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Taking PayPal to court (help please)

Discussion in 'General Business Forum' started by hopitt, Aug 14, 2020.

  1. MY OFFICE IN CHINA

    MY OFFICE IN CHINA UKBF Legend Full Member

    5,605 1,317
    You're upset.

    But, you have no legal case.

    Drop it and move on.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:15 PM By: MY OFFICE IN CHINA Member since: Nov 16, 2011
    #81
  2. consultant

    consultant Your Business Community Staff Member

    5,664 797
    Are you sure?

    You have come to somewhere where experienced people are giving you their thoughts and advice for free and you do not like what they are saying. If you want proper, qualified advice, use a solicitor. you will then see that they will agree with what you are saying, probably lose the case and charge you for the pleasure!
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:23 PM By: consultant Member since: Jan 21, 2008
    #82
  3. hopitt

    hopitt UKBF Contributor Free Member

    30 0
    No, I don't like the way in which the message is being conveyed.

    If you can't educate someone without being overly pretentious and patronising perhaps you shouldn't bother educsting/helping at all.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:26 PM By: hopitt Member since: Aug 14, 2020
    #83
  4. hopitt

    hopitt UKBF Contributor Free Member

    30 0
    Is there not a way I can just simply agree to settle the case before the hearing?
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:27 PM By: hopitt Member since: Aug 14, 2020
    #84
  5. LanceUk

    LanceUk UKBF Regular Free Member

    110 36
    I haven't read PayPal's T&Cs and I am not about to.. However, why are they unlawfully withholding your money? Do the T&Cs state the reasons that they will withhold your money or is it entirely at their discretion (or some other term). It sounds like you are representing yourself, so you are going to have to justify, by reference to the T&Cs why they are withholding your money unlawfully (in breach of the T&Cs).

    PayPal are contesting that the court do not have jurisdction to hear the case, presumably in the basis that the contract is concluded in Luxembourg (or wherever they are based) and there is nothing in the T&Cs that give explicity jurisdiction to the courts of England and Wales. However, from memory, this is a consumer contract (as you weren't selling as a power/professional seller), so, given it is an EU contract, the courts may assume jurisdiction.. however, I have no idea on this and you will have to look it up. Otherwise, you are going to have to understand why they are contesting jurisdiction and, if the courts will hear your side of the story (not even a given), you will have your reasons why.

    Note, this is not a defence or a counterclaim (why would they counterclaim as you have not caused them loss?). If you lose,, they then may seek to have their costs paid for by you (not sure this applies to the County Court, though).. You mention small claims - I am assuming County Court.

    Best of luck - I think you're going to need it (unless the court has jurisdiction and you can, as the complainant, assert why them witholding your money breaches the contract or potentially manifestly unfair).

    You can cancel proceedings at any time (in response to your previous question): https://www.moneyclaimsuk.co.uk/cre...-and-answers/how-do-I-stop-a-court-claim.aspx
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:32 PM By: LanceUk Member since: Jan 8, 2018
    #85
  6. LanceUk

    LanceUk UKBF Regular Free Member

    110 36
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:33 PM By: LanceUk Member since: Jan 8, 2018
    #86
  7. hopitt

    hopitt UKBF Contributor Free Member

    30 0

    I did try mediation, after explaining my case to them they said it would be a wasted effort trying to mediate and actually advised me to go down the small claims route.

    Will look into cancelling the claim and just waiting for the automatic release of funds.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:41 PM By: hopitt Member since: Aug 14, 2020
    #87
  8. fisicx

    fisicx It's Major Clanger! Staff Member

    33,307 9,850
    You could still end up having to pay their legal bill.

    This case was never going to win. They even told you the papers were presented to the wrong place.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:49 PM By: fisicx Member since: Sep 12, 2006
    #88
  9. hopitt

    hopitt UKBF Contributor Free Member

    30 0
    I was only informed of this after making the claim. As I say I've got tons of correspondence from PayPal of me asking which address to serve legal papers to and them being purposefully obtuse.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:51 PM By: hopitt Member since: Aug 14, 2020
    #89
  10. hopitt

    hopitt UKBF Contributor Free Member

    30 0
    @LanceUk and you're correct, it is a county court.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:56 PM By: hopitt Member since: Aug 14, 2020
    #90
  11. NickGrogan

    NickGrogan UKBF Ace Full Member

    2,515 598
    Are you taking them to court because you can't find the right address? No. You want them to pay money that you think they are withholding illegally.

