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Why overtaxing the rich is wrong

Discussion in 'General Business Forum' started by Cornish Steve, Apr 21, 2011.

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  1. Cornish Steve

    Cornish Steve UKBF Newcomer Full Member

    14,858 2,117
    Here's an excellent video that explains why it's wrong to redistribute wealth by overtaxing the wealthy. Some college students started a petition to take grade points from students with the top 10% of grades and give those points to students with the worst grades. What do you think the response would be? "Wait a minute - I worked hard and sacrificed a lot for those grades!" QED

    Sorry for the fact that this video was made by someone making a political point. What matters more is the underlying principle: To spur entrepreneurial activity, we must give people a real incentive - and not threaten to steal what they earn. To allow someone to sacrifice their time and money, to forgo what others enjoy, and to assume a lot of risk, and then to steal the rewards of their efforts is just plain wrong.
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: Cornish Steve Member since: Jul 4, 2005
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  2. Eagle

    Eagle UKBF Legend Free Member

    5,382 598
    I couldn't agree with you more.
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: Eagle Member since: Oct 3, 2004
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  3. directmarketingadvice

    directmarketingadvice UKBF Legend Free Member

    10,942 3,530
    Sorry, but what an utterly stupid comparison.

    Steve
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: directmarketingadvice Member since: Aug 2, 2005
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  4. Eagle

    Eagle UKBF Legend Free Member

    5,382 598
    Why is it stupid, Steve? Please elaborate.
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: Eagle Member since: Oct 3, 2004
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  5. bdw

    bdw Banned

    6,568 1,269
    I see this as a stupid, amateurish video and while I could not make out much of what they were saying I got the gist. No one is stealing anything from anyone and this is just a load of nonsense IMO.

    Do you think the bank managers who are earning 30 or 40 times more than the PM should be allowed to keep it all? These are the people who are running the banks that are stifling entrepreneurial activity by refusing loans to small businesses and entrepreneurs. Why would giving the fat cats who run them a tax break help and do you honestly think that they earn these grossly inflated salaries?

    See! you've got me started. ;)
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2011
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: bdw Member since: Aug 13, 2008
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  6. directmarketingadvice

    directmarketingadvice UKBF Legend Free Member

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    Firstly, it's an absurd comparison. What's their next video, "Hey, dude! You have a girlfriend, do you think single students should get a go on her...?"

    No-one needs grades in order to have a roof over their heads or food on their table.

    Secondly, what a bunch of whiny, spoiled little b!tches US college students are... "Wait a minute - I worked hard and sacrificed a lot for those grades!".

    Really?

    If you'd grown up poor in some shithole housing project with rampant unemployment and drug/gang problems, you could have worked twice as hard and you still wouldn't even be at this college.

    And, if that was the case, I wonder what you'd think about the rich not contributing proportionately to society.

    Finally, the fact that privileged college students might not agree with wealth redistribution doesn't make it "wrong". It just means that many of those who have don't want to share.

    Steve
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2011
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: directmarketingadvice Member since: Aug 2, 2005
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  7. RedEvo

    RedEvo UKBF Legend Free Member

    6,007 1,533
    As tax is based on a %age why can't we just leave it at that? So long as people don't pay any tax until they reach a certain threshold I don't see the fairness of taxing people a higher %age because they earn more.

    The rich pay a shed load of indirect tax because of their conspicuous consumption.

    Although I see the obvious flaws in the video I am heartily sick and tired of the tax the rich rhetoric of the great unwashed.

    One thing the video does demonstrate is how when people are faced with something that affects them they back track. It's very easy to shout about bringing in measures that won't impact on you personally, but turkey's don't vote for Christmas.

    d
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: RedEvo Member since: May 12, 2007
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  8. cmcp

    cmcp UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    3,337 856
    I love that everyone's like "nah, that's not the same at all."
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: cmcp Member since: Jun 25, 2007
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  9. Guest

    0 0
    tax vat duty ext is all the same the one thing is the more you ask someone to pay the more they will find ways out of paying, 0ver 50% hand rolling tobacco smoked in the uk is now smuggled as the duty is so high crime gangs are importing the stuff by the truck load,now vat is 20% I have seen a large rise in the how much for cash brigade ,tax avoidance is huge world wide,I wonder what the income would be if we had a flat rate for all and lowered vat to 10% the same with duty ,its never going to hapen but I bet the figures would be supprising
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: Member since: Jan 1, 1970
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  10. bdw

    bdw Banned

    6,568 1,269
    Can you define the "great unwashed"?

    .
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: bdw Member since: Aug 13, 2008
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  11. Top Hat

    Top Hat UKBF Ace Free Member

    2,182 172
    If you want a civilized society, you need to collect taxes.

