Who could run with this?

Discussion in 'General Business Forum' started by Lucan Unlordly, Feb 16, 2021.

  1. Lucan Unlordly

    Lucan Unlordly UKBF Ace Free Member

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    A few years ago I secured and registered the name of a defunct vintage sports brand under headings for equipment and fashion. I know the heritage, liked the logo and saw it as the next 'Superdry'! Although the brand would most likely be unknown to anyone under 40 years of age it was once worn by many of the absolute crème de la crème of sporting greats, whilst another clothing product achieved a degree of status as a fashion item during the late 60's.

    I've made contact with or am friends with a number of people who could promote this project through social media, including a fashion designer/supplier to top end retailers across Europe, including Harrods, a current reality TV star, a one time top 50 entrant in GQ Magazines list of best dressed men and the worlds number one supermodel!

    I'm fully aware of the number of brands that fail having had tens of thousands put into them and recognise that this is very much a chicken or egg situation. I also recognise that it's not something I'm best placed to progress. I did have a couple of meetings with the UKs biggest sporting goods retailer which went to Director level but they buy brands, they don't create them. I also believe the fashion market to be a better option.

    Who could run with this?
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: Lucan Unlordly Member since: Feb 24, 2009
    #1
  2. The Byre

    The Byre UKBF Legend Full Member

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    Someone with a great deal of money and an already established position in the rag trade.

    Count your lucky stars and try to sell the brand to BooHoo or a similar outfit that is hunting for market share.

    Failing that, start small as an online outfit selling small numbers.
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: The Byre Member since: Aug 13, 2013
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  3. Darren_Ssc

    Darren_Ssc UKBF Ace Free Member

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    The company you met who only 'buy brands' have the right idea, even M&S have started to realise the benefits.
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: Darren_Ssc Member since: Mar 1, 2019
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  4. Lucan Unlordly

    Lucan Unlordly UKBF Ace Free Member

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    Amongst many hats I've worn, one is promotional t-shirt printer, but I feel this needs to be positioned higher up the pecking order, to be presented with the full back story of the brand and the historical users of the product. It's a marketeers dream but needs to hit the ground running.
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: Lucan Unlordly Member since: Feb 24, 2009
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  5. Chris Ashdown

    Chris Ashdown UKBF Legend Free Member

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    Are you 100% sure that you own the copyright to the logo and someone else does mot own the brand name
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: Chris Ashdown Member since: Dec 7, 2003
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  6. MikeHunter

    MikeHunter UKBF Contributor Full Member

    32 7
    That was my first question too. It's quite common that the brandname and any associated IP would be sold on when the original brand owner was liquidated. If you do indeed own the brand, you either need a lot of money to set up, or you could sell or franchise the brand if it has value. The sell or franchise route is probably the easiest way to make money, but you are likely to need specialist legal advice. If setting up yourself, you need a clear idea of what you're doing and how to go about it. I bought a business as a going concern - admittedly in a totally different industry, but it took a long time to establish our brand and an online presence. Another way to go is to sell through an online marketplace like Amazon but this has its own risks, and also has to be "right" for the brand.
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: MikeHunter Member since: May 8, 2006
    #6
  7. Mr D

    Mr D UKBF Legend Free Member

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    Franchise route may be problematic. Perhaps licence is appropriate?
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: Mr D Member since: Feb 12, 2017
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  8. JEREMY HAWKE

    JEREMY HAWKE UKBF Legend Full Member

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    It could work with a vintage sport style
    I would love to go in with you but it would be all heart and no strategy and we all know where that gets us :):)
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: JEREMY HAWKE Member since: Mar 4, 2008
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  9. BusterBloodvessel

    BusterBloodvessel UKBF Regular Free Member

    279 113
    When you say you "secured and registered the name".....did you acquire the rights to the original name and associated logo?

    Only.....It's not my area of expertise but these could be two very different things, couldn't they?
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: BusterBloodvessel Member since: Jan 22, 2018
    #9
  10. Lucan Unlordly

    Lucan Unlordly UKBF Ace Free Member

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    I researched the name and the history of the brand which ceased being used over 40 years ago in the 70's. The main company broke up in the early 50's with the rights to produce certain items transferring to companies that no longer exist. One company that is still trading does mention the historical use of the brand name for a few months shortly after acquiring machinery at that time, albeit for a product that is not in our chosen classes.
    I used a professional trade mark attorney to secure the trademark who recommended that the name be registered in the categories I was interested in, in preference to and prior to registering the logo.
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: Lucan Unlordly Member since: Feb 24, 2009
    #10
  11. Lucan Unlordly

    Lucan Unlordly UKBF Ace Free Member

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    In theory yes, in practice no. I've secured the name in 2 categories. By registering the name a global search takes place which gives a heads up to any possible objectors. This prevents anybody using the same name in our 2 chosen categories either in name or logo form.

    I've carried out significant research, trying to find a paper trail to any likely owners including telephoning and emailing the marketing directors of each, all who shrugged their shoulders and said ' I no nuffin!'
     
