals with returns and refunds can lose them a lot of business or gain them a lot of business ... it might be worth re-thinking your policy

As I said, no offence meant, I am just saying it how I see it

Cathy

 

[sysops]

Hmmm, I hope I don't offend here, but my honest opinion is that while the customer is wrong to ring up shouting, your returns policy would make me pretty mad if I was a customer ......

You want customers to pay immediately when they place an order, and would not like it if customers were ordering and then saying 'well, I only pay for things twice a week so will do it on Friday' ..... returns should really be processed with the same speed that customers pay for their orders if you want to really give a good service.

<snip>

The way a business deals with returns and refunds can lose them a lot of business or gain them a lot of business ... it might be worth re-thinking your policy

Much business experience, have we?

The 48 hour processing time Deniser operates (Tuesdays and Fridays, remember?) is significantly faster than the industry average, once you take into account how the large retailers operate.

Additionally, as has been stated several times, regardless of how much the customer may want to see the money back in their account, our banking system just doesn't work that way. When you make a refund to a Credit or Debit Card, it takes several days for this to appear on their statement. We've had customers complain 5 days after the refund was made.

So I would suggest that your expectations are not in line with the real world.

 

[TheBrennands]

Much business experience, have we?

I have a fair bit yes

The 48 hour processing time Deniser operates (Tuesdays and Fridays, remember?) is significantly faster than the industry average, once you take into account how the large retailers operate.

It may well be faster than the industry average, I don't know what that is, but if you can excel at something and make yourself stand out from the crowd why on earth would you want to offer less? Competition between retailers is very stiff, and if a small change to your processes can put you above others, it would not make business sense to ignore that opportunity.

Some recent research was done (can't remember who is was, will find the article from the ERT magazine and post it on here when I get chance) and it showed that customers who have had a return issue with a retailer and had a really good experience dealing with that return are something like 5 times more likely to recommend you to others than customers who have bought from you and not had any problem. The other end of the scale is customers who have had a bad return experience will tell on average 6 of their friends and family about the experience.

Additionally, as has been stated several times, regardless of how much the customer may want to see the money back in their account, our banking system just doesn't work that way. When you make a refund to a Credit or Debit Card, it takes several days for this to appear on their statement. We've had customers complain 5 days after the refund was made.

Our payment processors take, on average 3 working days to fund the customers account. This means that the customer has to wait long enough just for the funds to clear through the banking system so retailers who don't process refunds immediately can (when taking weekends and bank holidays into account) substantially increase the length of time the customer has to wait for their money ..... so again, the speed at which refunds are processed is a really important factor and if a retailer can improve their turn around times, why wouldn't they?

So I would suggest that your expectations are not in line with the real world.

I don't see my expectations as unrealistic at all, but than again we are all entitled to our own opinions.

With many households finding finances tighter than ever, they may be dependant on that money getting back to them before they can go out and purchase a replacement for whatever they have returned.

Cathy

 

[sysops]

Cathy - what nonsense. It cannot make any material difference to the customer whether the return is processed the day it arrives or in another day's time.

 

[TheBrennands]

Cathy - what nonsense. It cannot make any material difference to the customer whether the return is processed the day it arrives or in another day's time.

The length of time it takes a retailer to process a refund adds to the time the refund takes to clear the banking system ..... eg

A return is received by us on Monday

If I process the refund on Monday, my customer will receive the funds on Thursday (3 days after we received the returned item)

If I process the refund on Tuesday, my customer will receive the funds on Friday (4 days after we received the returned item)

If I process the refund on Wednesday, my customer will receive the funds on the following Monday (7 days after we received the returned item)

Therefore delaying the processing of a refund can make a big difference!

Cathy

 

[sysops]

The length of time it takes a retailer to process a refund adds to the time the refund takes to clear the banking system ..... eg

A return is received by us on Monday

If I process the refund on Monday, my customer will receive the funds on Thursday (3 days after we received the returned item)

If I process the refund on Tuesday, my customer will receive the funds on Friday (4 days after we received the returned item)

If I process the refund on Wednesday, my customer will receive the funds on the following Monday (7 days after we received the returned item)

Therefore delaying the processing of a refund can make a big difference!