    They're not withholding it illegally, therefore a court may consider the claim unreasonable.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:57 PM By: NickGrogan Member since: Nov 15, 2012
    #91
  12. NickGrogan

    NickGrogan UKBF Ace Full Member

    2,515 598
    Unlikely. In PayPal's view you don't have a case, so nothing to settle. The only settlement they'll be likely to accept is you dropping the case - which you can do without talking to them.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 2:59 PM By: NickGrogan Member since: Nov 15, 2012
    #92
  13. hopitt

    hopitt UKBF Contributor Free Member

    30 0
    But what legal basis do they have to hold funds?

    It's an aged PayPal account that's only ever been used for purchases.

    I sell one item (gaming laptop) on ebay, buyer received within a few days of purchase, ebay release the funds early.

    PayPal ask me to supply proof of ID and proof of purchase of the item sold, all this was provided and accepted by PayPal.

    I try to then withdraw my funds and my account is limited automatically. I then receive an email 2 days later stating they've decided to permanently close my account.

    If they had evidence to suggest they should keep my funds for money laundering, they'll need to supply that to the judge will they not? As that is the only lawful reason they could be holding my funds?
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 3:01 PM By: hopitt Member since: Aug 14, 2020
    #93
  14. fisicx

    fisicx It's Major Clanger! Staff Member

    33,307 9,850
    Were they?

    The address is clearly stated on the website.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 3:04 PM By: fisicx Member since: Sep 12, 2006
    #94
  15. hopitt

    hopitt UKBF Contributor Free Member

    30 0
    They're assuming I'm savvy enough to find it? If I'm directly asking them where I serve legal papers to and they're effectively refusing to give me any address how is that not being obtuse?

    Wouldn't the expected and appropriate response be something along the lines of

    "you can find all legal information and how and where to serve court documents to on our information page here.."

    Instead I got automated responses (signed by a different rep each time) about how they were not willing to look into my account being unrestricted.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 3:06 PM By: hopitt Member since: Aug 14, 2020
    #95
  16. fisicx

    fisicx It's Major Clanger! Staff Member

    33,307 9,850
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 3:13 PM By: fisicx Member since: Sep 12, 2006
    #96
  17. NickGrogan

    NickGrogan UKBF Ace Full Member

    2,515 598
    What has money laundering got to do with anything? Have you read PayPal's terms at all???
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 3:16 PM By: NickGrogan Member since: Nov 15, 2012
    #97
  18. hopitt

    hopitt UKBF Contributor Free Member

    30 0

    All you're proving is you're more savvy than I... If I'm asking the company directly for their legal address they should be giving me it...
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 3:17 PM By: hopitt Member since: Aug 14, 2020
    #98
  19. NickGrogan

    NickGrogan UKBF Ace Full Member

    2,515 598
    You can contact us by:

    • Writing to us by post at our head office: PayPal (Europe) S.à r.l. et Cie, S.C.A. Attention: Legal Department, 22-24 Boulevard Royal, 2449 Luxembourg, Luxembourg; or
    • Visiting our Contact Us page where you can:
      • Click the "Email Us" link to contact us online.
      • Click the “Call Us” link for our telephone number if you want to call us.
    You must send legal notices in connection with this user agreement to us by postal mail.

    If you're not savvy enough to find the address, then it's reasonable to withhold your money.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 3:17 PM By: NickGrogan Member since: Nov 15, 2012
    #99
  20. hopitt

    hopitt UKBF Contributor Free Member

    30 0
    Quite a ridiculous stance, if I'm asking them directly for the address and they do not give it, its being obtuse and obstructive.
     
    Posted: Sep 16, 2020 at 3:19 PM By: hopitt Member since: Aug 14, 2020