    Posted: Feb 16, 2021 By: Lucan Unlordly Member since: Feb 24, 2009
    #11
  12. obscure

    obscure UKBF Ace Free Member

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    You secured the trademark (easy to do as it had lapsed) but what about the copyright on the logo? Unlike Trademarks, Copyright doesn't lapse. In case of something created pre-1995 the copyright would last the lifetime of the author plus 50 years.
     
    Posted: Feb 17, 2021 By: obscure Member since: Jan 18, 2008
    #12
  13. Lucan Unlordly

    Lucan Unlordly UKBF Ace Free Member

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    The logo was created sometime between 84-184 years ago. It's last known use was around 53 years ago.
    I've tried numerous ways to find out as much information as I can but because of the timelines involved and because of the breakdown of the original company into parts can get no viable answers that anyone owns the copyright. In other words I've made all reasonable attempts to locate an owner.
    However....
    Does the individual who created the Logo retain the copyright, or the company he worked for?
    I'm leaning towards the company having ownership. If not then if the author created the logo at 17 years old when the brand was launched and died when he was 68 the plus 50 years is up in 2021! ;)
     
    Posted: Feb 17, 2021 By: Lucan Unlordly Member since: Feb 24, 2009
    #13
  14. Chris Ashdown

    Chris Ashdown UKBF Legend Free Member

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    Regardless of the copyright, if its that old is the brand likely to carry any sway on the younger generation say under 30's and how much money would it take to get known again against a modern name with no old connections
     
    Posted: Feb 17, 2021 By: Chris Ashdown Member since: Dec 7, 2003
    #14
  15. Lucan Unlordly

    Lucan Unlordly UKBF Ace Free Member

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    I think that's an unknown with any new brand,. Knowing how the successful one's get there is why I think this needs driving by somebody else with greater knowledge of fashion retail. Where to position it etc.,

    How much? Not a clue :)
     
    Posted: Feb 17, 2021 By: Lucan Unlordly Member since: Feb 24, 2009
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  16. JEREMY HAWKE

    JEREMY HAWKE UKBF Legend Full Member

    5,571 1,993
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2021
    Posted: Feb 18, 2021 By: JEREMY HAWKE Member since: Mar 4, 2008
    #16
  17. Lucan Unlordly

    Lucan Unlordly UKBF Ace Free Member

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    I'm aware of them and am thinking the same. The garments look to be good quality but I can't fathom out who or what their target market is? In some of the photos the models dressed in sweats, joggers and boots look like they are ready to 'ave it', yet look to be well over 30 years old? The amount of decoration on some of the shirts - and you'll have an opinion on this I think ;) - is not likely to appeal to an older generation, nor a young one?

    That leaves a very tight niche somewhere in the middle.
     
    Posted: Feb 19, 2021 By: Lucan Unlordly Member since: Feb 24, 2009
    #17
  18. JEREMY HAWKE

    JEREMY HAWKE UKBF Legend Full Member

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    Ha Ha their main model is Charlie Duffield the light heavy weight boxer based in Canning Town :)

    It makes me wonder too

    I have two navy ones one with the big logo and another with a smaller logo and I really like them

    It is a very strange concept based around London boxing history and the aim I think was to sell to those of us that follow the sport and have a soft spot for this history
    Another strategy appears to be getting noticed via fashion magazine write ups I feel that their target audience are men between the ages of 25 to 50 that have a bit of money in their pocket and like authentic quality things

    Now they are missing a massive trick ! :eek:
    Female boxing is taking off like a rocket especially in London from what I see on social media women are not just keen on boxing but they are taking notice of the history that gets tweeted by some the historic boxing accounts . ! To my knowledge they offer no ladies gear
     
    Posted: Feb 19, 2021 By: JEREMY HAWKE Member since: Mar 4, 2008
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  19. Lucan Unlordly

    Lucan Unlordly UKBF Ace Free Member

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    I think there are two reasons why the Female market hasn't been targeted. The standing joke in our house used to be that my wife and daughters had to go into town every Saturday to take back what they bought the week before! Transfer that principle to online shopping and ordering 2 sizes in 2 colourways and sending back the one's they don't want is considered normal! I'll stand corrected but I don't think us men are as bad?
    The second reason is that actual women's boxing isn't booming at all but women doing boxing training for fitness is. Some may be taking a greater interest in the history of the sport but I'd say very, very few.
     
    Posted: Feb 19, 2021 By: Lucan Unlordly Member since: Feb 24, 2009
    #19
  20. Mr D

    Mr D UKBF Legend Free Member

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    Sadly you are right regarding online shopping.
    Admittedly most of us don't buy 25 dresses and send back 24 - or buy a costume, wear it and send it back for full refund.
    But it happens.

    We did underwear for a time, stuff that isn't accepted back after wearing. And some tried it on even then.
    Lucky I have disposable gloves handy....
     
    Posted: Feb 19, 2021 By: Mr D Member since: Feb 12, 2017
    #20