Cathy

Your 3 day rule comes from where exactly?

Regardless of how quickly your payment processor issues the refund to the cardholder's bank, the time it takes for this to appear on their account varies quite a bit between cards.

This means that some of your customers will see the refund after 3 days, some after 4 days, some after 6 days.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with batching returns. When you run a busy operation, processing returns on a Monday does not make any sense at all.

 

[TheBrennands]

Your 3 day rule comes from where exactly?

Regardless of how quickly your payment processor issues the refund to the cardholder's bank, the time it takes for this to appear on their account varies quite a bit between cards.

This means that some of your customers will see the refund after 3 days, some after 4 days, some after 6 days.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with batching returns. When you run a busy operation, processing returns on a Monday does not make any sense at all.

Well, take out the 3 days and replace it with 4, 5, 6 or whatever you want .... no matter which way you look at it every day that a retailer delays in processing a refund adds a day to the length of time the customer has to wait to receive their funds ..... simple really

You are entitled to your opinion about batch refunds and being too busy to process refunds on a Monday, and I am entitled to my opinion that to delay refunds is a mistake, to miss an opportunity to excel above the competition is a bigger mistake and to tell a customer who is returning something that priority is given to sales above returns is a sure fire way of really annoying them.

Cathy

 

[sysops]

Well, take out the 3 days and replace it with 4, 5, 6 or whatever you want .... no matter which way you look at it every day that a retailer delays in processing a refund adds a day to the length of time the customer has to wait to receive their funds ..... simple really

But since that period (4, 5 or 6 days) is inherently variable, and outside of your control, it makes no difference if an extra day is added to it, does it?

You are entitled to your opinion about batch refunds and being too busy to process refunds on a Monday, and I am entitled to my opinion that to delay refunds is a mistake, to miss an opportunity to excel above the competition is a bigger mistake and to tell a customer who is returning something that priority is given to sales above returns is a sure fire way of really annoying them.

Cathy

You're flat-out wrong.

Even if Deniser had processed this refund the minute the return was received, the customer would still have been annoyed because the money was not in her account straight away.

 

[AndyP]

I was very firm back - I had customers in the shop at the time and they were laughing........

I'm confused....weren't you, the other day, saying that you weren't a shop and that you didn't want callers? Seems to me that if you think of yourself as a shop then you can guarantee that your customers will too!

Just my take on "one" of your problems... LOL

 

[TheBrennands]

But since that period (4, 5 or 6 days) is inherently variable, and outside of your control, it makes no difference if an extra day is added to it, does it?

Of course it makes a difference, an extra day means the customer waits an extra day to receive their funds.

The time it takes for the bank clearing process to complete is outside the retailers control, but adding to that by taking longer than absolutely necessary to get that process started IS in the retailers control

You're flat-out wrong.

Even if Deniser had processed this refund the minute the return was received, the customer would still have been annoyed because the money was not in her account straight away.

Who knows whether that particular interaction could have been turned around and made positive, we don't have crystal balls and no one will ever know that.

There is however, an opportunity to learn from what has happened and change some things that could create a problem with other customers in the future.

Some customers will never be happy no matter what you do, but a lot of unhappy customers can be appeased by the way you handle the problem, even if you cannot meet what they want.

Cathy

 

[sysops]

Who knows whether that particular interaction could have been turned around and made positive, we don't have crystal balls and no one will ever know that.

There is however, an opportunity to learn from what has happened and change some things that could create a problem with other customers in the future.

Some customers will never be happy no matter what you do, but a lot of unhappy customers can be appeased by the way you handle the problem, even if you cannot meet what they want.

Cathy

If you tell a customer that their refund was processed within 48 hours of their return being received and they are unhappy with that, this is not a customer you can turn around.

I don't know whether you're naive or just arguing for the sake of it - if the latter, that's cool by me - I'll just go grab a beer and we can carry on.

 

[TheBrennands]

If you tell a customer that their refund was processed within 48 hours of their return being received and they are unhappy with that, this is not a customer you can turn around.

I don't know whether you're naive or just arguing for the sake of it - if the latter, that's cool by me - I'll just go grab a beer and we can carry on.

