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The Smoking Ban

Discussion in 'General Business Forum' started by lightload, Jun 21, 2007.

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  1. Dawg

    Dawg UKBF Newcomer Free Member

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    Comspec:
    A lot of the money spent like this, (spent from the NHS budget), is preventative medicine, and an efficient use of resources.
    One of the aims of the NHS when it was established was the promotion of preventative medicine which is a better route to general health care than continual firefighting.
    The ban then, to stay on thread, serves the purposes of preventing workers from passive smoking and encouraging smokers to stop. It's not a control, rights or freedom issue.

    I await Steve to scalpel this attitude on the bloody altar of liberterianism.:)
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: Dawg Member since: Feb 12, 2006
  2. Cornish Steve

    Cornish Steve UKBF Newcomer Full Member

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    Most definitely, I agree with preventative medicine and with education. Also, I have no problem with sin taxes, if you will, that cover the cost of treatment needed for participating in such activities. For the record, that wouldn't include chocolate!

    My issue is against the government forcing it's "nanny knows best" ideology on citizens - especially when members of government don't live up to their own dictates. Within reason, we should have the freedom to decide what we do, how we live, how we spend our money, and so on. The government represents us; it doesn't control us.
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: Cornish Steve Member since: Jul 4, 2005
  3. KM-Tiger

    KM-Tiger UKBF Legend Full Member - Verified Business

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    Yes that was very well put. Very well put indeed.

    It's exactly how most smokers feel about the ban in private, as distinct from public, places.
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: KM-Tiger Member since: Aug 10, 2003
  4. sirearl

    sirearl UKBF Legend Free Member

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    well not sure on that.

    I doubt if any one agrees with parking fines but we all pay them.

    I would guess there are a lot of laws that don't make sense but people obey them:)

    Earl
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: sirearl Member since: Apr 23, 2007
  5. Matt1959

    Matt1959 UKBF Legend Free Member

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    digressing a bit here, but I couldnt believe my ears today when I listened to a radio ad specifically warning people not to discard cigarette buts and warning of the fine involved should people be caught doing this. Good to see the powers that be have their priorities right:eek:
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: Matt1959 Member since: Sep 8, 2006
  6. Comspec

    Comspec UKBF Newcomer Full Member - Verified Business

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    I agree that parking laws are a bit annoying, but they are also there for a reason and as such, I do obey them (when I can).

    When I say 'not making sense', then I am talking about things that are just too silly for me to even consider, like the couple of examples I gave re chocolate and alcohol.

    If I can justify a law to myself, then I will obey it. If I cannot figure out what it is all about, or if I think government is taking something away from me that I am not prepared to give - then I am going to suit myself.

    The Smoking ban is a prime example - some people think it is hurting our civil liberties and there are examples of people who are openly breaking this law. Myself, I can see its purpose and I happily smoke outside.
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: Comspec Member since: May 8, 2006
  7. KM-Tiger

    KM-Tiger UKBF Legend Full Member - Verified Business

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    No, I think that's right. Smokers shouldn't discard cigarette ends here there and everywhere. It's as bad as other forms of litter.

    The practical problem for people that do smoke is the lack of bins and ashtrays. But Tesco come to the rescue! You can now buy pocket ashtrays. I've always got one in my pocket.
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: KM-Tiger Member since: Aug 10, 2003
  8. Matt1959

    Matt1959 UKBF Legend Free Member

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    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: Matt1959 Member since: Sep 8, 2006
  9. Cornish Steve

    Cornish Steve UKBF Newcomer Full Member

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    If a ban on alcohol is silly, then a ban on smoking is silly. What's your definition of 'silly'?
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: Cornish Steve Member since: Jul 4, 2005
  10. Comspec

    Comspec UKBF Newcomer Full Member - Verified Business

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    A ban on alcohol has no real foundation. It is taking away my liberty to enjoy drink as responsibly as I want to. It would be impractical to police and numerous people would flout it. Look at prohibition in the USA - it lead to more problems than it solved. A ban or rationing of chocolate bars just because someone tells me they are bad for me is not enough to make me want to adhere to the law either. I will decide what I put into my body and tough on whether or not I am actually 'allowed' to.

    A ban on smoking in public places has actually been imposed and I agree with it because its total reason is to give non-smokers their basic rights. I have no 'right' to smoke anywhere that causes others to breathe in my smoke. I can accept that.

    Using both of the above then - I will adhere to the smoking ban and do so happily. I will not be told, though, that I cannot have a drink when I want to.

