Unreasonable employer - advice needed

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awkwardflower

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Feb 17, 2019
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Update: I did receive it and they still included their bloomin' "invoice me as a freelancer if you want your money immediately" in the agreement text ahahahaha! This is so crazy.

I requested an edit to this document, to detail what the money was for and that it excludes the sick pay. They will run it through their own PAYE. I don't care if they are not paying it, but I want the document to say that I didn't do anything wrong. I'm not sure how likely they will agree to it but this is just text, the sum is not changed. I also phoned ACAS that I sent this back to them so hopefully they will be quick. Do these things speed up in the last minute? I do hope we can reach an agreement tonight.
 
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awkwardflower

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Feb 17, 2019
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Update 2: I received the COT form and I signed and will post it to them before the end of this week. I accepted the sum of money they offered because missing out on the 2 weeks worth of SSP is less than £200 and my time spent with my loved ones and working for myself and at a new job is worth way more than that. I don't think they should be getting away with this, and it does feel unjust but this is the kind of treatment they subject anyone to, therefore it needn't be me to sacrifice time for righting their wrongs, I firmly believe Karma will sort it for them...

However, I did insist on including a sentence that this payment is for work only and some untaken holidays, and excludes sick pay for the rest of the month, so my time for them is covered at least.

Thanks for all your supportive and encouraging replies with this long saga, I really appreciate your answers. I will post an update if there is any problems, if they refuse to pay or something. Thanks again!
 
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awkwardflower

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Feb 17, 2019
40
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Question: what happens if they refuse to take the COT3 form? I have a feeling that they don't want to sign it. I haven't been in touch with them, but I sent them my two copies and the conciliator's letter, with first class & signed for. The tracking says the delivery was usuccessful and they weren't in and it's been sitting in their depot since Saturday. They haven't bothered to pick it up or rearrange delivery.

I was thinking of contacting them to let them know that I sent it to them, but I fear that they are aware of this (sometimes it's written on the card where it's coming from isn't it?). Am I being paranoid? Should I contact the conciliator?

From my understanding of the COT3 form, is that it is agreed regardless whether we signed it or not and if they breach it, it can be enforced somehow?

I am so sorry to continue this mess lol.
 
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Newchodge

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Nov 8, 2012
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Question: what happens if they refuse to take the COT3 form? I have a feeling that they don't want to sign it. I haven't been in touch with them, but I sent them my two copies and the conciliator's letter, with first class & signed for. The tracking says the delivery was usuccessful and they weren't in and it's been sitting in their depot since Saturday. They haven't bothered to pick it up or rearrange delivery.

I was thinking of contacting them to let them know that I sent it to them, but I fear that they are aware of this (sometimes it's written on the card where it's coming from isn't it?). Am I being paranoid? Should I contact the conciliator?

From my understanding of the COT3 form, is that it is agreed regardless whether we signed it or not and if they breach it, it can be enforced somehow?

I am so sorry to continue this mess lol.
You need to tell ACAS, as your ex employer agreed with ACAS that they would settle. They can find out if the other side is just still playing games and they can advise you on the next step.
 
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awkwardflower

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Feb 17, 2019
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So the ACAS advisor is on holiday until next Monday. I gave my ex-employers the benefit of doubt too and thought they might be away due to the holidays - when I enter the tracking number, I get the result that it is pending, and delivery was attempted more than a week ago but nothing happened since then, I guess it is up to them to collect now or rearrange delivery.

However I'm due to be paid tomorrow according to the settlement reached by ACAS and I'm 99% sure that they are refusing to receive the documents because they want to avoid paying. I didn't try the general ACAS line since I couldn't get through to the caseworker. I'm tempted to scan these documents and email them to the ex-employers-gone-rogue but on the other hand I really don't fancy contacting them directly again. If I email to ACAS instead, will someone else pick it up or does it have to be the one conciliator?

I read somewhere, probably the ACAS website that these COT3 agreements are legally binding from the date the agreement was reached, regardless of whether they are signed or not, is that true? And that they become enforceable through regular court action if they are not paid?
 
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Update: I did receive it and they still included their bloomin' "invoice me as a freelancer if you want your money immediately" in the agreement text ahahahaha! This is so crazy.


I requested an edit to this document, to detail what the money was for and that it excludes the sick pay.


Update 2: I received the COT form and I signed and will post it to them before the end of this week.



However, I did insist on including a sentence that this payment is for work only and some untaken holidays, and excludes sick pay for the rest of the month, so my time for them is covered at least.


The terms that both parties are seeking to include in the COT3 appear completely pointless – stubborn, pernickety points that you each want to say, but having no legal purpose or relevance at all.


And if @awkwardflower sought to insist on including a sentence after the terms were agreed, too late!




The COT3 is as legally binding & enforceable in the same way as an employment tribunal judgment. The fact both sides have agreed the terms, refusing to accept, or seeking to delay, delivery of a signed copy alters nothing: the agreement is legally binding, and the terms therein apply – including the liability for payment today. If overdue, tomorrow it becomes enforceable by alternative means – and that includes HCEOs.


ACAS can be of no help in getting payment enforced. They may (if their limited time permits) call the employer to encourage payment, but they cannot do anything more, apart from advise that the enforcement of the agreement is outside their role.



Karl Limpert
 
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awkwardflower

Free Member
Feb 17, 2019
40
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Thanks for your reply. You slightly misunderstood: I insisted on adding the little pernickety sentence before agreeing to the terms, not afterwards. It was with my last little addition that we agreed to, and while I'm fully aware that it doesn't mean anything, it is nice to have it written down in diplomatic language that my employer is a bully and have them sign it. It's a little satisfaction after months of stress and unlawfully withheld wages.

More importantly though, I called ACAS today who called the employer who apparently "did not realise" they had to sign the document, and PAID me today woooohoo :D It was very close to the gross amount and was very little deducted from it. I don't have to pay further tax or do anything else with it, do I? That's it, is it? I almost can't believe it..... Thank you soooooo much all of you for all your helpful advices. :D
 
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It was very close to the gross amount and was very little deducted from it. I don't have to pay further tax or do anything else with it, do I?

Unless we're discussing a settlement of more than £30,000, and unless there's been a change in the law that's come into force (I know there was one being discussed, but if it's happened, I didn't notice), there should have been no deductions at all! As a settlement, this should have been tax free, the full gross amount - with no later liability to tax either.


Well done though @awkwardflower for handling this alone, sticking with it, and getting (nearly) all you're entitled to.


Karl Limpert
 
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