I think going and grabbing a beer is a good idea, as you seem to be making this personal with opinions on me as a person, and the bizarre notion that I am 'arguing' with you

I come on here to exchange my views with other business people ... to learn and try to help where I can offer some experience or knowledge

I have an opinion based on my experiences which I have expressed in a pleasant and respectful manner ... I am not sure how that would make me naive or why on earth you would want to start making personal comments, and that certainly doesn't mean I am joining you in an argument.

I think I will leave that as my last comment on this particular thread

Cathy

 

[MH1]

If a customer started shouting at myself over the phone I would mention I was happy to explain things when they called back and apologised, then I would hang up.

 

[deniser]

Wow, seems very high to me

Any reasons given for the returns?

This sounds about right for the product. We also deal with brides and believe me, everything has to be just right down to the shape, colour shade and size of the last pearl/diamante etc!

10% (our rate) is also very good in the clothing sector where people don't bother to take measurements before buying and can't touch the garment.

 

[MH1]

10% (our rate) is also very good in the clothing sector where people don't bother to take measurements before buying and can't touch the garment.

I hate returns, one reason I steer clear of clothing. Currently I have a returns rate of 0.11% over the last two years, so guess I am not doing too badly at present.

 

[deniser]

Hmmm, I hope I don't offend here, but my honest opinion is that while the customer is wrong to ring up shouting, your returns policy would make me pretty mad if I was a customer ......

You want customers to pay immediately when they place an order, and would not like it if customers were ordering and then saying 'well, I only pay for things twice a week so will do it on Friday' ..... returns should really be processed with the same speed that customers pay for their orders if you want to really give a good service.

I'm not sure why you would tell a customer you have 28 days by law to refund, as that would just get their back up, as would telling them that you give priority to sales rather than refunds ....... suggesting that once you have their money, any further service they receive will be a second rate one.

The way a business deals with returns and refunds can lose them a lot of business or gain them a lot of business ... it might be worth re-thinking your policy

As I said, no offence meant, I am just saying it how I see it

Cathy

Thank you for your reply; I appreciate your comments and don't take offence at all.

This is the first time that anyone has complained about our returns processing; obviously the bank's side of things is beyond our control and people accept that.

I agree with you that it would be better if we could process returns on the same day that we receive them but processing a return takes 5 times longer than processing a sale. It takes even longer if I do one individually; it is much faster if I do them in batches.

We lose money each time a customer returns something. Because I don't want to employ a staff member to process returns specifically (because this is not going to make me any money - and we are talking about ONE single complaint about returns processing time in tens of thousands of sales), we schedule the returns for the quieter times of the week. We get a lot of returns because we get a lot of sales. This is a fact of life when you sell clothing.

It is impossible for me to process any returns on Monday as this is by far our busiest day.

Our returns policy is probably the best out there. Officially 28 days on all items but in practice we take things back that have been bought as much as a year previously. We do free postage replacements and pay for the postage if parcels get returned when people fail to pick them up in time from the sorting office.

I thought our handling time was good but in the light of this thread I will see if I can improve on it.

PS. This customer was so rude that I wanted to wind her up - sorry, I don't do it often but I couldn't help myself on this occasion

 

[deniser]

I hate returns, one reason I steer clear of clothing. Currently I have a returns rate of 0.11% over the last two years, so guess I am not doing too badly at present.

I am very jealous!

 

[deniser]

I'm confused....weren't you, the other day, saying that you weren't a shop and that you didn't want callers? Seems to me that if you think of yourself as a shop then you can guarantee that your customers will too!

Just my take on "one" of your problems... LOL

You are absolutely right, LOL! It used to be a shop a couple of years ago but it is no longer a shop but I still call it the shop accidentally!

No it is most definitely not a shop but I do get the odd person with an appointment like today so when they're there it's like they're in the shop. I should say "in the warehouse"!

 

[Christiane]

Like Deniser, I'm the only one processing returns in the company and there's no way I would process one on Mondays unless it's urgent. It's too busy, I would be rushing and could make a mistake. I tend to process them about twice a week too, depending on how many I get a week. Some months like April are worse than others. I much prefer to do them in batches for the same reason as Deniser, cost.
Our returns rate is rather low, 1 to 2%. We get more exchange which take even longer to process.