    As SteveG says the analogy is stupid.
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: Top Hat Member since: Mar 3, 2005
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  12. MikeJ

    MikeJ UKBF Big Shot Free Member

    5,679 1,632
    The video doesn't even support the argument.

    The argument is "don't over tax the rich".

    The video just goes on about taxing the rich. You're only over-taxing when the net revenue starts to decline.
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: MikeJ Member since: Jan 15, 2008
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  13. Dawg

    Dawg UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    10,900 3,466

    Enter the Laffer Curve.
    Basically as Mike says if you put up tax % too high the revenue declines: (0% tax and 100% tax will both produce no revenue, 0% as there is no tax, 100% as nobody will produce any income to be taxed.)
    Tax too high get less dosh, one way or another. Not ideology, simple economics.
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: Dawg Member since: Feb 12, 2006
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  14. RedEvo

    RedEvo UKBF Legend Free Member

    6,007 1,533
    Sure, people who don't even scratch the surface of the big debates preferring meaningless sound bites and unfounded 'facts'. We're in a mess of our own making and the great unwashed are in denial - which isn't a river in Egypt.

    d
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: RedEvo Member since: May 12, 2007
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  15. adventurelife

    adventurelife UKBF Ace Full Member

    2,040 620
    As I am a simple soul I always think things should be simple

    Up to £10k per year no tax above that

    Flat rate tax for all employees in UK 30% ( which includes NI)

    No other bands etc etc

    100% zero ways to avoid and massive penalties if caught doing so.

    My simple assumption would be the tax take would go up.

    Once you start taxing at 40% and 50% plus people just avoid in a big way and pay people to find ways of doing it.

    If you want people to start businesses and employee people and put there neck on the block you have to give them a break in the years, otherwise you stifle growth.

    Having said that I live in the real world and the above will never happen:( So those at the top will continue to find ways round it, those at the bottom will have more joining them and those in the middle will get squeezed till they squeak:eek:
     
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: adventurelife Member since: Dec 2, 2007
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  16. luvbusiness

    luvbusiness UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    270 42
    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2011
    Posted: Apr 21, 2011 By: luvbusiness Member since: Apr 22, 2010
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  17. hmmm

    hmmm UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    1,722 127
    steve i love the fact you have your own business and as ive said having your own business and doing well is a gift imo.
    the comparison doesnt really work if your honest .
    the reason being is that they havent contributed to the higher grades that the high graders got.so no i dont think the other students should get part of there grades.
    but i do feel if the NMW haters are not going to give to others for contributing to a business as without them there is no business then yes tax the lot of them... what is happening here is, the dislike by those being underpaid is no different to those that dislike paying higher taxes. maybe this is a better comparison
     
    Posted: Apr 22, 2011 By: hmmm Member since: Apr 14, 2011
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  18. bdw

    bdw Banned

    6,568 1,269
    Perhaps you would class me as one of the great unwashed but I am neither in this mess nor am I in denial and I did not contribute to it AFAIK.

    I am not saying that we don't have problems but there is nothing new in taking more of a tax contribution from those who can afford it. I have been in employment since 1964 and AFAIC recall it has always been that way. It's just the percentages that we are discussing here.

    I can understand the concerns of the "great unwashed" when they see how much people are getting paid at the top end of business. Paying £1.39 for a litre of petrol is more of a problem to the "great unwashed" than it is to the Fred Goodwins of this world. :mad:

    And yes, coming from my background I do have socialist leanings. ;)

    .
     
    Posted: Apr 22, 2011 By: bdw Member since: Aug 13, 2008
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  19. Lee Jones Jnr

    Lee Jones Jnr UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    3,751 736
    People moaning that life isn't fair and that people earning more are for some reason obliged to subsidise them.
     
    Posted: Apr 22, 2011 By: Lee Jones Jnr Member since: Dec 6, 2009
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  20. RedEvo

    RedEvo UKBF Legend Free Member

    6,007 1,533
    If you think these things through and consider everything in the round then you are not one of the 'great unwashed'. Unless you want to play your working class hero card.

    I've only been part of the workforce since 1980, unless you count my paper round in which case 1975. There have been various experiments in that time including tax rates as high as 90%. Personally I agree with Adventure Life on this issue.

    Putting energy into envying the super rich, the Fred Goodwins of this world, makes no sense to me. I hate the price of fuel and think it's a dreadful and lazy way of raising tax but I'm not sure where that fits into this discussion.


    Well being a working class lad and working in a shipyard gave me a healthy social conscience too and as I've demonstrated many times in this forum I believe in a fair and just society. But I've no idea where that fits into the argument. Does being a socialist mean you can't criticise the great unwashed, does it equate to nothing more than envying rich people? Not in my red book ;)

    d
     
    Posted: Apr 22, 2011 By: RedEvo Member since: May 12, 2007
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