    'Silly' was a bad choice of word I will agree though. :)
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: Comspec Member since: May 8, 2006
  11. Cornish Steve

    Cornish Steve UKBF Newcomer Full Member

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    And a ban on smoking in a private club is not?

    Why is it any different for people smoking in a private club?

    The smokers' argument to a tee.

    Nope. I think you chose a very appropriate word.
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: Cornish Steve Member since: Jul 4, 2005
  12. Comspec

    Comspec UKBF Newcomer Full Member - Verified Business

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    I do agree with you about the 'private club' issue. It isn't something that really affects me, as I do not have membership of any. I am assuming that they thought it would be too difficult to have exceptions, therefore they gave none. I don't see the harm in allowing private clubs to have a smoking section, providing the employees actually have a say in it. It is there to protect the employees more so than the members.

    'The smokers' argument to a tee.'

    This is kind of taking my comment out of context, but it probably is the standard smokers argument as you say. In fact, I think you are arguing against the law on smoking moreso than me and I am a smoker.

    I think the whole law itself will probably be amended over time, but I think it is an extremely difficult one because some people feel very strongly about it. The government done what they could and I agree it is not perfect - but it is a good start.

    You do like to take things apart and analyse them Steve - is that the engineer coming out in you? ;) :)
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: Comspec Member since: May 8, 2006
  13. Cornish Steve

    Cornish Steve UKBF Newcomer Full Member

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    I take that as a compliment - thank you. :)

    I can be an awkward so-and-so, I know, and I apologise for that; however, I can't help but look for general principles behind policies that affect our behaviours. In this case, there are conflicting principles, so it's not cut and dried. Personally, I err on the side of individual liberty rather than corporate good, even though the actions of some individuals (such as those who blow smoke in our faces or throw up in the street after heavy drinking) certainly do irritate.
     
    Posted: Jul 13, 2007 By: Cornish Steve Member since: Jul 4, 2005
  14. iklelamb

    iklelamb UKBF Newcomer Free Member

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    I was all for the smoking ban, however now it forces people outside of pubs it makes areas and neighbourhoods look much more rough and dodgy, why can't all pubs have the smoking areas to the rear? Would others agree?
     
    Posted: Dec 20, 2010 By: iklelamb Member since: Dec 12, 2010
  15. DotNetWebs

    DotNetWebs UKBF Legend Full Member

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    Bizarre bump - it doesn't have anything to do with the link in you sig by any chance (or should that be cig) ;)

    Regards

    Dotty
     
    Posted: Dec 20, 2010 By: DotNetWebs Member since: Feb 16, 2005
  16. movietub

    movietub UKBF Big Shot Free Member

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    Probably because most pubs don't have a rear space :|

    There will be arguments about this one forever - obviously letting pubs choose what they did would have been an easier idea. Even if they were only allowed smokers indoors if they fitted air scrubbers - that would have addressed all health concerns, kept the punters in the pub and solved the problem of the smoke haze in front of the door that now elcomes all non smokers as they arrive.
     
    Posted: Dec 20, 2010 By: movietub Member since: Nov 6, 2008
  17. BenP

    BenP UKBF Newcomer Free Member

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    There is a simple solution to the problem.

    Electronic cigarette's
     
    Posted: Dec 21, 2010 By: BenP Member since: Sep 23, 2010
  18. anderson

    anderson UKBF Newcomer Free Member

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    According to me it is a good decision as it is harmful to health.
     
    Posted: Dec 21, 2010 By: anderson Member since: Aug 10, 2010
  19. movietub

    movietub UKBF Big Shot Free Member

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    From the non smoking publics point of view it isn't harmful if air scrubbers are fitted.

    From the smokers point of view it is less healthy to stand outside in the winter.

    It's quite hypocritical of the Government to ban it on health issues, but still make it legal to smoke and collect a huge amount of tax. If they were worried about the health of the smokers concerned, they would ban cigarettes full stop. I smoke, and I wish they would!

    That way we could all run round moaning for a maximum of two weeks and then we wouldn't care anymore.
     
    Posted: Dec 21, 2010 By: movietub Member since: Nov 6, 2008
  20. katy25

    katy25 UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    17 4
    Anyway it's healthier to ban smoking in pubs. I hate that you clothes smells like an ashtray after sitting in the bar. If it's less healthy to stand outside in the winter and smoke then you (smokers) will smoke less. As a consequence that would be better for smokers.
     
    Posted: Dec 21, 2010 By: katy25 Member since: Dec 8, 2010
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