Should the rules on UKBF be relaxed a bit?

Discussion in 'Feedback & Help' started by UKSBD, Nov 16, 2019.

  1. UKSBD

    UKSBD Not a real duck Staff Member

    9,965 1,943
    Posting as a long term user here rather than as a Mod and would like users opinions rather than SIFTS or mods.

    The forums are nowhere near as busy as they used to be, a lot is obviously down to more competition from social networks like facebook, etc. so is it time some of the rules about self promotion were relaxed a little?

    I needed a local electrician to change a light in my bathroom, went on to our local facebook community page and asked for recommendations. and within minutes recommendations were coming through, 2 or 3 from the electricians themselves, I contacted one and got the job done the next day, it was brilliant and you can see why Google results are nowhere near as valuable as they were.

    The thing is, if anyone asks for recommendations on UKBF, self promotion is frowned upon.

    If someone asks about a product I supply, I would feel awkward about replying - that can't be right!

    Do others feel the self promotion rules should be relaxed a little?

    Provided people just said things like "we can help with that, get in touch" and didn't write a lot of spiel and links to their sites, should it be OK to mildly self promote in this way when people ask for recommendations?

    I, as a mod, often delete posts which I don't really want to.
    The problem being, if I delete some and not other, people naturally say "why can he do it and not me?"
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: UKSBD Member since: Dec 30, 2005
    #1
  2. Ian J

    Ian J Factoring Specialist Full Member - Verified Business

    5,957 1,906
    If you relax the rules too much you will just get loads of spammers joining up.

    There is just one rule that I think is relaxable and that is:-

    "DON'T pitch your own business when people ask for recommendations. The poster is after services that members have used and can vouch for - not a sales pitch

    I don't see any reason why if someone asks for an electrician that a forum member can't reply saying "I'm an electrician and could do that for you" or something similar.

    That isn't really self promotion as it's just answering a question that has been asked and there have been a number of times when someone has asked a question about factoring that I've answered by suggesting that they contact me and I can arrange something. I'm not one of those people that check their past posts to see if they have been edited or deleted so if you have been deleting them then you have been doing a great disservice to the forum members

    At the moment I wouldn't mind betting that if someone asks a question like that they are probably flooded with PMs anyway which defeats the object of the rule.
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: Ian J Member since: Nov 6, 2004
    #2
  3. KM-Tiger

    KM-Tiger UKBF Legend Full Member - Verified Business

    9,969 2,656
    Yes, agree with that. It's more answering the question than self promotion.

    But definitely don't go too far with relaxation or we will get too many spam adverts. It will be more activity but not anything that anyone wants.
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: KM-Tiger Member since: Aug 10, 2003
    #3
  4. UKSBD

    UKSBD Not a real duck Staff Member

    9,965 1,943
    Yes, that's the main rule I was talking about, plus there's also the bit about not being allowed to ask for PMs

    I think as long as people aren't posting links or being salesy it shouldn't be a big deal if people say they do things when people ask about them and that they can be PM'd
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: UKSBD Member since: Dec 30, 2005
    #4
  5. UKSBD

    UKSBD Not a real duck Staff Member

    9,965 1,943
    Yes, blatant ads, link drops, sales spiel etc. shouldn't be allowed.

    The trouble is, when it's borderline you then get people moaning about it being OK for one and not the other - The mods can't win then
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: UKSBD Member since: Dec 30, 2005
    #5
  6. gpietersz

    gpietersz UKBF Enthusiast Full Member

    882 193
    We already have people asking questions just so someone can give the right answer.

    We already have a directory.

    I think the best way to find someone who provides a service you want here is to look through the relevant forums for someone who has given intelligent answers to related questions.
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: gpietersz Member since: Sep 10, 2019
    #6
  7. UKSBD

    UKSBD Not a real duck Staff Member

    9,965 1,943
    Nor do I, but trust me some people would report it.

    Then, when they go and do something similar but just over the borderline of being spammy, moan that theirs was deleted and the other wasn't :(
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: UKSBD Member since: Dec 30, 2005
    #7
  8. gpietersz

    gpietersz UKBF Enthusiast Full Member

    882 193
    How big are the forums? Number of members etc.
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: gpietersz Member since: Sep 10, 2019
    #8
  9. UKSBD

    UKSBD Not a real duck Staff Member

    9,965 1,943
    Judging by the members list there are close to 260,000, very few are active

    I would say it's a good 90% less active than it was in it's heydays
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: UKSBD Member since: Dec 30, 2005
    #9
  10. KAC

    KAC UKBF Ace Free Member

    1,156 260
    If you reply to a questions "How do I do ... ... ? with "PM me and I will tell you" it is of no use to other members on the forum. Saying "This how you do it and by the way I can help you" is of use to anyone reading the question. A prime example are responses by @The Resolver which are both informative and offering a service
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: KAC Member since: May 7, 2017
    #10
  11. paulears

    paulears UKBF Big Shot Full Member

    4,283 1,102
    Another forum I use frowns on people advertising services but is fine with people asking for help getting it. So somebody asking for a plumber in Basildon gets a response from any member and that’s fine. There, it’s not ok to start a new topic saying you are a good plumber in the Basildon area nor is it ok, yet happens often, to post as a response “acme electricians are really good, here’s their details” when the person happens to work at or is acme electricians! Pretending to be a satisfied customer is common and annoying.
     
    Posted: Nov 16, 2019 By: paulears Member since: Jan 7, 2015
    #11
  12. Ian J

    Ian J Factoring Specialist Full Member - Verified Business

    5,957 1,906
    To be honest I thought that's how it worked on UKBF and there is one particular person who does it all the time
     
    Posted: Nov 17, 2019 By: Ian J Member since: Nov 6, 2004
    #12
  13. gpietersz

    gpietersz UKBF Enthusiast Full Member

    882 193
    I assume moderators use their discretion if its not really spammy.

    I do not think this is the problem with the forum. I think the treatment of naive questions, especially from new members, can be very off-putting. Yes, its important to be frank and honest and tell people things they may not want to hear, but it can be done more politely. We are all idiots sometimes.

    The other things that annoys me is that threads go wildly off topic. The other forum I use a lot deals with this by allowing moderators to cut off topic comments into a new thread. Works very well.
     
    Posted: Nov 17, 2019 By: gpietersz Member since: Sep 10, 2019
    #13
  14. JEREMY HAWKE

    JEREMY HAWKE UKBF Legend Full Member

    4,933 1,645
    You should be able to self promote if your a full member
    Maybe relax the rules and run that trial for six months then revert back to where we are now when the online punch ups get boring :confused::confused::cool:
     
    Posted: Nov 17, 2019 By: JEREMY HAWKE Member since: Mar 4, 2008
    #14
  15. Chris Ashdown

    Chris Ashdown UKBF Legend Free Member

    11,477 2,366
    Not quite on subject, but i feel there are two reasons for the fall in members using the forum

    Brexit post has alienated people with so many one sided views each slagging off the other point of view, all brexit discussions have had their day and all posts removed and let get back to business

    There does not seem to be much education available to new users, People are forced to ask basic questions and these are repeated every few days, I would like to see a well written articles on running a new business that explains the basic information on say, VAT registration, Business plans writing, Directors duties, Shareholders powers, Selling a company, Therefore enabling new users to get some basic information as in a library rather than asking for posts
     
    Posted: Nov 17, 2019 By: Chris Ashdown Member since: Dec 7, 2003
    #15
  16. Ian J

    Ian J Factoring Specialist Full Member - Verified Business

    5,957 1,906
    I'm not sure that I agree with that as it's just one thread and easily avoided. I don't bother with the thread as it has a regular contributor whom I don't like but it doesn't stop me looking at the rest of the forum.

    I also agree with gpietersz that the treatment of noobs asking what many consider to be daft questions is probably putting off other noobs from asking questions. If only people would just ignore questions that they didn't wish to answer rather than posting a sarcastic response this forum would be a far friendlier place
     
    Posted: Nov 17, 2019 By: Ian J Member since: Nov 6, 2004
    #16
  17. gpietersz

    gpietersz UKBF Enthusiast Full Member

    882 193
    I agree with the comment about the Brexit post. Its better to avoid contentious topics.

    On a forum that bans such topics it was only when someone told another poster that a possible (I doubt it myself) motive for attacks on her site were her views, and at that point I had a look and found she had really repugnant, bigoted views.
     
    Posted: Nov 17, 2019 By: gpietersz Member since: Sep 10, 2019
    #17
  18. JEREMY HAWKE

    JEREMY HAWKE UKBF Legend Full Member

    4,933 1,645
    I avoid the Brexit thread but could talk to you all day long about it in the pub
    This thread should be pulled and politics should be avoided

    Maybe we should all be more tolerant to the basic questions I am one of the least patient
    I come in from a few problems driver held up ,new clutch,required ,Costomer refusing delivery ect ect

    I log onto my favourite site and someone is asking how they can start a company with no money and a zero credit rating .Pefect storm :) and I know everyone else is exactly the same
     
    Posted: Nov 17, 2019 By: JEREMY HAWKE Member since: Mar 4, 2008
    #18
  19. UKSBD

    UKSBD Not a real duck Staff Member

    9,965 1,943
    It's when posts get reported that it's more of a problem.

    When a borderline post gets reported but the moderator thinks it's OK, the person doing the reporting thinks there is one rule for them and one for others.
     
    Posted: Nov 17, 2019 By: UKSBD Member since: Dec 30, 2005
    #19
  20. Gordon - Commercial Finance

    Gordon - Commercial Finance UKBF Ace Free Member

    2,291 735
    I personally really like the balance on this forum. It can be a bit harsh on new people, but if you look at that in context, the regulars here are often way kinder than on other forums.

    I’ve just recently left another forum I was fairly active on, because the regulars on there were just plain nasty. We’re actually doing not bad on UKBF at being more welcoming and kind than elsewhere on the internet (have you seen Twitter??). Often it gets out of hand but I think that’s usually because the people can see through the newbies who are just chancers and are at it. They’re usually asking how to invest their £10,000 or their £50,000, or asking for someone to invest in their new property development venture because they are skint, or maybe they’re kidding on they’re buying a Ferrari or other super cars.

    As far as the Brexit thread goes - I’ve never been involved in it and most likely never will. As soon as I saw it I suspected it would be pages of people discussing their opinions, which is a massive waste of time on a forum where no one is going to change their minds.

    When it comes to self promotion, I like the idea that people have to put the work in and become known around these parts for a particular reason, and then they will be promoted by other users when a relevant question is asked. @tony84 is a great example of this. He hasn’t ever needed to self promote in any of the time I’ve been around and people still tag him in things regularly where his skills are applicable.

    If relaxing the rules opens the door to more spam and rubbish than we get already, then I think that’s too high a price to pay for some extra activity. This is an amazing community (usually) and it can continue to work as such, where the people who could be promoting themselves are respected enough that they don’t have to, and we can all help each other out like a community should.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2019
    Posted: Nov 17, 2019 By: Gordon - Commercial Finance Member since: Jun 26, 2017
    #20